| I can't seem to find the Windows CSound tool I used before, it had two
built in edit windows and would send the command string to CSound. I've
checked the several URLs from the FAQs and searched AltaVista etc. But...
being as how I can't remember the name of the program I'm not having much
luck.
I've already downloaded CSounder, VisOrc and a couple other things which
were not it, perhaps it has been removed from distribution. Anyone know the
one I mean and where it might be found?
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From: Eric Scheirer
To: Richard Dobson ,
Csound List
Subject: Re: if.../ Common Lisp Music / compilers / interpreters
Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 08:31:52 -0500
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>As far as optimizing goes, it looks as if quite a lot could be
>translated almost verbatim from Csound. To cite one example I happen to
>have noticed - in saolc 'buzz' is implemented by directly calculating
>every partial in a loop, using cos(). Csound uses the closed-form
>formula (and a table), which is ovbiously much more efficient.
Agreed. Many of the inefficients in saolc are there so that
the code looks like the text of the standard -- the standard
says 'buzz' is a sum of cosines, so the reference software
implements it by summing up cosines. I think this is an
advantage to people from non-computer-music backgrounds whose
first exposure to a synth engine is saolc.
>So there is arguably a useful degree of overlap of interests between
>programmers/users of Csound and saolc. For composers working alone, on a
>single workstation, speed and range of facilities are likely to be far
>more important than portability under the terms of MPEG-4, so that I can
>see two semi-independent streams of development arising - the
>'canonical' source under the remit of MP4, which naturally needs to be
>carefully (and presumably centrally) managed, and a much more
>distributed ad-lib development for composers along the lines of Csound.
I agree with this entirely. And the standard is fixed, so
everyone will know what is the common denominator for making
portable instruments, and it goes up to each composer to
decide whether they care about speed more than portability.
Not unlike programming in other languages.
>I am myself interested in working on saolc (partly because it will also
>be relevant to CDP users - especially the imminent enhancements!), on
>optimizing, adding support for WAVE and WAVE_EX, and no doubt some WIN32
>specific things.
I forgot to include WIN32 on my list of platforms before (because
that's where I'm developing it these days, so it doesn't need to
be "ported".) There's no WIN32-ish features, just command line
interface, but it runs fine.
>Presumably there are dedicated saolc lists, so the question (apart from:
>what are those lists?) is to what extent discussion of saolc is welcome
>on this list, or is it too much of a digression off-topic?
I don't know. I'd welcome a judgment by Bath, so at least I know
whether to feel guilty about posting here.
There's two SAOL lists: people interested in developing new
compatible tools, compilers, and synths should send a 'subscribe'
message to 'saol-dev-request@media.mit.edu'; people interested
in making orchestras, instruments, and opcodes should send
a 'subscribe' message to 'saol-users-request@media.mit.edu'.
Best,
-- Eric
+-----------------+
| Eric Scheirer |A-7b5 D7b9|G-7 C7|Cb C-7b5 F7#9|Bb |B-7 E7|
|eds@media.mit.edu| < http://sound.media.mit.edu/~eds >
| 617 253 0112 |A A/G# F#-7 F#-/E|Eb-7b5 D7b5|Db|C7b5 B7b5|Bb|
+-----------------+
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From: Roger Klaveness
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Subject: Csound Editor? (Re: Lost Tool for CSound)
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You migth be talking about my Csound Editor
http://members.tripod.com/~fz3/csound/csedit.zip
Not updated for a while because I'm now using my spare time to
using csound instead of making tools for it.
RogerK
Bill DeWitt wrote:
>
> I can't seem to find the Windows CSound tool I used before, it had two
> built in edit windows and would send the command string to CSound. I've
> checked the several URLs from the FAQs and searched AltaVista etc. But...
> being as how I can't remember the name of the program I'm not having much
> luck.
> I've already downloaded CSounder, VisOrc and a couple other things which
> were not it, perhaps it has been removed from distribution. Anyone know the
> one I mean and where it might be found?
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From: Bill DeWitt
To: Roger Klaveness
Cc: Csound List
Subject: RE: Csound Editor? (Re: Lost Tool for CSound)
Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 09:37:45 -0500
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>
> You migth be talking about my Csound Editor
> http://members.tripod.com/~fz3/csound/csedit.zip
>
That the one! Nice program. But I'm having a little trouble getting the
link to work. "No Response from Server" type Error so I'll try back later.
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Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 09:16:24 -0800
From: Sean Costello
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Subject: Re: Pluck
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jpff@maths.bath.ac.uk wrote:
>
> I think you are wrong when you say
>
> Sergey> I suppose that at the beginning the opcode 'pluck' was just some orc+sco,
> Sergey> wasn't it?
