yes 2.4. My problem is that until Apple does not
move to 2.4, I have to keep supplying the 2.3
module, as I cannot force people to install 2.4.
A solution would be to add the MacPython installer
to the package. Would that be legal?

Victor
>
> Yes, I realised after I'd sent the previous that it wasn't
> (solvable).
>
>   my suggestion to those caught by this is to start to
> experiment   with csnd.py in anticipation of  Matt
> updatin. I would also recommend upgrading to Python 2.4
> (at least)  - v2.3 is   really now in the dark ages.
>
> David
> On 11/11/2007, at 8:16 PM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>
> > Not I don't think it's solvable. This is
> > because the python interpreter is Intel and
> > the module is PPC. The two don't agree. Rosetta
> > won't help here because it works at the process
> > level. If you ran a PPC interepreter, then it
> > would work (but all the dependencies would have
> > to be PPC as well). In fact that's the same
> > thing that stops Matt's frontend working with
> > Intel CsoundLib.
> >
> > Victor
> >
> >
> >>
> >> yes .. Matt .... apologies. it was 5am ish!
> >>
> >> with PPC version installed, using Apple's python:
> >>> drwIntel:~  drw$ /usr/bin/pythonPython 2.3.5 (#1, Jan
> 13 >>> 2006,   20:13:11)
> >>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
> darwin >>> ...
> >>>>>> import csnd
> >>> Traceback (most recent call last):
> >>>   File "", line 1, in ?
> >>>   File
> >>
> "/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
> >>> lib/python2.3/csnd.py", line 4, in ? >>>     import
> _csnd >>> ImportError:
> >>> dlopen(/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/
> >> Versions/2.3/lib/python2.3/_csnd.so, 2): no suitable
> image >>> found.    Did find:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
> >> lib/python2.3/_csnd.so: mach-o, but wrong architecture
> >> >> if you ignore and simply insist, it doesn't
> complain: >>>>>> import csnd
> >>>>>> dir()
> >>> ['__builtins__', '__doc__', '__file__', '__name__',
> >>> 'csnd'] >>>
> >> but it hasn't imported properly:
> >>>>>> dir(csnd)
> >>> ['__builtins__', '__doc__', '__file__', '__name__']
> >>>>>>
> >>
> >> Using python2.4:
> >>> drwIntel:~ drw$ python
> >>> Python 2.4.3 (#1, Mar 30 2006, 11:02:16)
> >>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
> darwin >> ..
> >>>>>> import csnd
> >>> Traceback (most recent call last):
> >>>   File "", line 1, in ?
> >>>   File
> >>>
> "/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.4/lib/
> >>> python2.4/csnd.py", line 7, in ? ImportError: No
> module >>> named _csnd >>>
> >>
> >> and it complains no matter how many times you try to
> >> import. This one might be solvable... perhaps its just
> a >> naming convention?
> >>
> >> David
> >>
> >>
> >> On 11/11/2007, at 6:07 AM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
> >>
> >>> you probably mean Matt Ingalls, not Mike Gogins.
> >>>
> >>> What is the problem by the way?
> >>>
> >>> Victor
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>> I've just re-tested and I can confirm that (on an
> intel >>>> OSX) I have   the same problem when I use
> Csound PPC. >> Mike >> has indicated in a   recent post on
> the CS-Dev >> list that >> he will move macCsound to a
> universal >> binary soon. In >> the mean-time, whenever  I
> need the >> other   one, I simply >> install it from the
> relevant .dmg >> over the top of the >> existing. And do
> it again to switch >> back. Not very elegant >> but, hey,
>  it works! >>>>
> >>>> David
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On 11/11/2007, at 1:24 AM, joachim heintz wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> No it's the same result with the -g option. Thanks
> >>>>> anyway for the   idea. I think all the problems are
> >>>>> raising because I am using the   Csound PPC version
> on >>>>> an IntelMac, because formerly I worked such a
> lot in >>>> MacCsound that it's hard to change all this
> stuff to >> FLTK >>> widgets. You are using the MacIntel
> version of >> Csound, >> right? >
> >>>>>     joachim
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 23:57 schrieb David Worrall:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> I can confirm that this eg works for me under
> >>>>>> OSX 10.4.10
> >>>>>> IDLE 1.1.3
> >>>>>> Python 2.4.3.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> But I've found things quickly get stuffed up with
> the >>>> graphic   >> output turned on.
> >>>>>> Can you try it with the -g command line option?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> This tells me I should include a .csd with the
> >> example >> description. >>
> >>>>>> David
> >>>>>> On 10/11/2007, at 8:53 AM, joachim heintz wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Well, but the task
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> import csnd
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> is ok in MacPython 2.3 (IDLE 1.0). The csnd module
> >> is >> found and   >>> can be loaded correctly.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> But when I go to the terminal and try the same in
> >>>> /usr/bin/  >>> python2.3 I get:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Python 2.3.5 (#1, Jan 13 2006, 20:13:11)
> >>>>>>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
> >>>> darwin >>> Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or
> >>>> "license" for more   >>> information.
> >>>>>>>>>> import csnd
> >>>>>>> Traceback (most recent call last):
> >>>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
> >>>>>>>   File
> >>>>
> >>
> "/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
> >>>>>>> lib/python2.3/csnd.py", line 7, in ? >>>>> >>
> import _csnd >>>>> ImportError: >>>>
> dlopen(/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/
> >>>>>>> Versions/2.3/lib/python2.3/_csnd.so, 2): no >>
> suitable image >>>>> found.  Did find: >>>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>
> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
> >>>>>>> lib/python2.3/_csnd.so: mach-o, but wrong >>
> architecture >>>>>>>> Is this because of the PPC version
> >> (being on an >> IntelMac)? Why no   >>> problem with >>
> MacPython/ IDLE? >>>>> >>>>>>>     joachim
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 22:14 schrieb Oeyvind Brandtsegg:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I think one should not run any halfway complex
> >> stuff >> in IDLE. >>>> I do not remember the exact
> reason >> why, >> neither the exact >>>> implications, but
> it has to >> with >> IDLE itself being written in   >>>>
> Python. >>>>>>>> This means we get one Python app running
> on top of >>>> another and   >>>> it does
> >>>>>>>> sometimes lead to unexpected results and strange
> >>>> error messages. >>>> Repeat, do not run stuff in
> IDLE. >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> best
> >>>>>>>> Oeyvind
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> 2007/11/9, Victor Lazzarini
> >>>> : >>>>> The code is
> correct. >> The >> -1 answer means that >>>>> probably the
> CSD was not >> found >> or that other >>>>> problem
> happened during the >>>> compilation. >>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> -1 actually means an error. Also in OSX maybe
> >>>>>>>>> the csound messages have been printed to the
> >>>>>>>>> console (see it in utilities), not the terminal.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> (On Windows, if I run it from Idle, I also do
> >>>>>>>>> not get any Csound messages)
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Victor
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Hi David -
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> I find it very useful. But your example
> "Playing >> an >>>>>>>> existing csd   file" doesn't work
> on my system >>>> (MacPython >>>>>> 2.3, Csound PPC 5.07).
> No   error >>>> messages, but it returns >>>>>> -1:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> cs = csnd.Csound()
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> fname =
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>
> "/Users/jh/Documents/Csound/PythonInCsound/pythontest.csd"
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> cs.Perform(fname) >>>>>> -1 >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> When I first run main.py from Oeyvinds
> >>>>>>>>>> PartikkelCloudDesigner (it   stops at a certain
> >>>> point, but >>>>>> after loading all the csnd stuff),
> >> it's >>  ok (returns 0) >>>>>> and "test.aif" is
> written >> in the >> directory of the >>>>>>
> PartikkelCloudDesigner. >> So maybe >> there has to be one
> or >>>>>> more other >> tasks before >> cs.Perform(fname)?
> >>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Best -
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>     joachim
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 13:33 schrieb David Worrall:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Hi All,
> >>>>>>>>>>> I've been finding my way around the python
> >>>> wrappers for >>>>>>> csnd. In my   search I've come
> >> across >> quite a few people >>>>>>> who have found the
> >> process >> just too hard. So, bearing >>>>>>> in mind
> >> thathis process >> is   likely to attract new users
> >>>>>>>>> ,  I thought it >> would be good to begin   to
> put >> a >>>>>> graduated >> introduction together. >
> >>>>>>> >> I've just scratched out a >> temporary
> beginning, for the >>>>>>>>> moment at >>
> http://www.avatar.com.au/sonify/csnd/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A
> couple of things suggest themselves. >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Reference material
> >>>>>>>>>>> -------------------------
> >>>>>>>>>>> Apart from some simple examples, it would  be
> >> good >> to >>>>>>> merge the   output from help(csnd)
> with >> the >> info in the >>>>>>> header files,
> particularly >> csound.h >>>>>>>>> Has anyone written such
> a script? It >> wouldn't be >> too >>>>>>> hard a hack
> and then each >> version or compile >> options >>>>>>>
> change, a reference >> could   be computed by >> the user
> >>>>>> particular to >> their own system. > >>>>>>>>>
> Examples >>>>>>>>>>> --------------
> >>>>>>>>>>> From what I can see, the only example from the
> >>>> examples >>>>>>> directory   in the sources that runs
> >> on >> the default OSX >>>>>>> .dmg install of v5.7
> >> without >> being modified is >>>>>>> Victor's vu.py (It
> >> relies on >> TclSTk being   installed.) >>>>>>> tFair
> >> enough - It is a >> "way in" I could put up a hacked
> >>>>>>>>  down version (no >> graphics), just to
> illustrate >> the use of >>>>>>> >>
> CsoundPerformanceThread and >> SetChannel and proceed
> >>>>>> >> that way ... > >>>>>>> >> I'm not sure if
> people would find >> these type of things >>>>>>>>>
> useful.   Perhaps you have >> other ideas. >> Feedback?
> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ciao, >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> David
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >> _________________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
> >>>>>>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group, >>>>>>>>>
> >> University of Canberra: >>>>>>>>
> >> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ > >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> _________________________________________________
> >>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
> >>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
> >>>>>> University of Canberra:
> >>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _________________________________________________
> >>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
> >>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
> >>>> University of Canberra:
> >> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> _________________________________________________
> >> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
> >> Sonic Communications Research Group,
> >> University of Canberra:
> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > Send bugs reports to this list.
> > To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with
> > body   "unsubscribe csound"
> >
>
> _________________________________________________
> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
> Sonic Communications Research Group,
> University of Canberra:     creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/
>
>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to this list.
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with
> body "unsubscribe csound"

