|
Here is an information from Vincet Puig (marketing director at Ircam) about
msp-MAX and FTS.
Feel free to contact him to other information ( puig@ircam.fr)
>Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:20:41 +0100
>To:csound@noether.ex.ac.uk
>From:puig@ircam.fr (Vincent Puig)
>Subject:IRCAM and MSP
>
>As you can read it on the copyright header of MSP :
>
>MSP is developed by David Zicarelli (C) and is using PD from Miller
>Puckette (Copyright the Regents of the University of California). It is
>based on ideas in FTS (copyright IRCAM). It runs with Max 3.5 (copyright
>IRCAM / Opcode Systems)
>
>This is for the legal stuff. Now some technical infos :
>
>1 - MSP is a set of external objects in Max 3.5.8 and more on the MacOS.
>
>More infos and download : www.ircam.fr/msp
>
>2 - FTS is the IRCAM Real-time DSP software engine first developped by
>Miller Puckette for the ISPW (Ircam/Ariel boards for the NeXT Cube) and
>now available on Silicon Graphics. To get it, subscribe to the Forum Ircam
>:
>
>www.ircam.fr/forum
>
>The current interface for FTS is Max (Ircam version for X-Windows).
>
>A new JAVA interface is coming in April. The complete environment is
>called jMax. It will run on SGI, Linux and Rhapsody (when Apple will make
>it available). Windows port will follow.
>
>3 - MSP is not working on top of FTS but it provides a compatility library
>allowing to transfer patches and applications one way and the other.
>
>
>
>Vincent Puig
>IRCAM
>1 place Igor Stravinsky
>75004 Paris
>France
>Tel: 01 44 78 49 59
>Fax: 01 44 78 15 40
>email : puig@ircam.fr
Mikhail
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa24210;
18 Mar 98 14:48 GMT
Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa14582;
18 Mar 98 14:48 GMT
Received: (qmail 18323 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 14:48:31 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 14:48:31 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (OAA18341); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:14:35 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 14:14:09 GMT
Received: from mail.infohouse.com [206.30.88.4] by hermes via ESMTP (OAA05162); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:13:49 GMT
Received: from [208.151.41.206] ([208.151.41.213])
by milhouse.infohouse.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO205e
ID# 141-39833U2500L250S0) with ESMTP id AAA178;
Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:12:29 -0500
X-Sender: ic11748@mail.infohouse.com
Message-Id:
In-Reply-To: <350F01D8.1E69C725@charlieb.com>
References: <199803180429.WAA11227@xochi.tezcat.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk, Qian Chen
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
From: tolve
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
Cc: Burton Alexandre ,
Piche Jean , Mike Berry ,
David Ziccarelli
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:12:29 -0500
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
bear with me, this turns into a wish list. programmers are invited to jump
in with corrections.
charles baker wrote:
>MSP is free, but requires MAX (lists for $499 or something like that....).
suppose things may have changed. price quoted on ziccarelli's site
(http://www.cycling74.com/ ) for MSP was something around $295 -and you
need to purchase max separately.
many moons ago Qian Chen asked:
>...Could someone explain to me the comparison of those languages...
in this i may have failed miserably, so allow me to take another whack at a
partial highly personal answer at assessment of interface. as i don't know
any of these programs well, i invite the programmers to jump in.
csound itself requires the typing of text. this can provide extreme power
but is least intuitive for control or auralization (another thread -please
suffer this word). but a supreme language should always allow this option.
and depending on your thoughts about artistic process, this may in fact be
your own idea of intuitive. not mine. and csound does midi.
cecilia, a graphic interface for csound adds many tools, including a
grapher, which allows you to *see* and alter the manner in which a sound
changes over time. my favorite. with this, you do have the option to select
your own parameters for control, write scripts, or tap the power of csound.
and it has additional midi capabilities. not sure about realtime *control*
on mac but yes on unix.
the max/msp combo offers excellent control via midi which, like it or not,
is a standard for live performance. it also sports a gui which has the
advantage of offering a clear picture of the order in which modules are
connected. as espoused in product literature, this is intuitive and great
for education purposes. realtime control. if i still don't know what i'm
doing in a few months and can scrape up the cash. $900 total? i'll buy it
and probably ignore the midi (not currently performing live).
grainwaves, a program less ambitious than the others, accomplishes a
wonderful thing. besides midi, you can perform a patch in realtime by
dragging a mouse over what i think of as square and rectangular graphs
which can be overlapped to affect multiple parameters *and* you can switch
to a graphic view, similar to that of msp, of a flow chart clearly
exhibiting connections. however you may not program within this view.
Now, until you guys get these damn brain implants to work properly (i'm
getting headaches), the ultimate program will allow for working with text,
graphs, flow charts, realtime performance, connection to wild and wackier
hardware controllers, *and* the ability to toggle between text, graphs &
flow charts to instantly exhibit these different representations of our
work, as we work.
and let's not forget painfully explicit manuals and tutorials.
no point in killing me, i'll only be replaced by another.
oh and let's maintain these tools, even after the implants.
that will probably keep you all busy long enough for me to learn what the
hell i'm doing.
thanks ever so much for the incredibly wonderful tools you have provided
thus far!!!
tolve
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25341;
18 Mar 98 16:04 GMT
Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa22077;
18 Mar 98 16:04 GMT
Received: (qmail 18806 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 16:04:34 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 16:04:34 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (PAA11569); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 15:13:45 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 15:13:19 GMT
Received: from root@xochi.tezcat.com [204.128.247.12] by hermes via ESMTP (PAA00576); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 15:13:10 GMT
Received: from [204.248.80.120] (antiorp.tezcat.com [204.248.80.120])
by xochi.tezcat.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/tezcat-96091001) with SMTP id JAA28497;
Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:13:05 -0600 (CST)
Message-Id: <199803181513.JAA28497@xochi.tezcat.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:18:52 -0600
To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
From: =cw4t7abs
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
Cc: cc@sukc.com
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
>the max/msp combo offers excellent control via midi which, like it or not,
>is a standard for live performance. it also sports a gui which has the
>advantage of offering a clear picture of the order in which modules are
>connected. as espoused in product literature, this is intuitive and great
>for education purposes. realtime control. if i still don't know what i'm
>doing in a few months and can scrape up the cash. $900 total? i'll buy it
>and probably ignore the midi (not currently performing live).
