Re: dsp books?

Date	1998-02-22 12:53
From	Richard Dobson
Subject	Re: dsp books?
	I have accumulated quite a few dsp books ofer the years, and understand about 1% of each; I look at two most of the time: Introductory Digital Signal Processing Wiley Paul A Lynn and Wolfgang Fuerst The first edition, which I have, included programs in Basic and Pascal; the second edition now includes them in C. The other is A Digital Signal Processing Primer Addison-Wesley Ken Steiglitz This is targeted at digital audio and computer music; plenty of maths, but no programs. Implementing a Butterworth filter is not as straight-forward as others; typically the design is taken from an analogue prototype and converted to the digital domain using a bilinear transform. The Lynn & Fuerst book gives a fair amount of information and code examples; another book well worth looking at is: C Language Algorithms for Digital Signal Processing Prentice Hall Paul Embree and Bruce Kimble Richard Dobson pete moss wrote: > i would like to possibly write an n-th order butterworth filter for > csound but i know nothing about the algorithm. does anyone out there > know of a good dsp book that is chock full of good algorithms to use. > my university library has a huge selection, and i just know which are > better. in order to avoid sitting on the cold stone floor of the > library tomorrow flipping through book after book, i thought it would be > nice to have something in mind. any suggestions? > > pete Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25432; 22 Feb 98 13:20 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa10064; 22 Feb 98 13:19 GMT Received: (qmail 12261 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 13:19:55 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 13:19:55 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (NAA01439); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 13:14:57 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 13:14:37 GMT Received: from mail.utexas.edu [128.83.126.1] by hermes via SMTP (NAA23709); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 13:14:31 GMT Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 13:14:31 GMT Message-Id: <199802221314.NAA23709@hermes> Received: (qmail 14709 invoked by uid 0); 22 Feb 1998 13:14:29 -0000 Received: from dial-128-32.ots.utexas.edu (128.83.46.176) by mail.utexas.edu with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 13:14:29 -0000 X-Sender: r.pinkston@mail.utexas.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Qian Chen From: Russell Pinkston Subject: Re: question on delay Cc: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk I guess I should volunteer to explain this, since it's one of my examples that you are asking about. The instrument demonstrates how to make a simple flanger, using a delay line with a single, variable tap plus feedback. The Csound delayr unit allocates memory for a delay line with a maximum delay time of imaxdel seconds, and outputs the signal from the line delayed by that fixed amount (adelsig). A delayr unit must be paired with a subsequent delayw unit, which is used to input (write) an audio signal (ainsig) into the line. A delayr/delayw pair are functionally equivalent to a single csound delay unit. The csound delay unit is a closed circuit, however, with a single fixed output (or tap). A delayr/delayw pair, on the other hand, can have an arbitrary number of taps inserted between them, and those taps can have variable delay times. In the example, a single deltapi is used, as follows: adelsig delayr imaxdel avarsig deltapi avardel delayw ainsig deltapi is the interpolating version of deltap. It is almost always preferable when the delay time will be varying dynamically, as it does in this example. The delay time (avardel) is determined by the following lines: avardel oscili ivary,ivarhz,ivarfn avardel = ibase+avardel The oscili is functioning like an LFO (Low Frequency Oscillator) in a typical flanger, which sweeps the delay time of the tap slowly back and forth around a fixed base delay time (ibase). I don't actually use the output of the delayr unit, but Csound requires a result variable for the unit. One other potentially confusing aspect of this example is the fact that there is some feedback of the output for deltapi (avarsig) back into the delay line. It takes place in the line... ainsig = asource+avarsigifeed ...which takes the source signal coming from the soundin unit and adds in (feeds back) a portion of avarsig. The amount of feedback is determined by the factor ifeed, which should be somewhere between 0 and 1. (Anything greater than 1 may cause uncontrolled growth in the signal's amplitude.) The feedback tends to accentuate the flange effect. I hope this helps to explain things. I've written a chapter on the use of delay lines in Csound for the Boulanger book, but that won't be coming out from MIT Press until sometime next summer. Russell Pinkston >Hi, > >Could someone explain me how delayr, delayw, deltap, deltapi work. >Since I cannot find any books about it, I even do not know how to draw >a flow chart when I read some instrument design using algorithm >mentioned above. For example, the instrument below(It is downloaded >from >_ftp.maths.bath.ac.uk/pub/dream/documentation/orchestras+scores/instruments /pinkston.1/delay.orc_): > > sr = 44100 > kr = 4410 > ksmps = 10 > nchnls = 1 >;==========================================================================; >; Example Delay Line Instrument > ; >; > ; >; p4 = ampfac p5 = soundin# p6 = maxdel p7 = basedel > ; >; p8 = pkvardel p9 = vardelhz p10 = vardelfn p11 = feedfac > ; >;==========================================================================; > > instr 1 > > iampfac = (p4 == 0 ? 1 : p4) > imaxdel = p6 > ibase = p7 > ivary = p8 > ivarhz = p9 > ivarfn = p10 > ifeed = p11 > isrcfac = (p12 == 0 ? 1 : p12) > idelfac = (p13 == 0 ? 