I guess it's a matter of priorities.
* With a .dmg, the python install is a very easy process.
* v2.4 is a marked improvement and in  learning python, and whilst  
backwards compatibility is strong (deprecation is maintained),  it  
will be often the case that the documentation, examples etc on the  
web, including python.org use even non-esoteric features from 2.4  
which would be more confusing to a novice.
* In using an API, there is a different 'balance' between the  
wrapping environment and the library than there is between multiple  
(insular) compilations. Ditto extending vs embedding.  To the extent  
that an API is a 'break-out' technology, I predict trying to maintain  
the 'broken-to' environ. will be a losing battle. Give up now! :-)
* I prefer to think of it as providing leadership rather than  
imposing. For example, users who need to do computationally  
challenging processing would soon turn to numpy.
* Active Python (http://www.activestate.com/Products/activepython/? 
_x=1) is now shipping for v2.5.  I'll be looking at that over xmas.

>> Would that be legal?
I'm not sure - you could ask the python-mac SIG list (pythonmac- 
sig@python.org). I think this issue has been addressed in the eggs.  
(http://peak.telecommunity.com/DevCenter/PythonEggs ).

If you want to continue to support v2.3, why not just have a  
separate .dmg for it?  Perhaps I've missed something.

David
On 11/11/2007, at 10:18 PM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:

> yes 2.4. My problem is that until Apple does not
> move to 2.4, I have to keep supplying the 2.3
> module, as I cannot force people to install 2.4.
> A solution would be to add the MacPython installer
> to the package. Would that be legal?