>grainwaves, a program less ambitious than the others, accomplishes a
>wonderful thing. besides midi, you can perform a patch in realtime by
>dragging a mouse over what i think of as square and rectangular graphs
>which can be overlapped to affect multiple parameters *and* you can switch
>to a graphic view, similar to that of msp, of a flow chart clearly
>exhibiting connections. however you may not program within this view.
max akompl!schez dze abov.
>Now, until you guys get these damn brain implants to work properly (i'm
>getting headaches), the ultimate program will allow for working with text,
>graphs, flow charts, realtime performance, connection to wild and wackier
>hardware controllers, *and* the ability to toggle between text, graphs &
>flow charts to instantly exhibit these different representations of our
>work, as we work.
>
>and let's not forget painfully explicit manuals and tutorials.
max + msp = painfully explicit manuals and tutorials.
+ max !limited 2 m!d! kontroL.
1 may wr!te kode.
1 may program addtL objektz.
var!ouz objektz alread+e ekx!zt wh!ch fac!l!tate
var!ouz[x2] methodz ov patch konztrukt!on.
+ human man!pulat!on.
max + mzp = $600 approx.
max k!kx. superkoll!der k!kx altzo.
cecilia k!kx altzo. zon!kverkx k!kx altzo.
soundhack k!kx altzo. grm k!kx altzo.
lasy k!kx altzo. lisa k!kx altzo. bigeye k!kx altzo.
metasynth k!kx altzo. imagine\ine k!kx altzo.
cubikosc!llator k!kx altzo. squiggy k!kx altzo.
c k!kx altzo. t3kknozukx.
bzzp.auz.
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa27057;
18 Mar 98 17:45 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa01479;
18 Mar 98 17:45 GMT
Received: (qmail 8872 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 17:45:46 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 17:45:46 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (RAA26957); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 17:27:21 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 17:27:01 GMT
Received: from dry3.jps.net [208.25.63.31] by hermes via ESMTP (RAA14815); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 17:26:46 GMT
Received: from gv.net.gv.net (istk-port753.jps.net [208.25.57.37])
by dry3.jps.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA07502;
Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:26:58 -0800 (PST)
Message-Id: <199803181726.JAA07502@dry3.jps.net>
Reply-To: nunativs@jps.net
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
From: Ken Locarnini
To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk, Qian Chen ,
tolve
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
Cc: Burton Alexandre ,
Piche Jean , Mike Berry ,
David Ziccarelli
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:18:15 -0800
X-Msmail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
tolve wrote,
> csound itself requires the typing of text. this can provide extreme power
> but is least intuitive for control or auralization (another thread
-please
> suffer this word). but a supreme language should always allow this
option.
> and depending on your thoughts about artistic process, this may in fact
be
> your own idea of intuitive. not mine. and csound does midi.
>
Very unintuitive for music yes but if you use a miidi convertor like
Midi2csound or Silence you can go back and forth between midi and score. I
find midi tools much more intuitive for writing music like using Cakewalk
then go into Csound for rendering the midi file and score manipulation. Of
course if my computor were fast enough I would probably use midi alone.
There are many good scoring tools that produce midi files that are easy to
use like FracMuse2(fractals), Key Kit etc. I am personally working on self
contained orcs with ftgen that directly respond to midi to eliminate the
translation process.
Can someone explain what the control difference between midi and score is?
Someone objected that there is not a fine enough degree of control, but I
don't understand.
Ken Locarnini
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa27063;
18 Mar 98 17:46 GMT
Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa01511;
18 Mar 98 17:46 GMT
Received: (qmail 19333 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 17:46:30 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 17:46:30 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (RAA06493); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 17:31:52 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 17:31:33 GMT
Received: from dry3.jps.net [208.25.63.31] by hermes via ESMTP (RAA26317); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 17:31:10 GMT
Received: from gv.net.gv.net (istk-port753.jps.net [208.25.57.37])
by dry3.jps.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA07902;
Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:28:19 -0800 (PST)
Message-Id: <199803181728.JAA07902@dry3.jps.net>
Reply-To: nunativs@jps.net
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
From: Ken Locarnini
To: Charles Baker ,
csound mailing list
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:26:50 -0800
X-Msmail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
> In addition to being available for SGI, WinNT/95 (Win32), and Linux,
> pd is free. $0, that is.
> MSP is free, but requires MAX (lists for $499 or something like
that....).
> Oh, and a powerPC Macintosh. (no Motorola68K...not fast enough...)
>
Where can one obtain pd?
Thanks ,
Ken Locarnini
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa27351;
18 Mar 98 18:08 GMT
Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa03509;
18 Mar 98 18:08 GMT
Received: (qmail 19442 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 18:08:27 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 18:08:27 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (RAA25095); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 17:57:36 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 17:57:17 GMT
Received: from vangogh.cnart.mx [200.15.13.202] by hermes via SMTP (RAA19722); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 17:57:07 GMT
Received: from vangogh.cnart.mx (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vangogh (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id KAA01146 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 10:58:23 -0800
Message-Id: <3510194E.41C6@correo.cnart.mx>
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 10:58:22 -0800
From: Armando Contreras
Organization: CMM
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04C-SGI (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22)
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: Csound mailing list
Subject: midi2csound
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Hello everybody!
I'm trying to get some csound scores trough the midi2csound converter.
The score I obtained got the p4 and p5 like velocity and midi note
numbers respectively. The question is: Is there any opcode, converter or
maybe a suggested mathematical operation I could use for converting
this values to: velocity to amplitude and midi notes to frequency and
then run csound?
By the way I'm using csound 3.47 on Unix Silicon Graphics,OS 6.2
Thanks in advance.
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa27505;
18 Mar 98 18:18 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa04395;
18 Mar 98 18:17 GMT
Received: (qmail 11905 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 18:17:52 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 18:17:52 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (SAA00157); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 18:10:24 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 18:09:50 GMT
Received: from vangogh.cnart.mx [200.15.13.202] by hermes via SMTP (SAA14599); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 18:09:40 GMT
Received: from vangogh.cnart.mx (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vangogh (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id LAA01541 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 11:59:40 -0800
Message-Id: <351027AB.41C6@correo.cnart.mx>
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 11:59:39 -0800
From: Armando Contreras
Organization: CMM
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04C-SGI (X11; I; IRIX 6.2 IP22)
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
Subject: midi2csound
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Hello everybody!
