I wasn't aware. Which ones? I  seem to recall these
were in the beta release notes already:

        pan2: Corrected so it agrees with documentation
        hilbert had its outputs reversed, now correct.
         works again according to the manual.
        Fixes in the { and } score looping statements.

Besides, bug fixes should have waited for 5.09, really, as
the beta was there for package and binary testing.
The CsoundAC changes should not really have been made,
as there should not have been this type of change between
beta and full release.

And if you want my opinion, releasing a beta was a waste of time,
as the full release seems to still have problems, just as much as
before.

Victor

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Anthony Kozar" 
To: "Developer discussions" 
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 4:24 AM
Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] sourceforge Downloads info


> There were several bug fixes in between the beta and the final releases.
> Some of them might be considered significant.
>
> Anthony
>
> On Wed, March 19, 2008 9:51 pm, Felipe Sateler wrote:
>
>> On Wednesday 19 March 2008 22:35:45 victor wrote:
>>> They are not betas, but full releases. Since I am away from
>>> work, I cannot build new packages, so I just renamed the
>>> old ones, which were OK anyway. They might carry the library
>>> beta string message, but otherwise are undistinguishable from
>>> the non-beta 5.08. I might build new packages to comply
>>> later. For now, they should be fine.
>>
>> It is not the same. At least, the csoundac library is no longer shared. I
>> don't know if it is used in the OSX installers, but it's certainly not
>> exactly the same as the betas.
>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
> Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
> http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
> _______________________________________________
> Csound-devel mailing list
> Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel 


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
_______________________________________________
Csound-devel mailing list
Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net

I thought that bug fixes were OK in between the beta and the release,
whether they were packaging bugs or code bugs.  I apologize if I was
mistaken.  But among other fixes, I did not want to answer a million posts
on the other mailing list about the spurious "missing end tag "
message that I had introduced.  And Michael's bug fix for deallocating
widget globals seemed urgent as well.

Anthony

victor wrote on 3/20/08 3:48 AM:

> I wasn't aware. Which ones? I  seem to recall these
> were in the beta release notes already:
> 
> pan2: Corrected so it agrees with documentation
> hilbert had its outputs reversed, now correct.
>  works again according to the manual.
> Fixes in the { and } score looping statements.
> 
> Besides, bug fixes should have waited for 5.09, really, as
> the beta was there for package and binary testing.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
_______________________________________________
Csound-devel mailing list
Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net

I completely agree with you Victor.
Releasing the betas was a waste of time and put the release on hold -  
a terribly long hold.

We are ready now for 5.09.

There are many significant fixes and new opcodes that have come into  
the CVS since the release of the beta.
I hope you will just release 5.09 next time - and not stall the  
release like we did.
It was a nice experiment, but... also not necessary.

Hopefully we can move forward like we used to.

Worth trying, but not much gained.

And mostly time lost.

my 2c

-dB

On Mar 20, 2008, at 3:48 AM, victor wrote:

> I wasn't aware. Which ones? I  seem to recall these
> were in the beta release notes already:
>
>         pan2: Corrected so it agrees with documentation
>         hilbert had its outputs reversed, now correct.
>          works again according to the manual.
>         Fixes in the { and } score looping statements.
>
> Besides, bug fixes should have waited for 5.09, really, as
> the beta was there for package and binary testing.
> The CsoundAC changes should not really have been made,
> as there should not have been this type of change between
> beta and full release.
>
> And if you want my opinion, releasing a beta was a waste of time,
> as the full release seems to still have problems, just as much as
> before.
>
> Victor
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Anthony Kozar" 
> To: "Developer discussions" 
> Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 4:24 AM
> Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] sourceforge Downloads info
>
>
>> There were several bug fixes in between the beta and the final  
>> releases.
>> Some of them might be considered significant.
>>
>> Anthony
>>
>> On Wed, March 19, 2008 9:51 pm, Felipe Sateler wrote:
>>
>>> On Wednesday 19 March 2008 22:35:45 victor wrote:
>>>> They are not betas, but full releases. Since I am away from
>>>> work, I cannot build new packages, so I just renamed the
>>>> old ones, which were OK anyway. They might carry the library
>>>> beta string message, but otherwise are undistinguishable from
>>>> the non-beta 5.08. I might build new packages to comply
>>>> later. For now, they should be fine.
>>>
>>> It is not the same. At least, the csoundac library is no longer  
>>> shared. I
>>> don't know if it is used in the OSX installers, but it's  
>>> certainly not
>>> exactly the same as the betas.
>>
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>> ----
>> This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
>> Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
>> http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
>> _______________________________________________
>> Csound-devel mailing list
>> Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> ---
> This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
> Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
> http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
> _______________________________________________
> Csound-devel mailing list
> Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
_______________________________________________
Csound-devel mailing list
Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net