> Victor
>>
>> Yes, I realised after I'd sent the previous that it wasn't
>> (solvable).
>>
>>   my suggestion to those caught by this is to start to
>> experiment   with csnd.py in anticipation of  Matt
>> updatin. I would also recommend upgrading to Python 2.4
>> (at least)  - v2.3 is   really now in the dark ages.
>>
>> David
>> On 11/11/2007, at 8:16 PM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>>
>>> Not I don't think it's solvable. This is
>>> because the python interpreter is Intel and
>>> the module is PPC. The two don't agree. Rosetta
>>> won't help here because it works at the process
>>> level. If you ran a PPC interepreter, then it
>>> would work (but all the dependencies would have
>>> to be PPC as well). In fact that's the same
>>> thing that stops Matt's frontend working with
>>> Intel CsoundLib.
>>>
>>> Victor
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> yes .. Matt .... apologies. it was 5am ish!
>>>>
>>>> with PPC version installed, using Apple's python:
>>>>> drwIntel:~  drw$ /usr/bin/pythonPython 2.3.5 (#1, Jan
>> 13 >>> 2006,   20:13:11)
>>>>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>> darwin >>> ...
>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>   File
>>>>
>> "/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>> lib/python2.3/csnd.py", line 4, in ? >>>     import
>> _csnd >>> ImportError:
>>>>> dlopen(/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/
>>>> Versions/2.3/lib/python2.3/_csnd.so, 2): no suitable
>> image >>> found.    Did find:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>> lib/python2.3/_csnd.so: mach-o, but wrong architecture
>>>>>> if you ignore and simply insist, it doesn't
>> complain: >>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>> dir()
>>>>> ['__builtins__', '__doc__', '__file__', '__name__',
>>>>> 'csnd'] >>>
>>>> but it hasn't imported properly:
>>>>>>>> dir(csnd)
>>>>> ['__builtins__', '__doc__', '__file__', '__name__']
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Using python2.4:
>>>>> drwIntel:~ drw$ python
>>>>> Python 2.4.3 (#1, Mar 30 2006, 11:02:16)
>>>>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>> darwin >> ..
>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>   File
>>>>>
>> "/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.4/lib/
>>>>> python2.4/csnd.py", line 7, in ? ImportError: No
>> module >>> named _csnd >>>
>>>>
>>>> and it complains no matter how many times you try to
>>>> import. This one might be solvable... perhaps its just
>> a >> naming convention?
>>>>
>>>> David
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 11/11/2007, at 6:07 AM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> you probably mean Matt Ingalls, not Mike Gogins.
>>>>>
>>>>> What is the problem by the way?
>>>>>
>>>>> Victor
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've just re-tested and I can confirm that (on an
>> intel >>>> OSX) I have   the same problem when I use
>> Csound PPC. >> Mike >> has indicated in a   recent post on
>> the CS-Dev >> list that >> he will move macCsound to a
>> universal >> binary soon. In >> the mean-time, whenever  I
>> need the >> other   one, I simply >> install it from the
>> relevant .dmg >> over the top of the >> existing. And do
>> it again to switch >> back. Not very elegant >> but, hey,
>>  it works! >>>>
>>>>>> David
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 11/11/2007, at 1:24 AM, joachim heintz wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No it's the same result with the -g option. Thanks
>>>>>>> anyway for the   idea. I think all the problems are
>>>>>>> raising because I am using the   Csound PPC version
>> on >>>>> an IntelMac, because formerly I worked such a
>> lot in >>>> MacCsound that it's hard to change all this
>> stuff to >> FLTK >>> widgets. You are using the MacIntel
>> version of >> Csound, >> right? >
>>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 23:57 schrieb David Worrall:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I can confirm that this eg works for me under
>>>>>>>> OSX 10.4.10
>>>>>>>> IDLE 1.1.3
>>>>>>>> Python 2.4.3.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But I've found things quickly get stuffed up with
>> the >>>> graphic   >> output turned on.
>>>>>>>> Can you try it with the -g command line option?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This tells me I should include a .csd with the
>>>> example >> description. >>
>>>>>>>> David
>>>>>>>> On 10/11/2007, at 8:53 AM, joachim heintz wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Well, but the task
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> is ok in MacPython 2.3 (IDLE 1.0). The csnd module
>>>> is >> found and   >>> can be loaded correctly.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But when I go to the terminal and try the same in
>>>>>> /usr/bin/  >>> python2.3 I get:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Python 2.3.5 (#1, Jan 13 2006, 20:13:11)
>>>>>>>>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>>>>>> darwin >>> Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or
>>>>>> "license" for more   >>> information.
>>>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>>>>>   File
>>>>>>
>>>>
>> "/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>>>>> lib/python2.3/csnd.py", line 7, in ? >>>>> >>
>> import _csnd >>>>> ImportError: >>>>
>> dlopen(/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/
>>>>>>>>> Versions/2.3/lib/python2.3/_csnd.so, 2): no >>
>> suitable image >>>>> found.  Did find: >>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>>>>> lib/python2.3/_csnd.so: mach-o, but wrong >>
>> architecture >>>>>>>> Is this because of the PPC version
>>>> (being on an >> IntelMac)? Why no   >>> problem with >>
>> MacPython/ IDLE? >>>>> >>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 22:14 schrieb Oeyvind Brandtsegg:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I think one should not run any halfway complex
>>>> stuff >> in IDLE. >>>> I do not remember the exact
>> reason >> why, >> neither the exact >>>> implications, but
>> it has to >> with >> IDLE itself being written in   >>>>
>> Python. >>>>>>>> This means we get one Python app running
>> on top of >>>> another and   >>>> it does
>>>>>>>>>> sometimes lead to unexpected results and strange
>>>>>> error messages. >>>> Repeat, do not run stuff in
>> IDLE. >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> best
>>>>>>>>>> Oeyvind
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 2007/11/9, Victor Lazzarini
>>>>>> : >>>>> The code is
>> correct. >> The >> -1 answer means that >>>>> probably the
>> CSD was not >> found >> or that other >>>>> problem
>> happened during the >>>> compilation. >>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> -1 actually means an error. Also in OSX maybe
>>>>>>>>>>> the csound messages have been printed to the
>>>>>>>>>>> console (see it in utilities), not the terminal.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> (On Windows, if I run it from Idle, I also do
>>>>>>>>>>> not get any Csound messages)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Victor
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi David -
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I find it very useful. But your example
>> "Playing >> an >>>>>>>> existing csd   file" doesn't work
>> on my system >>>> (MacPython >>>>>> 2.3, Csound PPC 5.07).
>> No   error >>>> messages, but it returns >>>>>> -1:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cs = csnd.Csound()
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fname =
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>> "/Users/jh/Documents/Csound/PythonInCsound/pythontest.csd"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cs.Perform(fname) >>>>>> -1 >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> When I first run main.py from Oeyvinds
>>>>>>>>>>>> PartikkelCloudDesigner (it   stops at a certain
>>>>>> point, but >>>>>> after loading all the csnd stuff),
>>>> it's >>  ok (returns 0) >>>>>> and "test.aif" is
>> written >> in the >> directory of the >>>>>>
>> PartikkelCloudDesigner. >> So maybe >> there has to be one
>> or >>>>>> more other >> tasks before >> cs.Perform(fname)?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Best -
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 13:33 schrieb David Worrall:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi All,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been finding my way around the python
>>>>>> wrappers for >>>>>>> csnd. In my   search I've come
>>>> across >> quite a few people >>>>>>> who have found the
>>>> process >> just too hard. So, bearing >>>>>>> in mind
>>>> thathis process >> is   likely to attract new users
>>>>>>>>>>> ,  I thought it >> would be good to begin   to
>> put >> a >>>>>> graduated >> introduction together. >
>>>>>>>>>>> I've just scratched out a >> temporary
>> beginning, for the >>>>>>>>> moment at >>
>> http://www.avatar.com.au/sonify/csnd/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A
>> couple of things suggest themselves. >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Reference material
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Apart from some simple examples, it would  be
>>>> good >> to >>>>>>> merge the   output from help(csnd)
>> with >> the >> info in the >>>>>>> header files,
>> particularly >> csound.h >>>>>>>>> Has anyone written such
>> a script? It >> wouldn't be >> too >>>>>>> hard a hack
>> and then each >> version or compile >> options >>>>>>>
>> change, a reference >> could   be computed by >> the user
>>>>>>>> particular to >> their own system. > >>>>>>>>>
>> Examples >>>>>>>>>>> --------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From what I can see, the only example from the
>>>>>> examples >>>>>>> directory   in the sources that runs
>>>> on >> the default OSX >>>>>>> .dmg install of v5.7
>>>> without >> being modified is >>>>>>> Victor's vu.py (It
>>>> relies on >> TclSTk being   installed.) >>>>>>> tFair
>>>> enough - It is a >> "way in" I could put up a hacked
>>>>>>>>>>  down version (no >> graphics), just to
>> illustrate >> the use of >>>>>>> >>
>> CsoundPerformanceThread and >> SetChannel and proceed
>>>>>>>>>> that way ... > >>>>>>> >> I'm not sure if
>> people would find >> these type of things >>>>>>>>>
>> useful.   Perhaps you have >> other ideas. >> Feedback?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ciao, >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> David
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group, >>>>>>>>>
>>>> University of Canberra: >>>>>>>>
>>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ > >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>>>>>> University of Canberra:
>>>>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>>>> University of Canberra:
>>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>> University of Canberra:
>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with
>>> body   "unsubscribe csound"
>>>
>>
>> _________________________________________________
>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>> University of Canberra:     creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with
>> body "unsubscribe csound"
>
>
> Send bugs reports to this list.
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body  
> "unsubscribe csound"
>

_________________________________________________
experimental polymedia:	www.avatar.com.au
Sonic Communications Research Group,
University of Canberra:	 creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/

Hi Oeyvind,

I'm replying to the list, because that's where yours went ( :-)  and  
others have also asked...

I just tested the following on a PPC under OSX 10.3.9 and it works:

 From http://www.pythonmac.org/packages/py24-fat/index.html get these  
two .dmg and install (in this order):

python-2.4.4-macosx2006-10-18.dmg (MD5:  
3b7a449a1ae321a1609912c1e507d005)

and

numpy-1.0.1-py2.4-macosx10.4-2006-12-12.dmg (MD5:  
b6b967af251cb484e8725a98f193232b)

when the installations have finished, at unix prompt, type
% which python
if it doesn't say 'Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.4/ 
bin/python'
then your $PATH is finding another python first so the simplest is to  
make an alias in your ~/.bashrc file like this:

alias python='/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.4/bin/ 
python'

then

% source ~/.bashrc

before loading python again.

Hope this helps.
I've been meaning to contact you about some of your python egs,  but  
it can wait.