I'm trying to get some csound scores trough the midi2csound converter.
The score I obtained got the p4 and p5 like velocity and midi note
numbers respectively. The question is: Is there any opcode, converter or
maybe a suggested mathematical operation I could use for converting
this values to: velocity to amplitude and midi notes to frequency and
then run csound?
By the way I'm using csound 3.47 on Unix Silicon Graphics,OS 6.2
Thanks in advance.
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa27704;
18 Mar 98 18:34 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa05731;
18 Mar 98 18:34 GMT
Received: (qmail 13519 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 18:34:24 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 18:34:24 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (SAA11699); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 18:19:13 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 18:18:55 GMT
Received: from root@xochi.tezcat.com [204.128.247.12] by hermes via ESMTP (SAA18248); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 18:18:40 GMT
Received: from [204.248.80.120] (antiorp.tezcat.com [204.248.80.120])
by xochi.tezcat.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/tezcat-96091001) with SMTP id MAA03466
for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:18:45 -0600 (CST)
Message-Id: <199803181818.MAA03466@xochi.tezcat.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:24:30 -0600
To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
From: =cw4t7abs
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
>Where can one obtain pd?
ftp://crca-ftp.ucsd.edu/pub/msp/
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28053;
18 Mar 98 19:02 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa08110;
18 Mar 98 19:01 GMT
Received: (qmail 15621 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 19:01:52 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 19:01:52 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (SAA06664); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 18:52:39 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 18:52:00 GMT
Received: from jaguars-int.cableinet.net [193.38.113.9] by hermes via SMTP (SAA01297); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 18:51:50 GMT
Received: (qmail 3561 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 18:46:50 -0000
Received: from unknown (HELO cableinet.co.uk) (194.117.146.97)
by jaguars with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 18:46:50 -0000
Message-Id: <3510149B.19699212@cableinet.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 18:38:19 +0000
From: Richard Dobson
Reply-To: RWD@cableinet.co.uk
Organization: Composers Desktop Project
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I)
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: csound mailing list
Subject: Re: msp
References: <350F444D.844EE1DA@charlieb.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Charles Baker wrote:
> too damn many of these net sound formats...reminds me of the mess with
> audio formats.
> Perhaps some day industry will see a need for a standard, as they did
> with digital synth communication. Like, why did MS need "wav" files, an
> IFF style sound format, which varies basically only in header structure
> from aiff (which was already in use in several os's?)?
One possible reason - to avoid having to byte-swap data on the x86 platform.
The AIFF format is more 'flexible' ( = more easy to get it wrong, and
apparently quite a few products did get it wrong), and it allows format data
to appear after the sound data, making it unreliable for streaming.Still, I
sympathize. You might be interested in the SDIF initiative at CNMAT:
http://cnmat.CNMAT.Berkeley.EDU/SDIF/
- they are trying to define a new soundfile interchange format which is
64-bit ready, and which can
cover audio data, formant data, pvoc data, etc, in a streamable way. It is
~almost~ IFF-compatible, except for the alignment to 8-bye boundaries. I
think this initiative is well worth supporting, and that eventually Csound
should exploit it. It is still at quite an early stage of development, so
this is an opportunity for all interested parties to contribute to the
design of a file format which really meets our needs - well, the needs we
can predict!.
Richard Dobson
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28332;
18 Mar 98 19:22 GMT
Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa09934;
18 Mar 98 19:22 GMT
Received: (qmail 19750 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 19:22:27 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 19:22:27 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (TAA03779); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 19:16:53 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 19:16:32 GMT
Received: from mail.infohouse.com [206.30.88.4] by hermes via ESMTP (TAA18291); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 19:16:23 GMT
Received: from [208.151.41.199] by milhouse.infohouse.com
(Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO205e ID# 141-39833U2500L250S0)
with ESMTP id AAA174; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:15:09 -0500
X-Sender: ic11748@mail.infohouse.com
Message-Id:
In-Reply-To: <199803181728.JAA07902@dry3.jps.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: Ken Locarnini , csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
From: tolve
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:15:09 -0500
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Ken Locarnini asked:
>Where can one obtain pd?
charles baker wrote:
>>>
also , much newer, and still in beta: "pd"...max-like, msp-like, free.
ftp://crca-ftp.ucsd.edu/pub/msp
By MillerSPuckett
>>>
tolve
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28578;
18 Mar 98 19:36 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa11209;
18 Mar 98 19:36 GMT
Received: (qmail 18054 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 19:36:45 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 19:36:45 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (TAA10600); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 19:27:06 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 19:26:44 GMT
Received: from mb05.swip.net [193.12.122.209] by hermes via ESMTP (TAA22191); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 19:26:35 GMT
Received: from rasmus (dialup178-2-11.swipnet.se [130.244.178.75])
by mb05.swip.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP
id UAA26955 for ;
Wed, 18 Mar 1998 20:26:35 +0100 (MET)
Message-Id: <3510207E.34D7@hexagon.se>
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 20:29:02 +0100
From: rasmus ekman
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: Csound list
Subject: Re: midi/score difference?
References: <199803181726.JAA07502@dry3.jps.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Ken Locarnini wrote:
>
> Can someone explain what the control difference between midi and score is?
> Someone objected that there is not a fine enough degree of control,
> but I don't understand.
Midi events (controllers, velocity, aftertouch etc) use only 127 values.
This is good enough for many controlling tasks, but if you like to work
with direct values (say, controlling pitch), it doesn't quite cut it.
Csound score parameters can use very precise decimal numbers, so you
could
eg specify different tunings right in the score. You could certainly get
around most problems by designing your instruments accordingly (and also
by using the 14/21-bit inputs with Csound), so this is probably mostly a
question of style and taste in sound programming.
One problem with Midi which may be harder to get around is the maximum
density of events: You can have any number of csound score events per
second, but at most, er, er, 320 microseconds per serial byte times
three
bytes for most messages = *theoretical* maximum density is 1040 3-byte
events per second (these include Note-on/offs, controllers and
aftertouch).
Correct me if I'm wrong (probably am, this is just by a casual glance in
the v 1.0 spec).