> If the beta was released on all platforms at the same time, I really
> don't think we'd have had the lag we had.  We'd also be getting users
> testing on all platforms at the same time.

I agree with Steven here too. I know that people are investing their own
time into preparing releases so it's hard to get frustrated when certain
builds take longer than others. I think the build system just needs better
synchronization between platforms.

Rory.



> steven
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Dr. Richard Boulanger
>  wrote:
>> I completely agree with you Victor.
>>  Releasing the betas was a waste of time and put the release on hold -
>>  a terribly long hold.
>>
>>  We are ready now for 5.09.
>>
>>  There are many significant fixes and new opcodes that have come into
>>  the CVS since the release of the beta.
>>  I hope you will just release 5.09 next time - and not stall the
>>  release like we did.
>>  It was a nice experiment, but... also not necessary.
>>
>>  Hopefully we can move forward like we used to.
>>
>>  Worth trying, but not much gained.
>>
>>  And mostly time lost.
>>
>>  my 2c
>>
>>  -dB
>>
>>
>>
>>  On Mar 20, 2008, at 3:48 AM, victor wrote:
>>
>>  > I wasn't aware. Which ones? I  seem to recall these
>>  > were in the beta release notes already:
>>  >
>>  >         pan2: Corrected so it agrees with documentation
>>  >         hilbert had its outputs reversed, now correct.
>>  >          works again according to the manual.
>>  >         Fixes in the { and } score looping statements.
>>  >
>>  > Besides, bug fixes should have waited for 5.09, really, as
>>  > the beta was there for package and binary testing.
>>  > The CsoundAC changes should not really have been made,
>>  > as there should not have been this type of change between
>>  > beta and full release.
>>  >
>>  > And if you want my opinion, releasing a beta was a waste of time,
>>  > as the full release seems to still have problems, just as much as
>>  > before.
>>  >
>>  > Victor
>>  >
>>  > ----- Original Message -----
>>  > From: "Anthony Kozar" 
>>  > To: "Developer discussions" 
>>  > Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 4:24 AM
>>  > Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] sourceforge Downloads info
>>  >
>>  >
>>  >> There were several bug fixes in between the beta and the final
>>  >> releases.
>>  >> Some of them might be considered significant.
>>  >>
>>  >> Anthony
>>  >>
>>  >> On Wed, March 19, 2008 9:51 pm, Felipe Sateler wrote:
>>  >>
>>  >>> On Wednesday 19 March 2008 22:35:45 victor wrote:
>>  >>>> They are not betas, but full releases. Since I am away from
>>  >>>> work, I cannot build new packages, so I just renamed the
>>  >>>> old ones, which were OK anyway. They might carry the library
>>  >>>> beta string message, but otherwise are undistinguishable from
>>  >>>> the non-beta 5.08. I might build new packages to comply
>>  >>>> later. For now, they should be fine.
>>  >>>
>>  >>> It is not the same. At least, the csoundac library is no longer
>>  >>> shared. I
>>  >>> don't know if it is used in the OSX installers, but it's
>>  >>> certainly not
>>  >>> exactly the same as the betas.
>>  >>
>>  >>
>>  >>
>>  >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>  >> ----
>>  >> This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
>>  >> Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
>>  >> http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
>>  >> _______________________________________________
>>  >> Csound-devel mailing list
>>  >> Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>>  >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
>>  >
>>  >
>>  > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>  > ---
>>  > This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
>>  > Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
>>  > http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
>>  > _______________________________________________
>>  > Csound-devel mailing list
>>  > Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>>  > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
>>
>>
>>  -------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>  This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
>>  Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
>>  http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  Csound-devel mailing list
>>  Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>>  https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
>>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
> Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
> http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
> _______________________________________________
> Csound-devel mailing list
> Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
>