David

On 13/11/2007, at 8:57 AM, Oeyvind Brandtsegg wrote:

> Hello David.
> I write this privately, as it may be too off topic for the cs list.
>
> Speaking of numpy,
> did you manage to install numpy without problems on OSX/PPC ?
> I'm not a Mac user, but I tried some days ago to get ImproSculpt
> running on a friend's PPC machine, and one of the problems was that
> numpy failed to build.
> If I remember correctly, we just did
> setup.py install (or whatever the readme said)
> on the numpy source.
> I think the problem was that numpy did not have a target for PPC  
> OSX 10.4.
>
> best
> Oeyvind
>
> 2007/11/12, David Worrall :
>> I guess it's a matter of priorities.
>> * With a .dmg, the python install is a very easy process.
>> * v2.4 is a marked improvement and in  learning python, and whilst
>> backwards compatibility is strong (deprecation is maintained),  it
>> will be often the case that the documentation, examples etc on the
>> web, including python.org use even non-esoteric features from 2.4
>> which would be more confusing to a novice.
>> * In using an API, there is a different 'balance' between the
>> wrapping environment and the library than there is between multiple
>> (insular) compilations. Ditto extending vs embedding.  To the extent
>> that an API is a 'break-out' technology, I predict trying to maintain
>> the 'broken-to' environ. will be a losing battle. Give up now! :-)
>> * I prefer to think of it as providing leadership rather than
>> imposing. For example, users who need to do computationally
>> challenging processing would soon turn to numpy.
>> * Active Python (http://www.activestate.com/Products/activepython/?
>> _x=1) is now shipping for v2.5.  I'll be looking at that over xmas.
>>
>>>> Would that be legal?
>> I'm not sure - you could ask the python-mac SIG list (pythonmac-
>> sig@python.org). I think this issue has been addressed in the eggs.
>> (http://peak.telecommunity.com/DevCenter/PythonEggs ).
>>
>> If you want to continue to support v2.3, why not just have a
>> separate .dmg for it?  Perhaps I've missed something.
>>
>> David
>> On 11/11/2007, at 10:18 PM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>>
>>> yes 2.4. My problem is that until Apple does not
>>> move to 2.4, I have to keep supplying the 2.3
>>> module, as I cannot force people to install 2.4.
>>> A solution would be to add the MacPython installer
>>> to the package. Would that be legal?
>>
>>> Victor
>>>>
>>>> Yes, I realised after I'd sent the previous that it wasn't
>>>> (solvable).
>>>>
>>>>   my suggestion to those caught by this is to start to
>>>> experiment   with csnd.py in anticipation of  Matt
>>>> updatin. I would also recommend upgrading to Python 2.4
>>>> (at least)  - v2.3 is   really now in the dark ages.
>>>>
>>>> David
>>>> On 11/11/2007, at 8:16 PM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Not I don't think it's solvable. This is
>>>>> because the python interpreter is Intel and
>>>>> the module is PPC. The two don't agree. Rosetta
>>>>> won't help here because it works at the process
>>>>> level. If you ran a PPC interepreter, then it
>>>>> would work (but all the dependencies would have
>>>>> to be PPC as well). In fact that's the same
>>>>> thing that stops Matt's frontend working with
>>>>> Intel CsoundLib.
>>>>>
>>>>> Victor
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> yes .. Matt .... apologies. it was 5am ish!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> with PPC version installed, using Apple's python:
>>>>>>> drwIntel:~  drw$ /usr/bin/pythonPython 2.3.5 (#1, Jan
>>>> 13 >>> 2006,   20:13:11)
>>>>>>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>>>> darwin >>> ...
>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>>>   File
>>>>>>
>>>> "/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>>> lib/python2.3/csnd.py", line 4, in ? >>>     import
>>>> _csnd >>> ImportError:
>>>>>>> dlopen(/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/
>>>>>> Versions/2.3/lib/python2.3/_csnd.so, 2): no suitable
>>>> image >>> found.    Did find:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>> lib/python2.3/_csnd.so: mach-o, but wrong architecture
>>>>>>>> if you ignore and simply insist, it doesn't
>>>> complain: >>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>>> dir()
>>>>>>> ['__builtins__', '__doc__', '__file__', '__name__',
>>>>>>> 'csnd'] >>>
>>>>>> but it hasn't imported properly:
>>>>>>>>>> dir(csnd)
>>>>>>> ['__builtins__', '__doc__', '__file__', '__name__']
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Using python2.4:
>>>>>>> drwIntel:~ drw$ python
>>>>>>> Python 2.4.3 (#1, Mar 30 2006, 11:02:16)
>>>>>>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>>>> darwin >> ..
>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>>>   File
>>>>>>>
>>>> "/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.4/lib/
>>>>>>> python2.4/csnd.py", line 7, in ? ImportError: No
>>>> module >>> named _csnd >>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> and it complains no matter how many times you try to
>>>>>> import. This one might be solvable... perhaps its just
>>>> a >> naming convention?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> David
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 11/11/2007, at 6:07 AM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> you probably mean Matt Ingalls, not Mike Gogins.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What is the problem by the way?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Victor
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've just re-tested and I can confirm that (on an
>>>> intel >>>> OSX) I have   the same problem when I use
>>>> Csound PPC. >> Mike >> has indicated in a   recent post on
>>>> the CS-Dev >> list that >> he will move macCsound to a
>>>> universal >> binary soon. In >> the mean-time, whenever  I
>>>> need the >> other   one, I simply >> install it from the
>>>> relevant .dmg >> over the top of the >> existing. And do
>>>> it again to switch >> back. Not very elegant >> but, hey,
>>>>  it works! >>>>
>>>>>>>> David
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 11/11/2007, at 1:24 AM, joachim heintz wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> No it's the same result with the -g option. Thanks
>>>>>>>>> anyway for the   idea. I think all the problems are
>>>>>>>>> raising because I am using the   Csound PPC version
>>>> on >>>>> an IntelMac, because formerly I worked such a
>>>> lot in >>>> MacCsound that it's hard to change all this
>>>> stuff to >> FLTK >>> widgets. You are using the MacIntel
>>>> version of >> Csound, >> right? >
>>>>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 23:57 schrieb David Worrall:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I can confirm that this eg works for me under
>>>>>>>>>> OSX 10.4.10
>>>>>>>>>> IDLE 1.1.3
>>>>>>>>>> Python 2.4.3.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> But I've found things quickly get stuffed up with
>>>> the >>>> graphic   >> output turned on.
>>>>>>>>>> Can you try it with the -g command line option?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> This tells me I should include a .csd with the
>>>>>> example >> description. >>
>>>>>>>>>> David
>>>>>>>>>> On 10/11/2007, at 8:53 AM, joachim heintz wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Well, but the task
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> is ok in MacPython 2.3 (IDLE 1.0). The csnd module
>>>>>> is >> found and   >>> can be loaded correctly.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> But when I go to the terminal and try the same in
>>>>>>>> /usr/bin/  >>> python2.3 I get:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Python 2.3.5 (#1, Jan 13 2006, 20:13:11)
>>>>>>>>>>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>>>>>>>> darwin >>> Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or
>>>>>>>> "license" for more   >>> information.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>>>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>>>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>>>>>>>   File
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> "/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>>>>>>> lib/python2.3/csnd.py", line 7, in ? >>>>> >>
>>>> import _csnd >>>>> ImportError: >>>>
>>>> dlopen(/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/
>>>>>>>>>>> Versions/2.3/lib/python2.3/_csnd.so, 2): no >>
>>>> suitable image >>>>> found.  Did find: >>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>>>>>>> lib/python2.3/_csnd.so: mach-o, but wrong >>
>>>> architecture >>>>>>>> Is this because of the PPC version
>>>>>> (being on an >> IntelMac)? Why no   >>> problem with >>
>>>> MacPython/ IDLE? >>>>> >>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 22:14 schrieb Oeyvind Brandtsegg:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I think one should not run any halfway complex
>>>>>> stuff >> in IDLE. >>>> I do not remember the exact
>>>> reason >> why, >> neither the exact >>>> implications, but
>>>> it has to >> with >> IDLE itself being written in   >>>>
>>>> Python. >>>>>>>> This means we get one Python app running
>>>> on top of >>>> another and   >>>> it does
>>>>>>>>>>>> sometimes lead to unexpected results and strange
>>>>>>>> error messages. >>>> Repeat, do not run stuff in
>>>> IDLE. >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> best
>>>>>>>>>>>> Oeyvind
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 2007/11/9, Victor Lazzarini
>>>>>>>> : >>>>> The code is
>>>> correct. >> The >> -1 answer means that >>>>> probably the
>>>> CSD was not >> found >> or that other >>>>> problem
>>>> happened during the >>>> compilation. >>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -1 actually means an error. Also in OSX maybe
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the csound messages have been printed to the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> console (see it in utilities), not the terminal.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> (On Windows, if I run it from Idle, I also do
>>>>>>>>>>>>> not get any Csound messages)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Victor
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi David -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I find it very useful. But your example
>>>> "Playing >> an >>>>>>>> existing csd   file" doesn't work
>>>> on my system >>>> (MacPython >>>>>> 2.3, Csound PPC 5.07).
>>>> No   error >>>> messages, but it returns >>>>>> -1:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cs = csnd.Csound()
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fname =
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> "/Users/jh/Documents/Csound/PythonInCsound/pythontest.csd"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cs.Perform(fname) >>>>>> -1 >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> When I first run main.py from Oeyvinds
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PartikkelCloudDesigner (it   stops at a certain
>>>>>>>> point, but >>>>>> after loading all the csnd stuff),
>>>>>> it's >>  ok (returns 0) >>>>>> and "test.aif" is
>>>> written >> in the >> directory of the >>>>>>
>>>> PartikkelCloudDesigner. >> So maybe >> there has to be one
>>>> or >>>>>> more other >> tasks before >> cs.Perform(fname)?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Best -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 13:33 schrieb David Worrall:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi All,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been finding my way around the python
>>>>>>>> wrappers for >>>>>>> csnd. In my   search I've come
>>>>>> across >> quite a few people >>>>>>> who have found the
>>>>>> process >> just too hard. So, bearing >>>>>>> in mind
>>>>>> thathis process >> is   likely to attract new users
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ,  I thought it >> would be good to begin   to
>>>> put >> a >>>>>> graduated >> introduction together. >
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've just scratched out a >> temporary
>>>> beginning, for the >>>>>>>>> moment at >>
>>>> http://www.avatar.com.au/sonify/csnd/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A
>>>> couple of things suggest themselves. >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Reference material
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Apart from some simple examples, it would  be
>>>>>> good >> to >>>>>>> merge the   output from help(csnd)
>>>> with >> the >> info in the >>>>>>> header files,
>>>> particularly >> csound.h >>>>>>>>> Has anyone written such
>>>> a script? It >> wouldn't be >> too >>>>>>> hard a hack
>>>> and then each >> version or compile >> options >>>>>>>
>>>> change, a reference >> could   be computed by >> the user
>>>>>>>>>> particular to >> their own system. > >>>>>>>>>
>>>> Examples >>>>>>>>>>> --------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From what I can see, the only example from the
>>>>>>>> examples >>>>>>> directory   in the sources that runs
>>>>>> on >> the default OSX >>>>>>> .dmg install of v5.7
>>>>>> without >> being modified is >>>>>>> Victor's vu.py (It
>>>>>> relies on >> TclSTk being   installed.) >>>>>>> tFair
>>>>>> enough - It is a >> "way in" I could put up a hacked
>>>>>>>>>>>>  down version (no >> graphics), just to
>>>> illustrate >> the use of >>>>>>> >>
>>>> CsoundPerformanceThread and >> SetChannel and proceed
>>>>>>>>>>>> that way ... > >>>>>>> >> I'm not sure if
>>>> people would find >> these type of things >>>>>>>>>
>>>> useful.   Perhaps you have >> other ideas. >> Feedback?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ciao, >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> David
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group, >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> University of Canberra: >>>>>>>>
>>>>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ > >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>>>>>>>> University of Canberra:
>>>>>>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>>>>>> University of Canberra:
>>>>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>>>> University of Canberra:
>>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>>>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with
>>>>> body   "unsubscribe csound"
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>> University of Canberra:     creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with
>>>> body "unsubscribe csound"
>>>
>>>
>>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>>> "unsubscribe csound"
>>>
>>
>> _________________________________________________
>> experimental polymedia: www.avatar.com.au
>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>> University of Canberra:  creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body  
>> "unsubscribe csound"
>>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to this list.
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body  
> "unsubscribe csound"
>