Again, this would be a problem only for certain composition techniques.
But it quickly (prematurely) turned me away from the Atari + dual TX81
setup in the Sthlm Electr. studio some years ago.
Regards,
re
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa29254;
18 Mar 98 20:31 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa15846;
18 Mar 98 20:30 GMT
Received: (qmail 21743 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 20:31:03 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 20:31:03 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (UAA02338); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 20:24:25 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 20:23:50 GMT
Received: from howl.werewolf.net [206.103.224.20] by hermes via SMTP (UAA01618); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 20:23:41 GMT
Received: from hljmm by howl.werewolf.net via SMTP (950413.SGI.8.6.12/940406.SGI)
for id OAA16970; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:23:43 -0600
From: Hans Mikelson
To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
Subject: Re: midi2csound
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:23:45 -0600
Message-Id: <01bd52ab$c0349a40$30e167ce@hljmm>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-Msmail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3
X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Try:
iamp = ivel*250 ; Convert
Velocity to Amp
ipch = int(inn/12)+frac(inn/12)*12/100 ; Note Number to pitch
ifqc = cpspch(ipch) ; Pitch to Freq
Good Luck,
Hans Mikelson
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa00514;
18 Mar 98 22:07 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa23908;
18 Mar 98 22:06 GMT
Received: (qmail 28620 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 22:06:53 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 22:06:53 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (WAA14208); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 22:03:08 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 22:02:49 GMT
Received: from portal.dx.net [199.190.65.2] by hermes via ESMTP (WAA14688); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 22:02:39 GMT
Received: from nmol.com ([206.162.11.2])
by portal.dx.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA23029
for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 17:04:08 -0500 (EST)
X-Routed: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 15:08:06 -0500
Received: from nmol.com [144.91.133.90] by nmol.com with smtp
id APAGDLCI ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 15:07:00 -0500
Message-Id: <35104624.D502807C@nmol.com>
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 15:09:41 -0700
From: Mike Berry
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 (Macintosh; I; PPC)
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: tolve
Cc: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk, Qian Chen ,
Burton Alexandre ,
Piche Jean , David Ziccarelli
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
References: <199803180429.WAA11227@xochi.tezcat.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Just a mention here. I am presently adding text programming to GrainWave, so
that you will be able to work side by side in graphics and text. I also have
plans to extend beyond midi for control data, probably to CNMAT's Open Sound Control.
--
Mike Berry
mikeb@nmol.com
http://www.nmol.com/users/mikeb
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa00816;
18 Mar 98 22:29 GMT
Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25734;
18 Mar 98 22:28 GMT
Received: (qmail 20480 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 22:29:01 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 22:29:01 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (WAA12987); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 22:23:04 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 22:22:47 GMT
Received: from endeavor.flash.net [209.30.0.40] by hermes via ESMTP (WAA01954); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 22:22:40 GMT
Received: from flash.net (fwasc31-29.flash.net [209.30.58.29])
by endeavor.flash.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA27851
for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 16:22:46 -0600 (CST)
Message-Id: <3510493D.B7A0BD69@flash.net>
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 16:22:53 -0600
From: pete moss
Organization: pete moss GmbH
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I)
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: csound
Subject: oblique strategies
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
sorry to spam up the list with personal stuff, but i think some of you
might like to know this.
awhile back i wrote a program that simulates a deck of the oblique
strategies by brian eno. these cards are intended as an aid to
composition. recently i made a better version of the program.
check it out at http://www.flash.net/~kaeru/oblique.zip
it might give you new ideas in composition. sorry it is for win95 only.
pete
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa01728;
18 Mar 98 23:47 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa02068;
18 Mar 98 23:47 GMT
Received: (qmail 4879 invoked from network); 18 Mar 1998 23:47:43 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 Mar 1998 23:47:43 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (XAA01011); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 23:39:54 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Mar 98 23:39:37 GMT
Received: from mail.club-internet.fr [194.158.96.21] by hermes via ESMTP (XAA19148); Wed, 18 Mar 1998 23:39:22 GMT
Received: from club-internet.fr (ppp-109-181.villette.club-internet.fr [194.158.109.181])
by mail.club-internet.fr (8.8.8/MGC-970630-No_Relay) with ESMTP id AAA02475
for ; Thu, 19 Mar 1998 00:38:53 +0100 (MET)
Message-Id: <351068F1.975CC685@club-internet.fr>
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 00:38:12 +0000
From: Jean-Michel DARREMONT
Reply-To: jmdbrady@club-internet.fr
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 (Macintosh; I; PPC)
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: Csound
Subject: Re: Bell recordings
References:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
David Boothe wrote:
> Concerning your request to the csound list, have you looked at
> commercial sound effects recordings? While not inexpensive, they do have
> the advantage of being copyright cleared. And most of the later ones are
> very well recorded.
>
> I looked through the sound effects libraries we have here (about 250
> discs). Most of the bell recordings do not identify the location, other
> than occasionally a country of origin. However, The Hollywood Edge (7060
> Hollywood Boulevard, Suite #1120, Hollywood, California 90028 USA), has
> a library called "European Edition" which lists recordings of St. Peters
> and St. Havels, both in Prague, Big Ben in London as well as several
> others, unidentified. All are on Disc 11.
>
> Of course one problem, is that there are seldom single notes. At best,
> the recordings are of one bell tolling several times. But of course,
> then you have one strike occurring before the previous one has decayed
> completely. I don't know if that would be a problem for analysis or not.
> I assume you are using hetro/adsyn?
Actually I use Audiosculpt for analysis and Csound or Modalys for
resynthesis.
Audiosculpt is a phase vocoder and Modalys a physical modeling language,
both from Ircam.
Modalys can use resonance models, made by analysis.
I never used hetro/adsyn but I will do it soon.
Thank you for your help.