-------------------------------------------------------------------------
This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
_______________________________________________
Csound-devel mailing list
Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net

I was not involved in the beta builds so take what I say w. a grain of  
salt, but
bearing in mind that different people can commit varying amounts of  
time,
why not separate the new version built into a non-public ,beta =  
'developers only' stage.

my $100000000000000000  (Zimbabwe)  (==1cent)'s worth,

David

On 24/03/2008, at 5:15 AM, Rory Walsh wrote:
>> If the beta was released on all platforms at the same time, I really
>> don't think we'd have had the lag we had.  We'd also be getting users
>> testing on all platforms at the same time.
>
> I agree with Steven here too. I know that people are investing their  
> own
> time into preparing releases so it's hard to get frustrated when  
> certain
> builds take longer than others. I think the build system just needs  
> better
> synchronization between platforms.
>
> Rory.
>
>
>
>> steven
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 7:39 AM, Dr. Richard Boulanger
>>  wrote:
>>> I completely agree with you Victor.
>>> Releasing the betas was a waste of time and put the release on  
>>> hold -
>>> a terribly long hold.
>>>
>>> We are ready now for 5.09.
>>>
>>> There are many significant fixes and new opcodes that have come into
>>> the CVS since the release of the beta.
>>> I hope you will just release 5.09 next time - and not stall the
>>> release like we did.
>>> It was a nice experiment, but... also not necessary.
>>>
>>> Hopefully we can move forward like we used to.
>>>
>>> Worth trying, but not much gained.
>>>
>>> And mostly time lost.
>>>
>>> my 2c
>>>
>>> -dB
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mar 20, 2008, at 3:48 AM, victor wrote:
>>>
>>>> I wasn't aware. Which ones? I  seem to recall these
>>>> were in the beta release notes already:
>>>>
>>>>       pan2: Corrected so it agrees with documentation
>>>>       hilbert had its outputs reversed, now correct.
>>>>        works again according to the manual.
>>>>       Fixes in the { and } score looping statements.
>>>>
>>>> Besides, bug fixes should have waited for 5.09, really, as
>>>> the beta was there for package and binary testing.
>>>> The CsoundAC changes should not really have been made,
>>>> as there should not have been this type of change between
>>>> beta and full release.
>>>>
>>>> And if you want my opinion, releasing a beta was a waste of time,
>>>> as the full release seems to still have problems, just as much as
>>>> before.
>>>>
>>>> Victor
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Anthony Kozar" 
>>>> To: "Developer discussions" 
>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2008 4:24 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] sourceforge Downloads info
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> There were several bug fixes in between the beta and the final
>>>>> releases.
>>>>> Some of them might be considered significant.
>>>>>
>>>>> Anthony
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, March 19, 2008 9:51 pm, Felipe Sateler wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wednesday 19 March 2008 22:35:45 victor wrote:
>>>>>>> They are not betas, but full releases. Since I am away from
>>>>>>> work, I cannot build new packages, so I just renamed the
>>>>>>> old ones, which were OK anyway. They might carry the library
>>>>>>> beta string message, but otherwise are undistinguishable from
>>>>>>> the non-beta 5.08. I might build new packages to comply
>>>>>>> later. For now, they should be fine.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is not the same. At least, the csoundac library is no longer
>>>>>> shared. I
>>>>>> don't know if it is used in the OSX installers, but it's
>>>>>> certainly not
>>>>>> exactly the same as the betas.
>>>>>

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
_______________________________________________
Csound-devel mailing list
Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net

In this case the Linux beta installer had a serious problem, which was
not noticed until the real release.  From my pov the beta achieved
noting but additional work.
==John ffitch

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
This SF.net email is sponsored by: Microsoft
Defy all challenges. Microsoft(R) Visual Studio 2008.
http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/vse0120000070mrt/direct/01/
_______________________________________________
Csound-devel mailing list
Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net