>
> I think it was originally coded in C; it certainly is very old and was
> already there before I ever used csound
The Karplus-Strong algorithm certainly predates Csound. It was first
developed in 1978.
> Sergey> Also, what is the "two-tap averager" (I found this in
> Sergey> some article about Karplus-Strong algorithm)?
>
> Sounds like an interpolating delay line, using taps at two points and
> doing linear interpolation. Better answer from those who know, or
> after a reference
I think it refers to the simple lowpass filter used within the delay
line of the Karplus-Strong algorithm, where the output y(n) is
determined by the following equation:
y(n) = [x(n) + x(n-1)] * .5
Your interpretation brings up an important point, however: linear
interpolation IS lowpass filtering (well, at least a form of lowpass
filtering). This will definitely be a problem when trying to implement
the Karplus-Strong algorithm, as linear interpolation would be used for
tuning the delay lines, but would result in inconsistencies in note
brightness for different pitches. One of the earlier solutions was to
use an allpass filter to tune the delay line to the desired frequency.
Perhaps allpass interpolation (as described by Joe Dattorro) would be
useful for the Karplus-Strong algorithm.
Anyway, here is an example Csound orchestra/score for the Karplus/Strong
algorithm, written by Richard Karpen. Instr 2 uses deltapi, and thus
will have more accurate pitches (although the linear interpolation in
deltapi will do funny things to the decay rate for different notes).
Hope this helps,
Sean Costello
; Karplus.orc
;Simple versions of the Karplus Strong Algorithm
sr=22050
kr=22050
ksmps=1
nchnls=1
;The Karplus-Strong Plucked String
instr 1
afeedback init 0
anoise=0
ilooptime = 1/cpspch(p4)
iamp=p5
krandenv linseg 1, ilooptime, 1, 0, 0, p3-ilooptime, 0
anoise rand krandenv
a2 delay afeedback+anoise,ilooptime
a3 delay1 a2
afeedback=(a2+a3)*.5
out a2*iamp
endin
instr 2
afeedback init 0
anoise=0
ilooptime = 1/cpspch(p4)
iamp=p5
timout ilooptime, p3-ilooptime, skiprand
anoise rand 1
skiprand:
adum delayr .2
a2 deltapi ilooptime
delayw afeedback+anoise
a3 delay1 a2
afeedback=(a2+a3)*.5
out a2*iamp
endin
instr 3
irevtime = 10
ilooptime=1/cpspch(p4)
timout ilooptime, p3-ilooptime, skiprand
asig rand p5
skiprand:
adel init 0
adelin init 0
adel delay adelin, ilooptime
aton tone adel, 10000
adelin = aton + asig
asig = 0
out adel
endin
; Karplus.sco
i1 1 5 6.09 5000
i2 7 5 7.09 5000
i3 13 5 8.09 5000
f 0 15
e
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Subject: Re: Pluck
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jpff@maths.bath.ac.uk wrote:
>
> I think you are wrong when you say
>
> Sergey> I suppose that at the beginning the opcode 'pluck' was just some orc+sco,
> Sergey> wasn't it?
>
> I think it was originally coded in C; it certainly is very old and was
> already there before I ever used csound
The Karplus-Strong algorithm certainly predates Csound. It was first
developed in 1978.
> Sergey> Also, what is the "two-tap averager" (I found this in
> Sergey> some article about Karplus-Strong algorithm)?
>
> Sounds like an interpolating delay line, using taps at two points and
> doing linear interpolation. Better answer from those who know, or
> after a reference
I think it refers to the simple lowpass filter used within the delay
line of the Karplus-Strong algorithm, where the output y(n) is
determined by the following equation:
y(n) = [x(n) + x(n-1)] * .5
Your interpretation brings up an important point, however: linear
interpolation IS lowpass filtering (well, at least a form of lowpass
filtering). This will definitely be a problem when trying to implement
the Karplus-Strong algorithm, as linear interpolation would be used for
tuning the delay lines, but would result in inconsistencies in note
brightness for different pitches. One of the earlier solutions was to
use an allpass filter to tune the delay line to the desired frequency.
Perhaps allpass interpolation (as described by Joe Dattorro) would be
useful for the Karplus-Strong algorithm.
Anyway, here is an example Csound orchestra/score for the Karplus/Strong
algorithm, written by Richard Karpen. Instr 2 uses deltapi, and thus
will have more accurate pitches (although the linear interpolation in
deltapi will do funny things to the decay rate for different notes).