1 : p13) > > avarsig init 0 > avardel oscili ivary,ivarhz,ivarfn > avardel = ibase+avardel > asource soundin p5 > ainsig = asource+avarsigifeed > adelsig delayr imaxdel > avarsig deltapi avardel > delayw ainsig > aoutsig = asourceisrcfac+avarsigidelfac > out aoutsigiampfac > endin > >Thanks & Regards >== >Qian Chen > >_________________________________________________________ >DO YOU YAHOO!? >Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com > > > ---------------------------------- Russell F. Pinkston, D.M.A. Associate Professor of Composition Director, Electronic Music Studios School of Music The University of Texas at Austin Austin, TX 78712 [512-471-0865] Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25472; 22 Feb 98 14:05 GMT Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa11084; 22 Feb 98 14:05 GMT Received: (qmail 11843 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 14:05:21 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 14:05:21 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (OAA11637); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 14:00:14 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 13:59:36 GMT Received: from jaguars-int.cableinet.net [193.38.113.9] by hermes via SMTP (NAA09860); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 13:59:25 GMT Received: (qmail 4987 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 13:55:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO cableinet.co.uk) (194.117.146.14) by jaguars with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 13:55:37 -0000 Message-Id: <34F02C9A.EE3F47E4@cableinet.co.uk> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 13:48:10 +0000 From: Richard Dobson Reply-To: RWD@cableinet.co.uk Organization: Composers Desktop Project X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Csound mailing list Subject: Re: [Csound parser, monsters, dlls] References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Nicola Bernardini wrote: [snip] > I think that certainly more consistent structuring of the Csound code > with elimination of globals and statics (why statics? they are quite > fine in my opinion) would be a nice thing to do I agree that in a single execution environmemt statics are fine. However, in a re-entrant environment, such as a GUI framework, which I think would be the main beneficiary of a move to dlls, at the very least, statics need to be reinitialized. This is easy enough with global statics, but statics local to a function (such as call counters and init flags) need special handling. In many cases, statics are simply used to transfer data betweeen functions, and with a bit of careful coding, can be eliminated, to, I feel, the general betterment of the code. A particular problem can arise with static pointers, which are given dynamically allocated memory. In some cases, these are const singletons (eg the sine wave for adsyn, and the sinc table in dsputil.c), which only need to be created once, at the framework level, and are thereafter read-only. In other cases, they are not re-entrant within a process (ie are not shareable or thread-safe). There is a good example of this in linevent.c. In a GUI framework, it is conceivable that more than one Csound thread can be launched at a time (eg a lengthy pvanal while contuning work compiling orchestras) - this requires Csound, and any dlls it uses, to be reentrant within a single process space. The GEN functions all use local statics (they are all " void func(void)" - no inputs or outputs, only 'side-effects'!). They are not singletons or const, as the score has the power to destroy one and reassign. However, they ~could~ be shareable, especially if a reference count is maintained so that identical f-tables do not have to be created multiple times. This again is a natural task for a framework. In a framework, a situation could easily arise in which a user has loaded an orc file, which is duly parsed. There is however a problem with the score file, or the user simply cancels performance, and edits the score file. The latter obviously needs to be re-scanned, but there is no concomitant need to re-scan the orchestra, certainly no need, for example, to reload dlls. A Csound GUI framework thus will act as a simple form of make facility, reinitializing only those components which need it. I have just found a problematic static relating to MIDI controllers. It is not initialized, or ever assigned to, but it is used in one function, as the index into an array, and to both free a block in that array, and allocate to it. If anyone experiences random problems with MIDI controller opcodes (in 3.47), the cause is most likely here. Richard Dobson Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25619; 22 Feb 98 15:25 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa13035; 22 Feb 98 15:25 GMT Received: (qmail 12673 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 15:25:28 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 15:25:28 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (PAA10582); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:20:19 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 15:20:03 GMT Received: from root@[194.184.60.149] by hermes via ESMTP (PAA12099); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:19:49 GMT Received: (from nicb@localhost) by ax-nicb.axnet.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA24189; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:54:33 +0100 Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:54:31 +0100 (MET) From: Nicola Bernardini To: Csound mailing list Subject: Re: [Csound parser, monsters, dlls] - what ctrace is In-Reply-To: <34EFEB13.DCF34586@agora.stm.it> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk On Sun, 22 Feb 1998, Gabriel Maldonado wrote: [snip] > > What are code analysers and ctrace? a code analyzer is exactly what its name says: it is some piece of software which shows (at my time that used to be with a printout, could well be graphically by now...) what the code is doing while running. Ctrace was(is?) a really neat package that exists on AT&T unix development platforms which picks up C source code and insert statements to print out variables as each program statement is executed, so that when the resulting code gets executed it lets you follow the execution statement by statement and the global control flow. This, combined with the cxref software (which print a cross-reference of all symbols used in a program, along with the location where they are used), constituted a very helpful software development support. Unfortunately, both applications are, to the best of my knowledge, AT&T code and there are no replacements in the public domain (linux has something call strace which traces operating system calls as a program goes along, but that's hardly the same thing). So much for these... Nicola ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Nicola Bernardini E-mail: nicb@axnet.it Re graphics: A picture is worth 10K words -- but only those to describe the picture. Hardly any sets of 10K words can be adequately described with pictures. Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25650; 22 Feb 98 15:48 GMT Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa13603; 22 Feb 98 15:48 GMT Received: (qmail 15297 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 15:48:45 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 15:48:45 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (PAA03158); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:43:46 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 15:43:30 GMT Received: from nicb@[194.184.60.149] by hermes via ESMTP (PAA00356); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 15:43:18 GMT Received: (from nicb@localhost) by ax-nicb.axnet.