--
Jean-Michel DARREMONT
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa02306;
19 Mar 98 0:37 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa06591;
19 Mar 98 0:36 GMT
Received: (qmail 8003 invoked from network); 19 Mar 1998 00:37:20 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 19 Mar 1998 00:37:20 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (AAA27060); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 00:34:36 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Thu, 19 Mar 98 00:34:19 GMT
Received: from root@westnet.com [206.24.6.2] by hermes via ESMTP (AAA19796); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 00:34:12 GMT
Received: from goodguy (port2.ts2.westnet.com [206.28.203.2])
by westnet.com (8.8.6/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA13734;
Wed, 18 Mar 1998 19:34:12 -0500 (EST)
Message-Id: <35107207.4183D868@westnet.com>
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 01:16:55 +0000
From: Larry Troxler
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (X11; I; Linux 2.0.31 i586)
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: tolve
Cc: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
References:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
tolve wrote:
>
> Larry Troxler wrote:
>
> >...Of course, if PD gets fleshed out a bit more, than Max is history :-)...
>
> intriguing. why?
>
> tolve
Well, because it's free, I guess. But when I wrote that, I neglected to
remember one detail - I don't think PD runs on a Mac.
Conversely, though, Max AFAIK won't run on Intel, whereas PD does.
Regardless, I think now that my pronouncement was a bit of an
overstatement.
Larry
-- Larry Troxler -- lt@westnet.com -- Patterson, NY USA --
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa03786;
19 Mar 98 2:43 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa16624;
19 Mar 98 2:43 GMT
Received: (qmail 12745 invoked from network); 19 Mar 1998 02:43:23 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 19 Mar 1998 02:43:23 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (CAA05218); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 02:39:53 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Thu, 19 Mar 98 02:39:34 GMT
Received: from root@proxy4.ba.best.com [206.184.139.15] by hermes via ESMTP (CAA20224); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 02:39:27 GMT
Received: from charlieb.com (baker@baker.vip.best.com [206.86.232.121]) by proxy4.ba.best.com (8.8.8/8.8.BEST) with ESMTP id SAA10053 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 18:37:43 -0800 (PST)
Message-Id: <35101450.E32354B@charlieb.com>
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 18:37:04 +0000
From: Charles Baker
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.32 i586)
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: csound mailing list
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
References: <199803181726.JAA07502@dry3.jps.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Ken Locarnini wrote:
> Very unintuitive for music yes but if you use a miidi convertor like
> Midi2csound or Silence you can go back and forth between midi and score. I
> find midi tools much more intuitive for writing music like using Cakewalk
> then go into Csound for rendering the midi file and score manipulation. Of
> course if my computor were fast enough I would probably use midi alone.
> There are many good scoring tools that produce midi files that are easy to
> use like FracMuse2(fractals), Key Kit etc. I am personally working on self
> contained orcs with ftgen that directly respond to midi to eliminate the
> translation process.
> Can someone explain what the control difference between midi and score is?
> Someone objected that there is not a fine enough degree of control, but I
> don't understand.
> Ken Locarnini
If one programs control of all parameters required for the generation of a sound
into your csound
instrument itself except duration, pitch and volume, standard MIDI is useful for
controlling that
instrument. If you map a MIDI controller to a instrument parameter, then you can have
a little more
control, but at the cost of increased difficulty of MIDI editing and real-time MIDI
control (gotta
make sure your MIDI controller will out put an appropriate controller value, even
when it isn't
currently being "controlled"...trivial, I know, and I have no problem with this
approach,
EXCEPT: when one "locks down" parameters such as envelope attack/decay times, depth
of pitch
deviation ("vibrato" or "jitter"...), vibrato,rates, etc.,etc., by hard coding them
into the instrument, or
by having simplistic control logic in the instrument (such as "keyboard maps"),
then you go far towards proving the "anti-synth" musicians right: these instruments
*do* sound
"canned", "boring", uninteresting, in a word.
I'm not saying taking the trouble to provide MIDI controller mapping or fancy
instrument-internal
control logic is *bad*, but I find the most exciting approach is to treat a csound
score like a
sonic sculpture...I leave as many control parameters in the note list as possible,
then use programs
to massage and vary the note list .... lotsa advantages: one can use these note lists
as "compositional motives", and copy and massage them to produce a related but
excitingly different
version of the "motive".
As Example "e.g": take a note list, scale durations by 1.5, start times by 1.45,
double envelope
attack times, and adjust carrier mod ratios ( which are already slightly wandering
around by earlier
editing with small random deviations: "wow, what a colorful instrument"!) by scaling
them by .99,
and drop the pitch slightly less than an octave, and increase volume to global reverb
feed :
hey, a whole new dark take on the earlier "series of sounds" !! (melody?))....
all impossible if you rely on having all these things controlled in the instrument.
I'm really thinking there is a lack of talk about note list/score editing, in our
excited rush to MIDIfy,
now that home computers have the cycles to do simple realtime synthesis. I know of
very few
software synthesis works which are widely acknowledged to be
great/interesting/fascinating that
are purely controlled by MIDI level control (note,rhythm,amplitude, one/two
continuous functions).
They almost all have interestingly controlled note lists, that is note lists that are
not at all mappable to MIDI.
Add to that the fact that MIDI allows 128 distinct values for most parameters, and
the smallest
control values in a software synth language usually have 65536 different values, and
most of them
have even finer degrees of control, (using floating point values), and you might see
the
inadequacy of the MIDI paradigm for software synthesis.
If you think that way, as do many , go ahead and write at the keyboard to begin, or
in standard
notation....no problem! But try to go a step further with the results: edit in all
sorts of fancy fine
control of :
-- dynamics (are you *that* controlled a keyboard player,? or do you *really* want
that phrase all the same volume?)
-- envelopes (please, a wind instrumentalist spends a lifetime controlling the
attack /decay times
of their instrument...why then should you offend their ears with with *exactly* the
same attack
time for every range and dynamic?)
-- every parameter! go ahead, vary that FOF window time!!! It's *so* cool!
And much better music.
Again, gone on too long,
Pax,
Char lieB
*********************************************
Charlie Baker baker@charlieb.com
"when everything isn't roses, you don't get
any headroom" - Thomas Dolby "New Toy"
*********************************************
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa04298;
19 Mar 98 3:22 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa23748;
19 Mar 98 3:21 GMT
Received: (qmail 13994 invoked from network); 19 Mar 1998 03:21:46 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 19 Mar 1998 03:21:46 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (DAA24725); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 03:18:50 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Thu, 19 Mar 98 03:18:20 GMT
Received: from howl.werewolf.net [206.103.224.20] by hermes via SMTP (DAA26371); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 03:18:07 GMT
Received: from hljmm by howl.werewolf.net via SMTP (950413.SGI.8.6.12/940406.SGI)
for id VAA07492; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 21:18:10 -0600
From: Hans Mikelson
To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
Subject: Real Time Csound orc/sco's
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 21:18:11 -0600
Message-Id: <01bd52e5$a5d91e20$38e167ce@hljmm>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-Msmail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3
X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Hello,
I got a new computer and have started playing with Gabriel Maldonado's
version of Csound. Here are a couple examples of real-time instruments
which I found fun. I play these from a midi keyboard with an expression
pedal, mod wheel and CC knobs.