Hope this helps,
Sean Costello
; Karplus.orc
;Simple versions of the Karplus Strong Algorithm
sr=22050
kr=22050
ksmps=1
nchnls=1
;The Karplus-Strong Plucked String
instr 1
afeedback init 0
anoise=0
ilooptime = 1/cpspch(p4)
iamp=p5
krandenv linseg 1, ilooptime, 1, 0, 0, p3-ilooptime, 0
anoise rand krandenv
a2 delay afeedback+anoise,ilooptime
a3 delay1 a2
afeedback=(a2+a3)*.5
out a2*iamp
endin
instr 2
afeedback init 0
anoise=0
ilooptime = 1/cpspch(p4)
iamp=p5
timout ilooptime, p3-ilooptime, skiprand
anoise rand 1
skiprand:
adum delayr .2
a2 deltapi ilooptime
delayw afeedback+anoise
a3 delay1 a2
afeedback=(a2+a3)*.5
out a2*iamp
endin
instr 3
irevtime = 10
ilooptime=1/cpspch(p4)
timout ilooptime, p3-ilooptime, skiprand
asig rand p5
skiprand:
adel init 0
adelin init 0
adel delay adelin, ilooptime
aton tone adel, 10000
adelin = aton + asig
asig = 0
out adel
endin
; Karplus.sco
i1 1 5 6.09 5000
i2 7 5 7.09 5000
i3 13 5 8.09 5000
f 0 15
e
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Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 18:35:10 +0000
From: Jean-Michel DARRMONT
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To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
Subject: Re: Karplus & pluck
References:
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--------------0FC7D0B7F9767F5880AFABA4
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Sergey Batov wrote:
>
> I suppose that at the beginning the opcode 'pluck' was just some orc+sco,
> wasn't
> it?
>
> Does anybody know where can I find this (or close to it as much as
> possible)
> orc+sco?
>
I hope Russel Pinkston won't be angry because I send you this orc&sco files
concerning what you are looking for and I didn't ask him the permission.
Anyway you can find these files and many others on his site. I lost the
adress, sorry.
Regards.
--
Jean-Michel DARREMONT
--------------0FC7D0B7F9767F5880AFABA4
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D414341"; name="KARPLUS.ORC"
Content-Disposition: inline; filename="KARPLUS.ORC"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
sr = 22050
kr = 2205
ksmps = 10
nchnls = 1
;=============================================================================
; Karplus Strong Algorithm Demonstration
;
;This is a crude implementation of the Karplus-Strong Plucked String Algorithm
;It simply fills a delay line with noise, then feeds the output through a tone
;filter and back into the delay line. The pitch produced is determined by the
;length of the delay line, and the "pluck" effect caused by the lowpass filter
;in the feedback loop, which gradually removes the high frequencies from the
;noise, eventually leaving nothing but the fundamental frequency of the line.
;Study this to see how the basic algorithm works, but use Pluck in real life.
;RP
;=============================================================================
instr 1
; roll your own pluck instrument
icps = cpspch(p5) ;desired pitch in PCH
asig init 0 ;initialize asig variable
kcount init 1/icps*kr ;and loop counter (see below)
;---------------------- use a delay line of length 1/cps:
adel delayr 1/icps ;delay of 1/cps seconds
asig tone adel,sr/2 ;filter the output
;---------------------- but at the first k, fill the delay line with noise:
if (kcount < 0) kgoto continue ;skip over after line filled
kloop: ;loop to fill delay
asig rand p4,-1 ;with white noise
kcount = kcount - 1 ;decrement loop counter
;-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
continue:
delayw asig ;delay line input (always get here)
if (kcount >= 0) kgoto kloop ;loop only kcount times at start
out asig
endin
--------------0FC7D0B7F9767F5880AFABA4
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D414341"; name="KARPLUS.SCO"
Content-Disposition: inline; filename="KARPLUS.SCO"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
;Test score for Karplus Strong Demo Instrument
i01 0 2 30000 6.00
i01 + . . 7.00
i01 + . . 8.00
i01 + . . 9.00
e
--------------0FC7D0B7F9767F5880AFABA4--
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From: Serge _
To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
Subject: compiling files under dos
Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 11:11:45 PST
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Hi!
I downloaded the full source version of CSound. I looked at makefile to=20
see what files i need it to compile the CSound.exe. Unfortunatly, after=20
repairing some warnings/errors, i still miss the file .
Is there anyone here who have ever try to compile the sources to make=20
the CSound software?
Thank you.
**********************************************************************
Serge B=E9land
sb07@hotmail.com (personnal) =20
g2sib@total.net (work)
GIISI inc. tel.: 1-418-838-6979
6500 blv. de la Rive Sud fax: 1-418-838-6981
L=E9vis, P.Q
G6V 9H3
Canada
**********************************************************************
______________________________________________________
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Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 22:40:27 +0000
From: Andre Bartetzki
Organization: STEAM HfM Berlin
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Subject: bugs in wg opcodes
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Hi,
this is a collection of waveguide opcode bugs and/or manual errata that I
found during the last weeks.