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA24312; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:38:06 +0100 Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:38:05 +0100 (MET) From: Nicola Bernardini To: Richard Dobson Cc: Csound mailing list Subject: Re: [Csound parser, monsters, dlls] In-Reply-To: <34F02C9A.EE3F47E4@cableinet.co.uk> Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk On Sun, 22 Feb 1998, Richard Dobson wrote: > Nicola Bernardini wrote: > > [snip] > > > I think that certainly more consistent structuring of the Csound code > > with elimination of globals and statics (why statics? they are quite > > fine in my opinion) would be a nice thing to do > > I agree that in a single execution environmemt statics are fine. However, in a > re-entrant environment, such as a GUI framework, which I think would be the main > beneficiary of a move to dlls, at the very least, statics need to be reinitialized. > This is easy enough with global statics, but statics local to a function (such as > call counters and init flags) need special handling. that's right you are right (god maybe I should shut up and not create side arguments when I try to make a point). My idea is that statics (global statics, I mean) often have a function which can hardly be replaced by some other construct (they are sort of 'system variables'). But there are ways to keep them under control: they should always be accessed for reading and writing by a function - so to keep them as sort of C++ static properties of a class with methods for accessing them (let me specify that this can be done, obviously, in C too, for C lovers ;-). I agree that static within functions are inherently dangerous because they cannot be made thread safe in any way. > > In many cases, statics are simply used to transfer data betweeen functions, and with > a bit of careful coding, can be eliminated, to, I feel, the general betterment of > the code. If they can be replaced, that means that they should* be replaced, of course. The point is whether one wants to do a lot of rewriting or not. Nicola ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Nicola Bernardini E-mail: nicb@axnet.it Re graphics: A picture is worth 10K words -- but only those to describe the picture. Hardly any sets of 10K words can be adequately described with pictures. Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25839; 22 Feb 98 17:37 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa16404; 22 Feb 98 17:37 GMT Received: (qmail 13108 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 17:37:22 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 17:37:22 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (QAA11487); Wed, 11 Feb 1998 16:15:52 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 11 Feb 98 16:15:13 GMT Received: from walt.music.qub.ac.uk [143.117.35.1] by hermes via SMTP (QAA20847); Wed, 11 Feb 1998 16:15:02 GMT Received: from minnie by walt.music.qub.ac.uk (NX5.67d/NX3.0M) id AA09342; Wed, 11 Feb 98 16:08:56 GMT From: Mark Wilkes Message-Id: <9802111608.AA09342@walt.music.qub.ac.uk> Received: by minnie.music.qub.ac.uk (NX5.67d/NX3.0X) id AA02528; Wed, 11 Feb 98 16:08:54 GMT Date: Wed, 11 Feb 98 16:08:54 GMT Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.95) Received: by NeXT Mailer (1.95) To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Subject: WindowStress Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Greetings All, Can anyone tell me why csound (v3.473) crashes when I run it in an MSDOS prompt? Winsound works fine, although I have to say it's the most bizarre interface I've ever come across (are there any alternatives?). Also, can anyone tell me how TURNON works? Can I use it to turn on an instrument from within a different instrument? Mark Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25846; 22 Feb 98 17:38 GMT Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa16414; 22 Feb 98 17:38 GMT Received: (qmail 20207 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 17:38:14 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 17:38:14 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (PAA14429); Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:55:37 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Fri, 13 Feb 98 15:55:17 GMT Received: from sndart.cemi.unt.edu [129.120.63.1] by hermes via SMTP (PAA07238); Fri, 13 Feb 1998 15:49:13 GMT Received: by sndart.cemi.unt.edu (NX5.67e/NX3.0M) id AA01241; Fri, 13 Feb 98 10:29:12 -0600 Message-Id: <9802131629.AA01241@sndart.cemi.unt.edu> Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3 v118.2) Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.118.2) From: Jon Christopher Nelson Date: Fri, 13 Feb 98 10:29:11 -0600 To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Subject: Re: Orbits on 3D Surfaces References: <3.0.3.16.19980212215036.38df3c74@werewolf.net> Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Csounders: The following provides yet another example of a wave terrain instrument. This instrument is covered in the forthcoming MIT Press Learning Csound Book (should be out in the summer) in my tutorial on function tables and the GEN routines. With fairly simple modifications one can devise 4-D, 5-D, etc. wave terrain synthesis instruments. I have used this instrument a little in my most recent work and plan to incorporate more wave terrain synthesis in my next work. I will also be presenting a paper on this technique at the SEAMUS conference in Dartmouth this April (in case any of you plan to attend). Hope you can use this: instr 1 ;3-D wave terrain with oscils/phasors ;p4=amp p5-6=xtransi-f p7-8=xoscilampi-f p9-10=xoscilfreqi-f p11=xfn ;p12-13=ytransi-f p14-15=yoscilampi-f p16-17=yoscilfreqi-f p18=yfn ;p19=x plane fn table p20=y plane fn table kenv linseg 0,.02,p4,p3-.04,p4,.02,0 ;amp envelope ;x index values follow kxtrans line p5,p3,p6 ;transverse movement in x plane kxamp line p7,p3,p8 ;index oscillator amplitude kxamp = kxamp.5 ;normalizes oscil amp to index table kxfreq line p9,p3,p10 ;x plane index oscil frequency kxndx oscili kxamp,kxfreq,p11 ;p11=x index function ;try sines, traingles, or ascending lines from -1 to +1 ;(phasor) etc for index function kxndx = frac(kxndx+1000.5+kxtrans) ;need fractional values ;to go from one terrain boundary to the other ;1000.5 avoids negative values and sets start point ;at table midpoint ;y index values follow kytrans line p12,p3,p13 ;transverse movement in x plane kyamp line p14,p3,p15 ;index oscillator amplitude kyamp = kyamp.5 ;normalizes oscil amp to index table kyfreq line p16,p3,p17 ;x plane index oscil frequency kyndx oscili kyamp,kyfreq,p18 ;p11=x index function ;try sines, traingles, or ascending