Good Luck,
Hans Mikelson
; Orchestra
;----------------------------------------------
; Real Time Midi Controlled Csound
; by Hans Mikelson March 1998
; Tested with Maldonado's Csound on a 300 MHz Pentium II
; I use the following one line batch file csm.bat:
; csound -Msbmidi -odevaudio -b512 -p2 %1.orc %1.sco
; Called as follows for rtime.orc & rtime.sco:
; csm rtime
;----------------------------------------------
sr=44100
kr=4410
ksmps=10
nchnls=2
;-----------------------------------------------------------
; Simple sine
;-----------------------------------------------------------
instr 1
iwave = 1 ; Sine
inn notnum ; Input Note Number
iamp veloc ; Velocity
iamp = iamp*150 ; Convert to Amp
ipch = int(inn/12)+frac(inn/12)*12/100 ; NN to pitch
ifqc = cpspch(ipch) ; Pitch to Freq
; Amp Rise, Dec, AtDec
kamp linenr iamp, .05, .05, .05 ; Declick envelope
aout oscil 1, ifqc, iwave ; Oscillator
outs aout*kamp, aout*kamp ; Output
endin
;---------------------------------------------
; Combo Organ
;---------------------------------------------
instr 2
ifund cpsmidi ; Get the frequency of note num
iamp ampmidi 5000 ; Get amplitude and scale 0-5000
ifund1 init ifund*.5 ; Lower an octave
inh1 init sr/2/ifund1 ; Find maximum frequency
idtim1 init 1/ifund1/2 ; Delay time 1/2 wavelength
ifund2 init ifund1*2 ; 2nd Harmonic
inh2 init sr/2/ifund2 ; Avoid aliasing
idtim2 init 1/ifund2/2 ; Delay 1/2 wavelength
ifund3 init ifund2*3 ; 3rd Harmonic
inh3 init sr/2/ifund3 ; Avoid aliasing
idtim3 init 1/ifund3/2 ; Delay 1/2 wavelength
ifund4 init ifund3*4 ; 4th Harmonic
inh4 init sr/2/ifund4 ; Avoid aliasing
idtim4 init 1/ifund4/2 ; Delay 1/2 wavelength
kfco midictrl 3 ; read filter cut-off
kfco = kfco*100+500 ; Adjust filter cut-off
; I usually use an expression pedal for freq cut-off.
; Pedal is assigned to CC#3.
; Amp Rise, Dec, AtDec
kamp linenr iamp, .01, .01, .01 ; Declick
kvibamp midictrl 1 ; Vibrato from Mod Wheel
kvib1 oscil .0002, 6, 1 ; Vibrato
kvib = (1+kvib1*kvibamp) ; Adjust depth
; I use 4 knobs assigned to midi CC#'s 2, 64, 7 and 3
;
kamp1 midictrl 2, 120 ; Read the controllers
kamp2 midictrl 64, 50 ; and initial settings.
kamp3 midictrl 7, 0
kamp4 midictrl 4, 0
kamp1 = kamp1/127 ; Normalize 0-1
kamp2 = kamp2/127
kamp3 = kamp3/127
kamp4 = kamp4/127
; Amp Frequency # Harm Wave
apuls1 buzz kamp1, ifund1*kvib, inh1, 1
apuls2 delay apuls1, idtim1 ; Delay 1/2 wavelength
apuls3 buzz kamp2, ifund2*kvib, inh2, 1
apuls4 delay apuls3, idtim2
apuls5 buzz kamp3, ifund3*kvib, inh3, 1
apuls6 delay apuls5, idtim3
apuls7 buzz kamp4, ifund4*kvib, inh4, 1
apuls8 delay apuls7, idtim4
; Integrate the signals. A pulse - delayed pulse gives a square wave.
; In this case there are four.
asquare integ apuls1+apuls3+apuls5+apuls7-apuls2-apuls4-apuls6-apuls8
aout tone asquare*kamp, kfco ; Low-pass filter & scale the result
outs aout, aout
endin
;---------------------------------------------
; Analog Synthesizer PWM
;---------------------------------------------
instr 3
ifund1 cpsmidi ; Get fqc from NN
iamp ampmidi 10000 ; Get amp 0-10000
inh1 init sr/2/ifund1 ; # harmonics
idtim1 init 500/ifund1 ; Delay time (vdelay is in msec.)