_________________________________________________
experimental polymedia:	www.avatar.com.au
Sonic Communications Research Group,
University of Canberra:	 creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/

I just want to simplify the packaging. As it is I can support
the csnd module for both 2.3 and 2.4, doing a double
build, but I wanted to avoid it.

Victor

At 21:20 12/11/2007, you wrote:
>I guess it's a matter of priorities.
>* With a .dmg, the python install is a very easy process.
>* v2.4 is a marked improvement and in  learning python, and whilst
>backwards compatibility is strong (deprecation is maintained),  it
>will be often the case that the documentation, examples etc on the
>web, including python.org use even non-esoteric features from 2.4
>which would be more confusing to a novice.
>* In using an API, there is a different 'balance' between the
>wrapping environment and the library than there is between multiple
>(insular) compilations. Ditto extending vs embedding.  To the extent
>that an API is a 'break-out' technology, I predict trying to maintain
>the 'broken-to' environ. will be a losing battle. Give up now! :-)
>* I prefer to think of it as providing leadership rather than
>imposing. For example, users who need to do computationally
>challenging processing would soon turn to numpy.
>* Active Python (http://www.activestate.com/Products/activepython/? _x=1) 
>is now shipping for v2.5.  I'll be looking at that over xmas.
>
>>>Would that be legal?
>I'm not sure - you could ask the python-mac SIG list (pythonmac- 
>sig@python.org). I think this issue has been addressed in the eggs.
>(http://peak.telecommunity.com/DevCenter/PythonEggs ).
>
>If you want to continue to support v2.3, why not just have a
>separate .dmg for it?  Perhaps I've missed something.
>
>David
>On 11/11/2007, at 10:18 PM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>
>>yes 2.4. My problem is that until Apple does not
>>move to 2.4, I have to keep supplying the 2.3
>>module, as I cannot force people to install 2.4.
>>A solution would be to add the MacPython installer
>>to the package. Would that be legal?
>
>>Victor
>>>
>>>Yes, I realised after I'd sent the previous that it wasn't
>>>(solvable).
>>>
>>>   my suggestion to those caught by this is to start to
>>>experiment   with csnd.py in anticipation of  Matt
>>>updatin. I would also recommend upgrading to Python 2.4
>>>(at least)  - v2.3 is   really now in the dark ages.
>>>
>>>David
>>>On 11/11/2007, at 8:16 PM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>>>
>>>>Not I don't think it's solvable. This is
>>>>because the python interpreter is Intel and
>>>>the module is PPC. The two don't agree. Rosetta
>>>>won't help here because it works at the process
>>>>level. If you ran a PPC interepreter, then it
>>>>would work (but all the dependencies would have
>>>>to be PPC as well). In fact that's the same
>>>>thing that stops Matt's frontend working with
>>>>Intel CsoundLib.
>>>>
>>>>Victor
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>yes .. Matt .... apologies. it was 5am ish!
>>>>>
>>>>>with PPC version installed, using Apple's python:
>>>>>>drwIntel:~  drw$ /usr/bin/pythonPython 2.3.5 (#1, Jan
>>>13 >>> 2006,   20:13:11)
>>>>>>[GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>>>darwin >>> ...
>>>>>>>>>import csnd
>>>>>>Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>>   File
>>>"/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>>lib/python2.3/csnd.py", line 4, in ? >>>     import
>>>_csnd >>> ImportError:
>>>>>>dlopen(/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/
>>>>>Versions/2.3/lib/python2.3/_csnd.so, 2): no suitable
>>>image >>> found.    Did find:
>>>>>>
>>>/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>lib/python2.3/_csnd.so: mach-o, but wrong architecture
>>>>>>>if you ignore and simply insist, it doesn't
>>>complain: >>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>>dir()
>>>>>>['__builtins__', '__doc__', '__file__', '__name__',
>>>>>>'csnd'] >>>
>>>>>but it hasn't imported properly:
>>>>>>>>>dir(csnd)
>>>>>>['__builtins__', '__doc__', '__file__', '__name__']
>>>>>
>>>>>Using python2.4:
>>>>>>drwIntel:~ drw$ python
>>>>>>Python 2.4.3 (#1, Mar 30 2006, 11:02:16)
>>>>>>[GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>>>darwin >> ..
>>>>>>>>>import csnd
>>>>>>Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>>   File
>>>"/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.4/lib/
>>>>>>python2.4/csnd.py", line 7, in ? ImportError: No
>>>module >>> named _csnd >>>
>>>>>
>>>>>and it complains no matter how many times you try to
>>>>>import. This one might be solvable... perhaps its just
>>>a >> naming convention?
>>>>>
>>>>>David
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>On 11/11/2007, at 6:07 AM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>you probably mean Matt Ingalls, not Mike Gogins.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>What is the problem by the way?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Victor
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I've just re-tested and I can confirm that (on an
>>>intel >>>> OSX) I have   the same problem when I use
>>>Csound PPC. >> Mike >> has indicated in a   recent post on
>>>the CS-Dev >> list that >> he will move macCsound to a
>>>universal >> binary soon. In >> the mean-time, whenever  I
>>>need the >> other   one, I simply >> install it from the
>>>relevant .dmg >> over the top of the >> existing. And do
>>>it again to switch >> back. Not very elegant >> but, hey,
>>>  it works! >>>>
>>>>>>>David
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On 11/11/2007, at 1:24 AM, joachim heintz wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>No it's the same result with the -g option. Thanks
>>>>>>>>anyway for the   idea. I think all the problems are
>>>>>>>>raising because I am using the   Csound PPC version
>>>on >>>>> an IntelMac, because formerly I worked such a
>>>lot in >>>> MacCsound that it's hard to change all this
>>>stuff to >> FLTK >>> widgets. You are using the MacIntel
>>>version of >> Csound, >> right? >
>>>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Am 09.11.2007 um 23:57 schrieb David Worrall:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I can confirm that this eg works for me under
>>>>>>>>>OSX 10.4.10
>>>>>>>>>IDLE 1.1.3
>>>>>>>>>Python 2.4.3.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>But I've found things quickly get stuffed up with
>>>the >>>> graphic   >> output turned on.
>>>>>>>>>Can you try it with the -g command line option?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>This tells me I should include a .csd with the
>>>>>example >> description. >>
>>>>>>>>>David
>>>>>>>>>On 10/11/2007, at 8:53 AM, joachim heintz wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Well, but the task
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>import csnd
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>is ok in MacPython 2.3 (IDLE 1.0). The csnd module
>>>>>is >> found and   >>> can be loaded correctly.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>But when I go to the terminal and try the same in
>>>>>>>/usr/bin/  >>> python2.3 I get:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Python 2.3.5 (#1, Jan 13 2006, 20:13:11)
>>>>>>>>>>[GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>>>>>>>darwin >>> Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or
>>>>>>>"license" for more   >>> information.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>import csnd