lines from -1 to +1 ;(phasor) etc for index function kyndx = frac(kyndx+1000.5+kytrans) ;need fractional values ;to go from one terrain boundary to the other ;1000.5 avoids negative values and sets start point ;at table midpoint ax tablei kxndx,p19,1,0,0 ;normalized (-1 to +1) audio for x plane ay tablei kyndx,p20,1,0,0 ;normalized (-1 to +1) audio for y plane az=(axay)kenv ;tracks z plane to generate terrain waveform outs az,az endin f 1 0 8192 10 1 ;sine f 2 0 8192 7 0 2048 1 4096 -1 2048 0 ;triangle f 3 0 8192 7 -1 8192 1 ;phasor from -1 to +1 f 10 0 8192 10 0 0 1 ;3 sines f 11 0 8192 10 1 .43 0 .25 .33 .11 0 .75 ;other x or y tables f 12 0 8192 9 .75 1 0 2.25 1 0 f 13 0 8192 9 1.66 1 0 3.33 1 0 f14 0 8192 9 1.25 1 0 4.25 1 180 f15 0 8192 9 1 1 0 1.5 1 0 f16 0 8192 9 3 1 0 3.5 1 0 ;p4=amp p5-6=xtransi-f p7-8=xoscilampi-f p9-10=xoscilfreqi-f p11=xfn ;p12-13=ytransi-f p14-15=yoscilampi-f p16-17=yoscilfreqi-f p18=yfn ;p19=x plane fn table p20=y plane fn table ;i1 0 .5 32000 0 0 1 1 2 2 3 0 0 1 1 40 40 3 1 10 ;i1 1 .5 32000 0 0 1 1 40 40 3 0 0 1 1 2 2 3 1 10 ;i1 0 2 32000 -.5 .5 .1 .1 440 440 3 0 0 1 1 440 440 3 1 10 ;i1 2.5 2 32000 0 0 1 1 440 440 3 -.5 .5 .1 .1 440 440 3 1 10 ;i1 0 2 32000 -.5 .5 .1 10 110 110 3 0 3 3 1 110 110 3 1 10 ;i1 2.5 2 32000 .25 -.25 3 1 110 110 3 -.5 .5 .1 10 110 110 3 1 10 ;i1 0 2 32000 -.5 .5 .1 10 110 110 3 0 3 3 1 110 110 3 13 14 ;i1 2.5 2 32000 .25 -.25 3 1 110 110 3 -.5 .5 .1 10 110 110 3 11 12 ;i1 0 2 32000 -.5 .5 .1 1 440 435 3 0 0 1 .1 440 440 3 1 10 ;i1 2.5 2 32000 0 0 1 .1 110 110 3 -.5 .5 .1 1 330 333 3 1 10 ;i1 0 2 32000 -.5 .5 .2 .4 110 110 1 0 4 .4 .2 220 220 1 15 16 ;i1 2.5 2 32000 10 0 .5 .2 110 110 3 -.5 .5 .2 .5 220 220 1 15 16 e enjoy, Jon Jon Christopher Nelson, Director CEMI (Center for Experimental Music and Intermedia) University of North Texas College of Music P.O. Box 13887 Denton, TX 76203 USA ph. (940) 369-7531 fax (940) 565-2002 jnelson@sndart.cemi.unt.edu http://www.music.unt.edu/comp/jnelson.htm Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25852; 22 Feb 98 17:38 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa16422; 22 Feb 98 17:38 GMT Received: (qmail 13113 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 17:38:52 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 17:38:52 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (NAA03933); Wed, 11 Feb 1998 13:20:18 GMT From: J.Craine-ie3i7529@lmu.ac.uk Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Wed, 11 Feb 98 13:19:55 GMT Received: from jaffle.lmu.ac.uk [160.9.128.2] by hermes via SMTP (NAA14044); Wed, 11 Feb 1998 13:19:48 GMT Received: from jess-fddi.lmu.ac.uk (jess) [160.9.192.55] by jaffle.lmu.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 1.82 #1) id 0y2cAT-0003d3-00; Wed, 11 Feb 1998 13:25:37 +0000 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 1998 13:25:35 +0000 (GMT) X-Sender: ie3i7529@jess To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Subject: that antithing? Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk This email internet www thing is about free speech and thought, or so I was lead to believe. I find some of the postings from antiorp quit interesting and most are very easy to read, so what if antiorp wants to write like this, as so many have pointed out you can delete this mail without reading it. Any way last night while looking for more csound info I came accross a listing that offered a mock tb303 upon looking further I was presented with a phonesex line option, (needless to say, but I did not venture further) not exactly what I was looking for and it isthis sort of thing that gets me a little 'pissed off' not really what csound is about. found it through netscapes search engine if any ones interested, and has the ability to remove it. Jamie. Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25860; 22 Feb 98 17:40 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa16481; 22 Feb 98 17:40 GMT Received: (qmail 13125 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 17:40:34 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 17:40:34 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (NAA11683); Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:58:07 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Tue, 17 Feb 98 13:57:37 GMT Received: from root@rzaixsrv2.rrz.uni-hamburg.de [134.100.33.12] by hermes via ESMTP (NAA02534); Tue, 17 Feb 1998 13:57:30 GMT Received: from rrz.uni-hamburg.de (rzaix13.rrz.uni-hamburg.de [134.100.2.13]) by rzaixsrv2.rrz.uni-hamburg.de (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with ESMTP id OAA72096; Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:56:57 +0100 (NFT) Message-Id: <34E99728.1BB97189@rrz.uni-hamburg.de> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 1998 14:56:56 +0100 From: Bernd Eggink Organization: RRZ Uni Hamburg X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (X11; I; AIX 4.2) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Nicola Bernardini , CSound mailing list Subject: Re: [Csound Parser] Re: new language proposal -Reply References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Nicola Bernardini wrote: > there was a suite of papers by Roger Dannenberg on one of the last > CMJs which basically compared nyquist and csound. Even though Dannenberg > is the creator of nyquist, the rigourous scientific approach of his > articles make them some very very useful reading on benchmarking > and comparing the two languages. I think this is better than anything > we could write, which would be simplistic for lack of time and clarity. > (Sorry about super collider, I don't even know what that is). Sounds very interesting. Does anybody know if there is an online acces to this articles? - Bernd -- Bernd Eggink Regionales Rechenzentrum der Uni Hamburg eggink@rrz.uni-hamburg.de http://www.rrz.uni-hamburg.de/eggink/BEggink.html Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25858; 22 Feb 98 17:40 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa16477; 22 Feb 98 17:40 GMT Received: (qmail 13123 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 17:40:34 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 17:40:34 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (QAA11810); Tue, 10 Feb 1998 16:09:45 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Feb 98 16:09:27 GMT Received: from root@huitzilo.tezcat.com [204.128.247.17] by hermes via ESMTP (QAA13093); Tue, 10 Feb 1998 16:09:18 GMT Received: from [204.248.80.120] (antiorp.tezcat.com [204.248.80.120]) by huitzilo.tezcat.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/tezcat-96091001) with SMTP id KAA25503 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:09:18 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199802101609.KAA25503@huitzilo.tezcat.