kfco midictrl 3 ; Filter cut-off (pedal)
kfco = kfco+10 ; Filter freq is not in Hz
; Amp Rise, Dec, AtDec
kamp linenr iamp, .01, .01, .01 ; Declick
kvibamp midictrl 1 ; Vibrato
kvib1 oscil .0002, 6, 1
kvib = (1+kvib1*kvibamp)
krez midictrl 2, 10 ; Resonance knob
krez = krez/10
kpwmrt midictrl 64, 120 ; PWM Rate knob
kpwmrt = kpwmrt*ifund1/5000
kpwmd midictrl 7, 50 ; PWM Depth knob
kpwm1 oscil kpwmd/260, kpwmrt, 1 ; PWM oscillator
kpwm1 = idtim1*(kpwm1+.5) ; Modulate high pitches faster
apuls1 buzz 1, ifund1*kvib, inh1, 1 ; Sound sorce
apuls2 vdelay apuls1, kpwm1, idtim1 ; Vary pulse width
asquare integ apuls1-apuls2 ; Square wave
aout lpres asquare*kamp, kfco, krez ; Resonant filter
outs aout, aout
endin
;---------------------------------------------
; Analog Synthesizer Saw
;---------------------------------------------
instr 4
ifund1 cpsmidi ; Get frequency
ifund1 = ifund1*.5 ; Lower an octave
iamp ampmidi 4000 ; Get amp 0-4000
inh1 init sr/2/ifund1 ; Max fqc below Nyquist
kfco midictrl 3 ; Filter cut-off fqc (pedal)
kfco = kfco*1.5+5
krez midictrl 2, 10 ; Resonance knob
krez = krez/5
kdetun1 midictrl 64 ; Detune Osc 2 knob
kdetun1 = (1-kdetun1/5000)
kdetun2 midictrl 7
kdetun2 = (1-kdetun2/5000) ; Detune Osc 3 knob
; Amp Rise, Dec, AtDec
kamp linenr iamp, .01, .01, .01 ; Declick
kvibamp midictrl 1 ; Vibrato Mod Wheel
kvib1 oscil .0002, 6, 1 ; Vibraot Oscilator
kvib = (1+kvib1*kvibamp)
kfenv linseg 1, .1, 2, .2, .7, .01, .7 ; Filter Accent envelope
apuls1 buzz 1, ifund1*kvib, inh1, 1 ; Fundamental
apuls2 buzz 1, ifund1*kvib*kdetun1, inh1, 1 ; Detune 1 Osc
apuls3 buzz 1, ifund1*kvib*kdetun2, inh1, 1 ; Detune 2 Osc
asaw integ apuls1+apuls2+apuls3
aout lpres (asaw-1.5)*kamp, kfco*kfenv, krez ; Center wave and filter
outs aout, aout
endin
; SCORE
;----------------------------------------------
; Real Time Midi Controlled Csound
; Tested with Maldonado's Csound
;----------------------------------------------
f0 60 ; Runs for 60 seconds
f1 0 65536 10 1 ; Sine
f27 0 128 5 1 128 8 ; Amp scale (not used)
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa04815;
19 Mar 98 4:07 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa27357;
19 Mar 98 4:06 GMT
Received: (qmail 15367 invoked from network); 19 Mar 1998 04:07:08 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 19 Mar 1998 04:07:08 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (EAA15573); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 04:04:27 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Thu, 19 Mar 98 04:04:10 GMT
Received: from dry3.jps.net [208.25.63.31] by hermes via ESMTP (EAA27048); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 04:04:03 GMT
Received: from gv.net.gv.net (istk-port1987.jps.net [208.25.50.10])
by dry3.jps.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA26458;
Wed, 18 Mar 1998 20:04:46 -0800 (PST)
Message-Id: <199803190404.UAA26458@dry3.jps.net>
Reply-To: nunativs@jps.net
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
From: Ken Locarnini
To: Charles Baker ,
csound mailing list
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 19:56:50 -0800
X-Msmail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
.....
> And much better music.
>
> Again, gone on too long,
> Pax,
> Char lieB
> *********************************************
> Charlie Baker baker@charlieb.com
> "when everything isn't roses, you don't get
> any headroom" - Thomas Dolby "New Toy"
> *********************************************
Charles,
Thank you very much. As of late I am just starting to get serious with
these tools and am trying to map out where I would like to go with them.
This is the kind of info a newbie like me is looking for. Thanks for your
time, you answered many questions I was unclear about and didn't want to
flood the list with. BTW, this is a very helpfull group we have here.
Thank all.....
Ken Locarnini
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa04937;
19 Mar 98 4:17 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28233;
19 Mar 98 4:16 GMT
Received: (qmail 15658 invoked from network); 19 Mar 1998 04:17:00 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 19 Mar 1998 04:17:00 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (EAA08140); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 04:14:03 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Thu, 19 Mar 98 04:13:45 GMT
Received: from mail.infohouse.com [206.30.88.4] by hermes via ESMTP (EAA24094); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 04:13:38 GMT
Received: from [208.151.41.206] by milhouse.infohouse.com
(Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO205e ID# 141-39833U2500L250S0)
with ESMTP id AAA212; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 23:12:25 -0500
X-Sender: ic11748@mail.infohouse.com
Message-Id:
In-Reply-To: <35101450.E32354B@charlieb.com>
References: <199803181726.JAA07502@dry3.jps.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: Charles Baker , csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
From: tolve
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
Cc: Paul Ellis , Dan Phillips
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 23:12:25 -0500
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Charles Baker wrote an inspiring call to arms for synthesists:
> -- envelopes (please, a wind instrumentalist spends a lifetime
>controlling the
>attack /decay times
>of their instrument...why then should you offend their ears with with
>*exactly* the
>same attack
>time for every range and dynamic?)
> -- every parameter! go ahead, vary that FOF window time!!! It's *so* cool!
>And much better music.
don't remember if i previously bored the list with this war story. but
around 1977 i spent a few days on a Lyricon.
a wind player, i was majoring in the saxophone at the time. poor but
interested in those exorbitantly expensive devices at school (a buchla
among other things), i rejected them as completely impractical. with no
money, synthesis just didn't seem a realistic avenue for expression. and
those horrible punch cards. forget about computers. and math without
purpose was boring.
but the Lyricon was surprisingly expressive and beautifully designed
-instantly comfortable. in fact i felt that it was, from the standpoint of
an interface for fingers, superior to any wind instrument i had ever
handled, including clarinet, oboe, flute and certainly the brass
instruments (although trombone does have that portamento stuff down cold).
and the keys had multiple uses: hit a side key and the pitch is raised half
a step. but none of those saxophonic multiphonics, the control of the sound
through its mouthpiece needed work and its synthesis capabilities were
limited. nuances of dynamics and timbre were just not adequately
executable. i thought to myself, just give it a few years and this is what
i'll be playing.
well i did and the Lyricon was replaced with those newfangled midi wind
synthesizer controllers. although i'm sure the designers were necessarily
brilliant, i felt the instruments were far inferior to the Lyricon! reading
up on it, i learned that the culprit was midi. don't know if that
assessment was completely fair but hey, even hated the way the instruments
felt. keys not as well laid out, and something uncomfortable about that
oblong shape adapted to facilitate mounting of the electronics inside. a
few years later, maybe 86, i tried again. no cigar.
now i still need money, but it sure as hell is about time to upgrade the
standard, make available a new generation of wild and wooley controllers,
and exactly copy the exterior of the Lyricon.
tolve
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa05108;
19 Mar 98 4:34 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa29802;
19 Mar 98 4:34 GMT
Received: (qmail 16169 invoked from network); 19 Mar 1998 04:34:41 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 19 Mar 1998 04:34:41 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (EAA04326); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 04:31:31 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Thu, 19 Mar 98 04:31:13 GMT
Received: from dry3.jps.net [208.25.63.31] by hermes via ESMTP (EAA13318); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 04:31:06 GMT
Received: from gv.net.gv.net (istk-port1987.jps.net [208.25.50.10])
by dry3.jps.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA03900;
Wed, 18 Mar 1998 20:31:40 -0800 (PST)
Message-Id: <199803190431.UAA03900@dry3.jps.net>
Reply-To: nunativs@jps.net
MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at UK.AC.Bath.maths.stork
From: Ken Locarnini
To: rasmus ekman ,
Csound list
Subject: Re: midi/score difference?