>>>>>>>>>>Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>>>>>>   File
>>>"/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>>>>>>lib/python2.3/csnd.py", line 7, in ? >>>>> >>
>>>import _csnd >>>>> ImportError: >>>>
>>>dlopen(/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/
>>>>>>>>>>Versions/2.3/lib/python2.3/_csnd.so, 2): no >>
>>>suitable image >>>>> found.  Did find: >>>>>>>
>>>/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>>>>>>lib/python2.3/_csnd.so: mach-o, but wrong >>
>>>architecture >>>>>>>> Is this because of the PPC version
>>>>>(being on an >> IntelMac)? Why no   >>> problem with >>
>>>MacPython/ IDLE? >>>>> >>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Am 09.11.2007 um 22:14 schrieb Oeyvind Brandtsegg:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>I think one should not run any halfway complex
>>>>>stuff >> in IDLE. >>>> I do not remember the exact
>>>reason >> why, >> neither the exact >>>> implications, but
>>>it has to >> with >> IDLE itself being written in   >>>>
>>>Python. >>>>>>>> This means we get one Python app running
>>>on top of >>>> another and   >>>> it does
>>>>>>>>>>>sometimes lead to unexpected results and strange
>>>>>>>error messages. >>>> Repeat, do not run stuff in
>>>IDLE. >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>best
>>>>>>>>>>>Oeyvind
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>2007/11/9, Victor Lazzarini
>>>>>>>: >>>>> The code is
>>>correct. >> The >> -1 answer means that >>>>> probably the
>>>CSD was not >> found >> or that other >>>>> problem
>>>happened during the >>>> compilation. >>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>-1 actually means an error. Also in OSX maybe
>>>>>>>>>>>>the csound messages have been printed to the
>>>>>>>>>>>>console (see it in utilities), not the terminal.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>(On Windows, if I run it from Idle, I also do
>>>>>>>>>>>>not get any Csound messages)
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>Victor
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hi David -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>I find it very useful. But your example
>>>"Playing >> an >>>>>>>> existing csd   file" doesn't work
>>>on my system >>>> (MacPython >>>>>> 2.3, Csound PPC 5.07).
>>>No   error >>>> messages, but it returns >>>>>> -1:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>import csnd
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>cs = csnd.Csound()
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>fname =
>>>"/Users/jh/Documents/Csound/PythonInCsound/pythontest.csd"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>cs.Perform(fname) >>>>>> -1 >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>When I first run main.py from Oeyvinds
>>>>>>>>>>>>>PartikkelCloudDesigner (it   stops at a certain
>>>>>>>point, but >>>>>> after loading all the csnd stuff),
>>>>>it's >>  ok (returns 0) >>>>>> and "test.aif" is
>>>written >> in the >> directory of the >>>>>>
>>>PartikkelCloudDesigner. >> So maybe >> there has to be one
>>>or >>>>>> more other >> tasks before >> cs.Perform(fname)?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Best -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>Am 09.11.2007 um 13:33 schrieb David Worrall:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hi All,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I've been finding my way around the python
>>>>>>>wrappers for >>>>>>> csnd. In my   search I've come
>>>>>across >> quite a few people >>>>>>> who have found the
>>>>>process >> just too hard. So, bearing >>>>>>> in mind
>>>>>thathis process >> is   likely to attract new users
>>>>>>>>>>>>,  I thought it >> would be good to begin   to
>>>put >> a >>>>>> graduated >> introduction together. >
>>>>>>>>>>>>I've just scratched out a >> temporary
>>>beginning, for the >>>>>>>>> moment at >>
>>>http://www.avatar.com.au/sonify/csnd/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A
>>>couple of things suggest themselves. >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Reference material
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>-------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Apart from some simple examples, it would  be
>>>>>good >> to >>>>>>> merge the   output from help(csnd)
>>>with >> the >> info in the >>>>>>> header files,
>>>particularly >> csound.h >>>>>>>>> Has anyone written such
>>>a script? It >> wouldn't be >> too >>>>>>> hard a hack
>>>and then each >> version or compile >> options >>>>>>>
>>>change, a reference >> could   be computed by >> the user
>>>>>>>>>particular to >> their own system. > >>>>>>>>>
>>>Examples >>>>>>>>>>> --------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From what I can see, the only example from the
>>>>>>>examples >>>>>>> directory   in the sources that runs
>>>>>on >> the default OSX >>>>>>> .dmg install of v5.7
>>>>>without >> being modified is >>>>>>> Victor's vu.py (It
>>>>>relies on >> TclSTk being   installed.) >>>>>>> tFair
>>>>>enough - It is a >> "way in" I could put up a hacked
>>>>>>>>>>>  down version (no >> graphics), just to
>>>illustrate >> the use of >>>>>>> >>
>>>CsoundPerformanceThread and >> SetChannel and proceed
>>>>>>>>>>>that way ... > >>>>>>> >> I'm not sure if
>>>people would find >> these type of things >>>>>>>>>
>>>useful.   Perhaps you have >> other ideas. >> Feedback?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>ciao, >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>David
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>_________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sonic Communications Research Group, >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>University of Canberra: >>>>>>>>
>>>>>creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ > >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>_________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>>>>>Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>>>>>>>University of Canberra:
>>>>>>>creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_________________________________________________
>>>>>>>experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>>>Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>>>>>University of Canberra:
>>>>>creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>_________________________________________________
>>>>>experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>>>University of Canberra:
>>>creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Send bugs reports to this list.
>>>>To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with
>>>>body   "unsubscribe csound"
>>>
>>>_________________________________________________
>>>experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>University of Canberra:     creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Send bugs reports to this list.
>>>To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with
>>>body "unsubscribe csound"
>>
>>
>>Send bugs reports to this list.
>>To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>>"unsubscribe csound"
>
>_________________________________________________
>experimental polymedia: www.avatar.com.au
>Sonic Communications Research Group,
>University of Canberra: creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/
>
>
>
>
>Send bugs reports to this list.
>To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe 
>csound"