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Tue, 10 Feb 1998 10:13:33 -0600 To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk From: =cw4t7abs Subject: Re: aliassaila \| out.going@no.ether Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk >> >>- I agree, what would it be like if we all invented our own personal langu= age, >>to use on mailing lists >it would be like we were composing. 1\auxlang 1\csound !n odr wordz. uze langu.age 2 kreate snd. uze snd 2 kreate apps. uze apps 2 kreate lan.guage. >what would it be like if language never changed? d!sz haz nvr happened b4. > i enjoy antiorp's messages. > >- No-one would be able to communicate. >>If Antiorp's language is supposed to an attempt at universality, it isn't! >>It's basically English with a few z's and !'s thrown in. I find the whole >>thing very arrogant, and annoying. midiflusch uze language 2annoy humanz un!ntentionall+e ____----.._-\|\|\|- m o r t 194.19.130.194/spCa/filez/3t0y.zucx.sit.hqx 116k =B1 1prozent 194.19.130.194/spCa/filez/-cw4t7abs_4ob1tenkr1pt1on.sit.hqx p!ano.konzert.!n.\|9\|f!lez. 4\|\|4.dze.2nd.m!ddle.f!ngr. _+\|1. 3kxternaL.komponent. 194.19.130.194/=3Dcw4t7abs/0f0003/kode/0f0003pRpG.sit.hqx rand_+anti.akadem!kc. gFx.no!sz.+teczt.rout!nz. hard.drive.smakc.rout!nz. Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25871; 22 Feb 98 17:41 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa16529; 22 Feb 98 17:41 GMT Received: (qmail 13140 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 17:41:19 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 17:41:19 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (MAA27924); Mon, 9 Feb 1998 12:34:32 GMT Received: from dns0 by maths.ex.ac.uk; Mon, 9 Feb 98 12:34:12 GMT Received: from f118.hotmail.com [207.82.251.44] by sunny via SMTP (MAA08436); Mon, 9 Feb 1998 12:23:39 GMT Received: (qmail 17959 invoked by uid 0); 9 Feb 1998 12:23:29 -0000 Message-Id: <19980209122329.17958.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 156.153.255.162 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Mon, 09 Feb 1998 04:23:29 PST X-Originating-Ip: [156.153.255.162] From: Gene Dinkey To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Subject: Re: discouraged Content-Type: text/plain Date: Mon, 09 Feb 1998 05:23:29 MST Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk >On Mon, 9 Feb 1998, rasmus ekman wrote: > >> Then it's just a matter of cramming them together in an >> interesting and entertaining shape... but with such first-class >> material the sounds almost laid themselves side by side right away. >> > > I don't want to appear to be picking a fight....but, > there's something aesthetically bankrupt in the notion > that the compostional aspects of writing a good piece > of electro-acoustic music amount to nothing more > than coming up with good sounds and then "cramming > them together in an interesting and entertaining shape"... > In fact, I would say that this notion accounts for more > truly bad pieces of electro-acoustic music than I can > count. A new sound, a new technology or a new midi > controller is not in an of itself enough to make a > piece of music anymore than a Beethoven sonata is > some "some good chords" or tunes crammed together. > A painter mixes his/her pallette...AND THEN THEY PAINT! > Anyone with me on this? (again, pardon the pugilistic > tone, I'm sure you didn't mean that remark litterally, > (I hope), but it's a real issue...honest to God it is..) I agree with the both of you. Writing computer music is much akin to composing a classical score (in fact it's almost exactly the same). The only difference I can think of is that to compose computer music you do have to create your own instruments, which is something that Beethoven and Mozart didn't have to do. I also believe that there is a certain "randomness" involved in putting it all together. Like a painter you have to create a pallette and then paint a picture. How you go about painting that picture is all a matter of personal preference, some might take the brush grab a random color and start whipping it across the canvas in random strokes. It may not resemble anything you'll see on this earth but sometimes just the vibrance and your imagination can make the piece seem astounding. Some prefer to organize their colors and paint something they've seen before (either in real life, or their imaginations), this also holds a certain beauty that can not be rivalled. Although music put together at random can (a lot of the times) just sound like obnoxious noise, if the instruments have that certain vibrance a recognizable pattern will emerge and, like listening to the sound of the surf at a beach, it can have quite a hypnotic/calming effect on the mind. Sorry if that seemed winded but that's my 2 cents on the issue. PLUR G-der ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25911; 22 Feb 98 18:11 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa17400; 22 Feb 98 18:11 GMT Received: (qmail 13255 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 18:11:17 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 18:11:17 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (SAA19737); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 18:06:04 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 18:05:48 GMT Received: from howl.werewolf.net [206.103.224.20] by hermes via SMTP (SAA20943); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 18:05:41 GMT Received: from @werewolf.net by howl.werewolf.net via SMTP (950413.SGI.8.6.12/940406.SGI) id MAA29740; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 12:05:41 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.16.19980222120602.0c4fc82a@werewolf.net> X-Sender: hljmm@werewolf.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (16) Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 12:06:02 To: pete moss , csound From: Hans Mikelson Subject: Re: dsp books? In-Reply-To: <34EFC616.FAC408AF@flash.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Hi, There is a pretty good online DSP tutorial at the following site: http://www.bores.com/courses/intro/index.htm Bye, Hans Mikelson Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25928; 22 Feb 98 18:24 GMT Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa17673; 22 Feb 98 18:24 GMT Received: (qmail 22417 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 18:24:50 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 18:24:50 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (SAA00093); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 18:19:28 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 18:19:12 GMT Received: from pilot008.cl.msu.edu [35.9.5.108] by hermes via ESMTP (SAA22249); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 18:19:05 GMT From: herremar@pilot.msu.edu Received: from [198.109.167.215] (dhcp-198-109-167-215.tcimet.net [198.109.167.215]) by pilot008.cl.msu.