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 20:30:00 -0800
X-Msmail-Priority: Normal
X-Priority: 3
X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
> Ken Locarnini wrote:
> >
> > Can someone explain what the control difference between midi and
score is?
> > Someone objected that there is not a fine enough degree of control,
> > but I don't understand.
>
> Midi events (controllers, velocity, aftertouch etc) use only 127 values.
> This is good enough for many controlling tasks, but if you like to work
> with direct values (say, controlling pitch), it doesn't quite cut it.
> Csound score parameters can use very precise decimal numbers, so you
> could
What RPN & NRPN. Do these allow finer control or just more messages sent
in a control period?
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa08111;
19 Mar 98 8:49 GMT
Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa20242;
19 Mar 98 8:48 GMT
Received: (qmail 22763 invoked from network); 19 Mar 1998 08:49:08 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 19 Mar 1998 08:49:08 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (IAA11027); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 08:43:52 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Thu, 19 Mar 98 08:43:21 GMT
Received: from root@proxy4.ba.best.com [206.184.139.15] by hermes via ESMTP (IAA06833); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 08:43:12 GMT
Received: from charlieb.com (baker@baker.vip.best.com [206.86.232.121]) by proxy4.ba.best.com (8.8.8/8.8.BEST) with ESMTP id AAA28743; Thu, 19 Mar 1998 00:42:04 -0800 (PST)
Message-Id: <351069B5.881B40CA@charlieb.com>
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 00:41:25 +0000
From: Charles Baker
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.0.32 i586)
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: RWD@cableinet.co.uk, csound mailing list
Subject: Re: msp
References: <350F444D.844EE1DA@charlieb.com> <3510149B.19699212@cableinet.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Richard Dobson wrote:
> You might be interested in the SDIF initiative at CNMAT:
> http://cnmat.CNMAT.Berkeley.EDU/SDIF/
>
>
Great project: the "music industry" (such as it is)will have to put moneybehind
it for it to be adopted / implemented in any large way (certainly the
technology is exciting to us...)
But, I worry a lot (as I gather others here have) about the ubiquitous nature
of these compressed audio streams...I mean MPEG, I mean the new film
audioformats, etc. These are wonderfuly engineered maintainers of the
original signals' timbre & tonal balance, generally, but phase information is
completely lost!!! I *love* the clear sharp audiofile 'image' that one gets
from phase coherent projection of midrange tones. You can get
those experiences regularly with skillful electronic synthesis/mixing,
and two speakers or headphones can be a wonderful surround sound experience...
with true "depth"!
one much more convincing than the purely volume/production direction
effects of the large movie house . Think about it: AC-3 standard *needs* 5
speakers for surround sound...it just plays a sound of some volume from
some direction...it's a strange diffuse sound image: the illusion of the crash
from behind emerging from another aural universe.
Ah, me, I'm just rambling on because I don't want to be a software geek
anymore. I wanna play trumpet. I want to write music.& my mom is very sick.
And I think my hometown university (Florida State U School of Music) will pass
me up for their new computer music teaching slot, like so many before.
So I'll stay here in a boring damn hack job. Wah.
And I have to go to bed now, no more music for today. Snif.
Take Care, all.
Char lieB
--
*********************************************
Charlie Baker baker@charlieb.com
"when everything isn't roses, you don't get
any headroom" - Thomas Dolby "New Toy"
*********************************************
Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa09078;
19 Mar 98 10:03 GMT
Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26793;
19 Mar 98 10:02 GMT
Received: (qmail 1593 invoked from network); 19 Mar 1998 10:03:17 -0000
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14)
by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 19 Mar 1998 10:03:17 -0000
Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (JAA18294); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 09:51:42 GMT
Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Thu, 19 Mar 98 09:51:22 GMT
Received: from jaguars-int.cableinet.net [193.38.113.9] by hermes via SMTP (JAA26929); Thu, 19 Mar 1998 09:51:15 GMT
Received: (qmail 21876 invoked from network); 19 Mar 1998 09:46:12 -0000
Received: from unknown (HELO cableinet.co.uk) (194.117.146.95)
by jaguars with SMTP; 19 Mar 1998 09:46:12 -0000
Message-Id: <3510E75B.351287E2@cableinet.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 09:37:31 +0000
From: Richard Dobson
Reply-To: RWD@cableinet.co.uk
Organization: Composers Desktop Project
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I)
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: tolve
Cc: Charles Baker , csound@maths.ex.ac.uk,
csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
Subject: Re: sound synthesis languages?
References: <199803181726.JAA07502@dry3.jps.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk
Precedence: bulk
Does anyone know if ZIPI is still being developed, or has it sunk without trace?
It seemed to me that it overcame most of the limitations of MIDI. If it is at all
alive, we should urge the Analog people to add support for it to Extended Csound,
which might just help get it established.
BTW, I am a flute-flayer, and much as I am interested in wind controllers, I
probably won't give up the flute - you get to ~feel~ the air much more with a
flute, and with plain bamboo and wooden flutes it is possible to use all sorts of
tricks such as fingered vibrato, slides, half-holing and so on - I can't imagine a
wind controller of any design could really match that! Wind controllers are new
instruments, with their own strengths, but they cannot ~replace~ quixotic physical
instruments of metal, cane, wood and goldbeater-skin.
Richard Dobson
tolve wrote:
[snip]
>
>
> now i still need money, but it sure as hell is about time to upgrade the
> standard, make available a new generation of wild and wooley controllers,
> and exactly copy the exterior of the Lyricon.
>
> tolve
|