Victor Lazzarini
Music Technology Laboratory
Music Department
National University of Ireland, Maynooth

completely understand!

one potential problem with writing to
/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/lib/python2.3

is that is violates Apples ¿recommendation?:
"The Frameworks directory in the system domain is for Apple-provided  
frameworks only. Developers should install their custom frameworks in  
either the local or user domain."


A problem will presumably onlt arise if/when an OS upgrade auto  
reconfigures that dir.

this might also be interesting ....  if you can't sleep:


David
On 13/11/2007, at 9:32 PM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:

> I just want to simplify the packaging. As it is I can support
> the csnd module for both 2.3 and 2.4, doing a double
> build, but I wanted to avoid it.
>
> Victor
>
> At 21:20 12/11/2007, you wrote:
>> I guess it's a matter of priorities.
>> * With a .dmg, the python install is a very easy process.
>> * v2.4 is a marked improvement and in  learning python, and whilst
>> backwards compatibility is strong (deprecation is maintained),  it
>> will be often the case that the documentation, examples etc on the
>> web, including python.org use even non-esoteric features from 2.4
>> which would be more confusing to a novice.
>> * In using an API, there is a different 'balance' between the
>> wrapping environment and the library than there is between multiple
>> (insular) compilations. Ditto extending vs embedding.  To the extent
>> that an API is a 'break-out' technology, I predict trying to maintain
>> the 'broken-to' environ. will be a losing battle. Give up now! :-)
>> * I prefer to think of it as providing leadership rather than
>> imposing. For example, users who need to do computationally
>> challenging processing would soon turn to numpy.
>> * Active Python (http://www.activestate.com/Products/ 
>> activepython/? _x=1) is now shipping for v2.5.  I'll be looking at  
>> that over xmas.
>>
>>>> Would that be legal?
>> I'm not sure - you could ask the python-mac SIG list (pythonmac-  
>> sig@python.org). I think this issue has been addressed in the eggs.
>> (http://peak.telecommunity.com/DevCenter/PythonEggs ).
>>
>> If you want to continue to support v2.3, why not just have a
>> separate .dmg for it?  Perhaps I've missed something.
>>
>> David
>> On 11/11/2007, at 10:18 PM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>>
>>> yes 2.4. My problem is that until Apple does not
>>> move to 2.4, I have to keep supplying the 2.3
>>> module, as I cannot force people to install 2.4.
>>> A solution would be to add the MacPython installer
>>> to the package. Would that be legal?
>>
>>> Victor
>>>>
>>>> Yes, I realised after I'd sent the previous that it wasn't
>>>> (solvable).
>>>>
>>>>   my suggestion to those caught by this is to start to
>>>> experiment   with csnd.py in anticipation of  Matt
>>>> updatin. I would also recommend upgrading to Python 2.4
>>>> (at least)  - v2.3 is   really now in the dark ages.
>>>>
>>>> David
>>>> On 11/11/2007, at 8:16 PM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Not I don't think it's solvable. This is
>>>>> because the python interpreter is Intel and
>>>>> the module is PPC. The two don't agree. Rosetta
>>>>> won't help here because it works at the process
>>>>> level. If you ran a PPC interepreter, then it
>>>>> would work (but all the dependencies would have
>>>>> to be PPC as well). In fact that's the same
>>>>> thing that stops Matt's frontend working with
>>>>> Intel CsoundLib.
>>>>>
>>>>> Victor
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> yes .. Matt .... apologies. it was 5am ish!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> with PPC version installed, using Apple's python:
>>>>>>> drwIntel:~  drw$ /usr/bin/pythonPython 2.3.5 (#1, Jan
>>>> 13 >>> 2006,   20:13:11)
>>>>>>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>>>> darwin >>> ...
>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>>>   File
>>>> "/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>>> lib/python2.3/csnd.py", line 4, in ? >>>     import
>>>> _csnd >>> ImportError:
>>>>>>> dlopen(/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/
>>>>>> Versions/2.3/lib/python2.3/_csnd.so, 2): no suitable
>>>> image >>> found.    Did find:
>>>>>>>
>>>> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>> lib/python2.3/_csnd.so: mach-o, but wrong architecture
>>>>>>>> if you ignore and simply insist, it doesn't
>>>> complain: >>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>>> dir()
>>>>>>> ['__builtins__', '__doc__', '__file__', '__name__',
>>>>>>> 'csnd'] >>>
>>>>>> but it hasn't imported properly:
>>>>>>>>>> dir(csnd)
>>>>>>> ['__builtins__', '__doc__', '__file__', '__name__']
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Using python2.4:
>>>>>>> drwIntel:~ drw$ python
>>>>>>> Python 2.4.3 (#1, Mar 30 2006, 11:02:16)
>>>>>>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>>>> darwin >> ..
>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>>>   File
>>>> "/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.4/lib/
>>>>>>> python2.4/csnd.py", line 7, in ? ImportError: No
>>>> module >>> named _csnd >>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> and it complains no matter how many times you try to
>>>>>> import. This one might be solvable... perhaps its just
>>>> a >> naming convention?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> David
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 11/11/2007, at 6:07 AM, Victor Lazzarini wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> you probably mean Matt Ingalls, not Mike Gogins.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What is the problem by the way?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Victor
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've just re-tested and I can confirm that (on an
>>>> intel >>>> OSX) I have   the same problem when I use
>>>> Csound PPC. >> Mike >> has indicated in a   recent post on
>>>> the CS-Dev >> list that >> he will move macCsound to a
>>>> universal >> binary soon. In >> the mean-time, whenever  I
>>>> need the >> other   one, I simply >> install it from the
>>>> relevant .dmg >> over the top of the >> existing. And do
>>>> it again to switch >> back. Not very elegant >> but, hey,
>>>>  it works! >>>>
>>>>>>>> David
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 11/11/2007, at 1:24 AM, joachim heintz wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> No it's the same result with the -g option. Thanks
>>>>>>>>> anyway for the   idea. I think all the problems are
>>>>>>>>> raising because I am using the   Csound PPC version
>>>> on >>>>> an IntelMac, because formerly I worked such a
>>>> lot in >>>> MacCsound that it's hard to change all this
>>>> stuff to >> FLTK >>> widgets. You are using the MacIntel
>>>> version of >> Csound, >> right? >
>>>>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 23:57 schrieb David Worrall:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I can confirm that this eg works for me under
>>>>>>>>>> OSX 10.4.10
>>>>>>>>>> IDLE 1.1.3
>>>>>>>>>> Python 2.4.3.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> But I've found things quickly get stuffed up with
>>>> the >>>> graphic   >> output turned on.
>>>>>>>>>> Can you try it with the -g command line option?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> This tells me I should include a .csd with the
>>>>>> example >> description. >>
>>>>>>>>>> David
>>>>>>>>>> On 10/11/2007, at 8:53 AM, joachim heintz wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Well, but the task
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> is ok in MacPython 2.3 (IDLE 1.0). The csnd module
>>>>>> is >> found and   >>> can be loaded correctly.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> But when I go to the terminal and try the same in