(Manual pdf-Version 3.50, Mills Csound perf 3.51 (PPC) and IRIX Csound 3.51 (SGI))
1. ar wgpluck2 iplk,xam,icps,kpick,krefl
A krefl value of 1 means no reflection at all and 0 is total reflection
(therefore this is an absorption coefficient). The manual says the opposite.
(there was recently a short thread on this problem)
-----------
2. ar wgflute kamp,kfreq,kjet,iatt,idetk,kngain,kvibf,kvamp,ifn [,iminfreq]
kfreq accepts no k-rate, even if iminfreq has a reasonable value.
Csound resp. perf prints this message if there is a k-rate kfreq:
PERF ERROR: No base frequency for flute
FATAL ERROR: terminated perf.
-----------
3. ar wgbrass kamp,kfreq,iatt,kvibf,kvamp,ifn [,iminfreq]
This line (similar to the manual example)
a1 wgbrass 20000, 440, 0.1, 6.1, 0.05, 1
gives
error: insufficient required arguments, line 3:
a1 wgbrass 20000, 440, 0.1, 6.1, 0.05, 1
1 syntax errors in orchestra. compilation invalid
whereas
a1 wgbrass 20000, 440, 0.1, 6.1, 0.05, 1, 200 ; iminfreq = 200
gives
INIT ERROR in instr 1: invalid ftable no. 200.000000
a1 wgbrass 20000 440 0.1 6.1 0.05 1 200 0
PERF ERROR: No table for Brass
Does that mean that there is an undocumented argument before ifn, for example
an idetk-time similar to the other wg opcodes?
-----------
4. ar wgclar kamp, kfreq,kstiff,iatt,idetk,kngain,kvibf,kvamp,ifn [,iminfreq]
If we have a k-rate kfreq and no iminfreq like in
kf line 200,p3,400
a1 wgclar 20000,kf,-0.3,0.1,0.1,0.2,6,0.1,1
then iminfreq should be set automatically to the initial kfreq.
But this doesn't work:
PERF ERROR: No base frequency for clarinet
-----------
5. ar shaker kamp,kfreq,kbeans,kdamp,knum,ktimes [,idecay]
A line similar to the example given in the manual results in
error: too many input args, line 13:
a1 shaker 20000, 400,8, 0.999, 0,100,0
1 syntax errors in orchestra. compilation invalid
(see also Javier Ruiz' message some weeks ago)
BTW, what does a frequency of a shaker really mean??
-----------
6. a1 mandol kamp,kfreq,kpluck,kdetune,kgain,ksize,ifn [,iminfreq]
Every trial to use mandol with the suggested values leads to a crash!
-----------
I think most of these are "bugs" in the manual descriptions of the opcodes. (?)
Andre
--------------------------------------------------
Andre Bartetzki http://www.kgw.tu-berlin.de/~abart
Studio fuer elektroakustische Musik http://www.kgw.tu-berlin.de/~abart/Steam/steam.html
Hochschule fuer Musik Berlin http://www.hfm-berlin.de
Tel. +49-30-4726629
Tel. +49-30-203092488
--------------------------------------------------
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Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 17:13:29 -0600
From: pete moss
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Subject: mid to sco
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are there any midi to sco translaters available?
pete
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Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 17:51:07 -0600
From: Terry Cast
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Subject: Re: mid to sco
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Midi2Sco puts velocity in p4 and note (in pch format, I
believe) in p5. I don't think it does anything with
pitchbend or CC messages. Freeware, according to the
webpage, sources are included. Command line and Win32
(Midi2ScoWin) versions available.
http://www.ctv.es/USERS/dcproven/readclr.htm
Terry Cast
pete moss wrote:
> are there any midi to sco translaters available?
>
> pete
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Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 22:12:44 -0500
From: "Job M. van Zuijlen"
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Subject: Re: if.../ Common Lisp Music / compilers / interpreters
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Not to be inhospitable, but I think that an extensive discussion of
SAOLC would be somewhat off-topic. I also think that Csound still has a
bright future, in particular when the hardware version (Analog Devices
Extended Csound) becomes more readily available. All the same, it would
be useful to be kept informed about any SAOLC developments that are of
interest to Csounders.
Job van Zuijlen
Richard Dobson wrote:
>
>
> Presumably there are dedicated saolc lists, so the question (apart from:
> what are those lists?) is to what extent discussion of saolc is welcome
> on this list, or is it too much of a digression off-topic?
> |