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA64166 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 13:19:10 -0500 Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 13:19:10 -0500 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Subject: List archive is broken? Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk i have had exactly the same experience. i just sent e-mail to james andrews at james@noether.ex.ac.uk. he had said that he maintains three archives and wasn't sure which one i was referring to when i originally emailed him. your post reminded me to reply to his reply. hopefully it will get straightened out soon. ron > >I have some questions I know have been answered in the past, so I went >to check the archives and found it impossible to find my way around in >there. There seems to be no correspondence between the article you >select and the article that comes up. There are also many "not found" >errors. I tried back later and had the same problems. Is this happening >for everyone? If so I would implore whoever is responsible for that site >to fix it ASAP! Or else I will be forced to ask everyone how to >correctly use gen 01! :) > >Regards, > >PW > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > *********************************** * Ron Herrema * * http://pilot.msu.edu/user/herremar/ * * * *********************************** Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26001; 22 Feb 98 19:16 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa19015; 22 Feb 98 19:16 GMT Received: (qmail 13468 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 19:16:40 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 19:16:40 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (TAA13365); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:10:25 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 19:10:09 GMT Received: from [193.121.99.70] by hermes via ESMTP (TAA07169); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:10:02 GMT Received: from nobody ([193.74.7.220]) by hurricane.netgate.be (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-32575U60) with ESMTP id AAC246 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 20:13:42 +0100 From: David Schuyeteneer To: csound mailing list Subject: unexpected offline study Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 20:09:19 +0100 X-Msmail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <19980222191335815.AAC246@nobody> Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk For you people who use to spend time ONLINE studying dsp courses, there is a wonderful tool to download a WHOLE website at once for offline browsing. It's called "Websnake" and it downloads complete sites including all sublocal pages, illustration pictures etc in one project ready for offline browsing !!! wohoo !! David. Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26093; 22 Feb 98 19:56 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa19999; 22 Feb 98 19:55 GMT Received: (qmail 13603 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 19:56:00 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 19:56:00 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (TAA18908); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:50:00 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 19:49:43 GMT Received: from root@valhalla.umbc.edu [130.85.253.11] by hermes via ESMTP (TAB09546); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:49:36 GMT Received: from default (rabarr@207-172-132-179.s52.as19.col.erols.com [207.172.132.179]) by valhalla.umbc.edu (8.8.8/8.8.6) with ESMTP id OAA18093 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 14:49:36 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <34F081F4.B09BAA11@gl.umbc.edu> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 14:52:20 -0500 From: arlen barr X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: "csound@noether.ex.ac.uk" Subject: better piano sounds X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Hi all, A few months ago I posted a message looking for advice on creating piano sounds that contained the proper damper pedal harmonics, and harmonics generated when multiple notes are sounded. Didn't really get anywhere in my search for a better synthesis model, so I'm wondering what harmonics would need to be added to a sample playback type synthesis? This doesn't need to sound convincing to a classical pianist, just something that sounds to me noticably "richer" than the plasticy sound of a sampler. If I play note A, it produces a harmonic series that evolves over time, which sounds fine to me on a sampler ... but if note B is played simulataneously there is some interaction in the harmonics that I have no idea how to model. The reading I've done on piano synthesis has been too much mathematical theory, which is a bit over my head ... so my question, I guess, is from a practical standpoint how does one determine the interactive harmonics and produce a decent approximation of them without reverting to physical models (which are far to primitive at this point). thanks arlen Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26253; 22 Feb 98 21:06 GMT Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa21875; 22 Feb 98 21:06 GMT Received: (qmail 28751 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 21:06:36 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 21:06:36 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (VAA27818); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:00:38 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 21:00:21 GMT Received: from jaguars-int.cableinet.net [193.38.113.9] by hermes via SMTP (VAA10291); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:00:15 GMT Received: (qmail 18256 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 20:56:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO cableinet.co.uk) (194.117.146.68) by jaguars with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 20:56:34 -0000 Message-Id: <34F08F0A.112905F6@cableinet.co.uk> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 20:48:10 +0000 From: Richard Dobson Reply-To: RWD@cableinet.co.uk Organization: Composers Desktop Project X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Nicola Bernardini Cc: Csound mailing list Subject: Re: [Csound parser, monsters, dlls] References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Working on it! I need to get rid of the 1550 warnings from VC++ on a full build first, though! Richard Dobson Nicola Bernardini wrote: > > > > In many cases, statics are simply used to transfer data betweeen functions, and with > > a bit of careful coding, can be eliminated, to, I feel, the general betterment of > > the code. > > If they can be replaced, that means that they should be replaced, of course. > The point is whether one wants to do a lot of rewriting or not. > > Nicola > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Nicola Bernardini > E-mail: nicb@axnet.it > > Re graphics: A picture is worth 10K words -- but only those to describe > the picture. Hardly any sets of 10K words can be adequately described > with pictures. Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26302; 22 Feb 98 21:11 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa22024; 22 Feb 98 21:11 GMT Received: (qmail 13903 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 21:11:35 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 21:11:35 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (VAA10411); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:05:59 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 21:05:26 GMT Received: from sndart.cemi.unt.edu [129.120.63.1] by hermes via SMTP (VAA26796); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:05:12 GMT Received: by sndart.cemi.unt.edu (NX5.67e/NX3.0M) id AA03395; Sun, 22 Feb 98 15:50:15 -0600 Message-Id: <9802222150.AA03395@sndart.cemi.unt.edu> Content-Type: text/plain Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3 v118.2) Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.118.2) From: Jon Christopher Nelson Date: Sun, 22 Feb 98 15:50:14 -0600 To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Subject: Re: actual work? References: Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk I too use Csound in my work---teach it annually at the graduate level in my computer music composition courses. I also use it regularly in composition---which can also be considered to be a part of my job. regards, Jon C. Nelson, Director Center for Experimental Music and Intermedia University of North Texas College of Music Denton, TX 76203 ph. (940) 369-7531 fax (940) 565-2002 jnelson@sndart.cemi.unt.edu Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26338; 22 Feb 98 21:18 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa22178; 22 Feb 98 21:18 GMT Received: (qmail 13929 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 21:18:51 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 21:18:51 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (VAA27551); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:13:31 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 21:13:05 GMT Received: from root@westnet.com [206.24.6.2] by hermes via ESMTP (VAA11945); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:12:58 GMT Received: from goodguy (port4.ts2.westnet.com [206.28.203.4]) by westnet.com (8.8.6/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA09223 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:12:57 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <34F0A129.39F580BE@westnet.com> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:05:29 +0000 From: Larry Troxler X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (X11; I; Linux 2.0.31 i586) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Subject: [Fwd: Re: unexpected offline study] Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------757207A35D317FD018B0B785" Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------757207A35D317FD018B0B785 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -- Larry Troxler -- lt@westnet.com -- Patterson, NY USA -- --------------757207A35D317FD018B0B785 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-ID: <34F0A0F2.E9D0B6B@westnet.com> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:04:34 +0000 From: Larry Troxler X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (X11; I; Linux 2.0.31 i586) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: David Schuyeteneer Subject: Re: unexpected offline study References: <19980222191335815.AAC246@nobody> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit David Schuyeteneer wrote: > > For you people who use to spend time ONLINE studying dsp courses, there is > a wonderful tool > to download a WHOLE website at once for offline browsing. It's called > "Websnake" and it downloads > complete sites including all sublocal pages, illustration pictures etc in > one project ready for > offline browsing !!! wohoo !! > > David. Anyone know if there is anything like this for Linux/Unix? Larry -- Larry Troxler -- lt@westnet.com -- Patterson, NY USA -- --------------757207A35D317FD018B0B785-- Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26353; 22 Feb 98 21:23 GMT Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa22297; 22 Feb 98 21:23 GMT Received: (qmail 29274 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 21:23:22 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 21:23:22 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (VAA11719); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:18:02 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 21:17:11 GMT Received: from root@westnet.com [206.24.6.2] by hermes via ESMTP (VAA21744); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:17:04 GMT Received: from goodguy (port4.ts2.westnet.com [206.28.203.4]) by westnet.com (8.8.6/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA09424; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 16:17:00 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <34F0A21C.6F93BE47@westnet.com> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:09:32 +0000 From: Larry Troxler X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (X11; I; Linux 2.0.31 i586) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Nicola Bernardini Cc: Csound mailing list Subject: Re: [Csound parser, monsters, dlls] - what ctrace is References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Nicola Bernardini wrote: ... > > Unfortunately, both applications are, to the best of my knowledge, > AT&T code and there are no replacements in the public domain (linux > has something call strace which traces operating system calls as ~~~~~~ > a program goes along, but that's hardly the same thing). So much > for these... > > Nicola > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Nicola Bernardini > E-mail: nicb@axnet.it > No, not the same thing, but with the timeing options, I found strace very valuable in debugging and profiling real-time csound. Do try this one at home, kids :-) -- Larry Troxler -- lt@westnet.com -- Patterson, NY USA -- Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26488; 22 Feb 98 22:02 GMT Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa23277; 22 Feb 98 22:01 GMT Received: (qmail 879 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 22:01:55 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 22:01:55 