>>>>>>>> /usr/bin/  >>> python2.3 I get:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Python 2.3.5 (#1, Jan 13 2006, 20:13:11)
>>>>>>>>>>> [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Computer, Inc. build 5250)] on
>>>>>>>> darwin >>> Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or
>>>>>>>> "license" for more   >>> information.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>>>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>>>>>>>   File "", line 1, in ?
>>>>>>>>>>>   File
>>>> "/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>>>>>>> lib/python2.3/csnd.py", line 7, in ? >>>>> >>
>>>> import _csnd >>>>> ImportError: >>>>
>>>> dlopen(/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/
>>>>>>>>>>> Versions/2.3/lib/python2.3/_csnd.so, 2): no >>
>>>> suitable image >>>>> found.  Did find: >>>>>>>
>>>> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.3/
>>>>>>>>>>> lib/python2.3/_csnd.so: mach-o, but wrong >>
>>>> architecture >>>>>>>> Is this because of the PPC version
>>>>>> (being on an >> IntelMac)? Why no   >>> problem with >>
>>>> MacPython/ IDLE? >>>>> >>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 22:14 schrieb Oeyvind Brandtsegg:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I think one should not run any halfway complex
>>>>>> stuff >> in IDLE. >>>> I do not remember the exact
>>>> reason >> why, >> neither the exact >>>> implications, but
>>>> it has to >> with >> IDLE itself being written in   >>>>
>>>> Python. >>>>>>>> This means we get one Python app running
>>>> on top of >>>> another and   >>>> it does
>>>>>>>>>>>> sometimes lead to unexpected results and strange
>>>>>>>> error messages. >>>> Repeat, do not run stuff in
>>>> IDLE. >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> best
>>>>>>>>>>>> Oeyvind
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 2007/11/9, Victor Lazzarini
>>>>>>>> : >>>>> The code is
>>>> correct. >> The >> -1 answer means that >>>>> probably the
>>>> CSD was not >> found >> or that other >>>>> problem
>>>> happened during the >>>> compilation. >>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -1 actually means an error. Also in OSX maybe
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the csound messages have been printed to the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> console (see it in utilities), not the terminal.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> (On Windows, if I run it from Idle, I also do
>>>>>>>>>>>>> not get any Csound messages)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Victor
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi David -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I find it very useful. But your example
>>>> "Playing >> an >>>>>>>> existing csd   file" doesn't work
>>>> on my system >>>> (MacPython >>>>>> 2.3, Csound PPC 5.07).
>>>> No   error >>>> messages, but it returns >>>>>> -1:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> import csnd
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cs = csnd.Csound()
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fname =
>>>> "/Users/jh/Documents/Csound/PythonInCsound/pythontest.csd"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cs.Perform(fname) >>>>>> -1 >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> When I first run main.py from Oeyvinds
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PartikkelCloudDesigner (it   stops at a certain
>>>>>>>> point, but >>>>>> after loading all the csnd stuff),
>>>>>> it's >>  ok (returns 0) >>>>>> and "test.aif" is
>>>> written >> in the >> directory of the >>>>>>
>>>> PartikkelCloudDesigner. >> So maybe >> there has to be one
>>>> or >>>>>> more other >> tasks before >> cs.Perform(fname)?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Best -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>     joachim
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Am 09.11.2007 um 13:33 schrieb David Worrall:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi All,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been finding my way around the python
>>>>>>>> wrappers for >>>>>>> csnd. In my   search I've come
>>>>>> across >> quite a few people >>>>>>> who have found the
>>>>>> process >> just too hard. So, bearing >>>>>>> in mind
>>>>>> thathis process >> is   likely to attract new users
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ,  I thought it >> would be good to begin   to
>>>> put >> a >>>>>> graduated >> introduction together. >
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've just scratched out a >> temporary
>>>> beginning, for the >>>>>>>>> moment at >>
>>>> http://www.avatar.com.au/sonify/csnd/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A
>>>> couple of things suggest themselves. >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Reference material
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Apart from some simple examples, it would  be
>>>>>> good >> to >>>>>>> merge the   output from help(csnd)
>>>> with >> the >> info in the >>>>>>> header files,
>>>> particularly >> csound.h >>>>>>>>> Has anyone written such
>>>> a script? It >> wouldn't be >> too >>>>>>> hard a hack
>>>> and then each >> version or compile >> options >>>>>>>
>>>> change, a reference >> could   be computed by >> the user
>>>>>>>>>> particular to >> their own system. > >>>>>>>>>
>>>> Examples >>>>>>>>>>> --------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From what I can see, the only example from the
>>>>>>>> examples >>>>>>> directory   in the sources that runs
>>>>>> on >> the default OSX >>>>>>> .dmg install of v5.7
>>>>>> without >> being modified is >>>>>>> Victor's vu.py (It
>>>>>> relies on >> TclSTk being   installed.) >>>>>>> tFair
>>>>>> enough - It is a >> "way in" I could put up a hacked
>>>>>>>>>>>>  down version (no >> graphics), just to
>>>> illustrate >> the use of >>>>>>> >>
>>>> CsoundPerformanceThread and >> SetChannel and proceed
>>>>>>>>>>>> that way ... > >>>>>>> >> I'm not sure if
>>>> people would find >> these type of things >>>>>>>>>
>>>> useful.   Perhaps you have >> other ideas. >> Feedback?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ciao, >>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> David
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group, >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> University of Canberra: >>>>>>>>
>>>>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ > >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>>>>>>>> University of Canberra:
>>>>>>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>>>>>> University of Canberra:
>>>>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>>>> University of Canberra:
>>>> creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/ >>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>>>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with
>>>>> body   "unsubscribe csound"
>>>>
>>>> _________________________________________________
>>>> experimental polymedia:    www.avatar.com.au
>>>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>>>> University of Canberra:     creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with
>>>> body "unsubscribe csound"
>>>
>>>
>>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>>> "unsubscribe csound"
>>
>> _________________________________________________
>> experimental polymedia: www.avatar.com.au
>> Sonic Communications Research Group,
>> University of Canberra: creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body  
>> "unsubscribe csound"
>
> Victor Lazzarini
> Music Technology Laboratory
> Music Department
> National University of Ireland, Maynooth
>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to this list.
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body  
> "unsubscribe csound"
>

_________________________________________________
experimental polymedia:	www.avatar.com.au
Sonic Communications Research Group,
University of Canberra:	 creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/