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (VAA26425); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:56:22 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 21:56:05 GMT Received: from nicb@[194.184.60.149] by hermes via ESMTP (VAA17264); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 21:55:53 GMT Received: (from nicb@localhost) by ax-nicb.axnet.it (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA24220; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:51:02 +0100 Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:51:00 +0100 (MET) From: Nicola Bernardini To: Csound mailing list Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: unexpected offline study] Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk On Sun, 22 Feb 1998, Larry Troxler wrote: >David Schuyeteneer wrote: >> >> For you people who use to spend time ONLINE studying dsp courses, there is >> a wonderful tool >> to download a WHOLE website at once for offline browsing. It's called >> "Websnake" and it downloads >> complete sites including all sublocal pages, illustration pictures etc in >> one project ready for >> offline browsing !!! wohoo !! >> >> David. > >Anyone know if there is anything like this for Linux/Unix? wget and getwww, available from your favourite mirrors. wget is really good at downloading a site... nicb ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Nicola Bernardini E-mail: nicb@axnet.it Re graphics: A picture is worth 10K words -- but only those to describe the picture. Hardly any sets of 10K words can be adequately described with pictures. Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26559; 22 Feb 98 22:59 GMT Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa24631; 22 Feb 98 22:59 GMT Received: (qmail 3097 invoked from network); 22 Feb 1998 22:59:46 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 22 Feb 1998 22:59:46 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (WAA11720); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:53:23 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Sun, 22 Feb 98 22:53:06 GMT Received: from GS160.SP.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.203.172] by hermes via SMTP (WAA16706); Sun, 22 Feb 1998 22:52:52 GMT Message-Id: <199802222252.WAA16706@hermes> Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: unexpected offline study] To: Csound mailing list Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 17:52:35 -0500 (EST) From: Eli Brandt In-Reply-To: <34F0A129.39F580BE@westnet.com> from "Larry Troxler" at Feb 22, 98 10:05:29 pm X-Portmanteau: pantryptaminergeticallysisterrainbowtie X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25-40] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Larry Troxler wrote: > > "Websnake" and it downloads > > complete sites including all sublocal pages, illustration pictures etc in > > one project ready for > > offline browsing !!! wohoo !! > > > > David. > > Anyone know if there is anything like this for Linux/Unix? http://www-pi.informatik.uni-siegen.de/schuh/doc/webcopy.html ftp://ftp.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de/pub/net/www/tools/htmlgobble.tar.gz -- Eli Brandt \| eli+@cs.cmu.edu \| http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~eli/ Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26672; 23 Feb 98 0:23 GMT Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26745; 23 Feb 98 0:23 GMT Received: (qmail 5769 invoked from network); 23 Feb 1998 00:23:14 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 23 Feb 1998 00:23:14 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (AAA13508); Mon, 23 Feb 1998 00:14:31 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Mon, 23 Feb 98 00:14:17 GMT Received: from GS160.SP.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.203.172] by hermes via SMTP (AAA13520); Mon, 23 Feb 1998 00:14:09 GMT Message-Id: <199802230014.AAA13520@hermes> Subject: preprocessors To: Csound mailing list Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 19:13:57 -0500 (EST) From: Eli Brandt In-Reply-To: <34ECBFA7.F4A0F6C7@cableinet.co.uk> from "Richard Dobson" at Feb 19, 98 11:26:31 pm X-Portmanteau: pantryptaminergeticallysisterrainbowtie X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25-40] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Richard Dobson wrote: > The more I have thought about it, I feel that the focus of any language > enhancement should take the form of an orc preprocessor or compiler. A while back I planned a preprocessor to add modularity; it became apparent that the orc language would require untenable combinatorial bloat in the generated code, so I shelved the project. Now the zak opcodes might (I don't remember the problem, but it was something to do with routing between function instances) make it possible... and now I haven't got the time to implement it. The idea was to let the user define functions like out = pitchshift(in, amount) { out = } which would differ from instrs in a couple of ways. You don't have to do multiple instantiation by block-copying orc code; you can just say n2o = pitchshift(somevoice, -0.5) he2 = pitchshift(somevoice, 1) And you can plug in a non-constant input sweepy = pitchshift(somevoice, osc(sine_table, 0.2)) without hacking the pval to be a global variable. The usual trouble with code generators would probably arise: when something in the generated code fails, the error message is useless. -- Eli Brandt \| eli+@cs.cmu.edu \| http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~eli/ Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26778; 23 Feb 98 1:11 GMT Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa27906; 23 Feb 98 1:11 GMT Received: (qmail 14830 invoked from network); 23 Feb 1998 01:11:40 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by mercury.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 23 Feb 1998 01:11:40 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (BAA13507); Mon, 23 Feb 1998 01:05:10 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Mon, 23 Feb 98 01:04:53 GMT Received: from mail1.sirius.com [205.134.253.131] by hermes via ESMTP (BAA12479); Mon, 23 Feb 1998 01:04:37 GMT From: anechoic@sirius.com Received: from default (ppp-asmt01--035.sirius.net [205.134.229.35]) by mail1.sirius.com (8.8.7/Sirius-8.8.7-97.08.12) with SMTP id RAA02818; Sun, 22 Feb 1998 17:04:24 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980223010414.01479f24@pop.sirius.com> X-Sender: anechoic@pop.sirius.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 22 Feb 1998 17:04:14 -0800 To: Derek Pierce Subject: Re: Csound recordings Cc: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk >My name is Derek Pierce and I make music under the name Beatsystem. I have a >Cd EMIT2297 available worldwide on the Em:t label, the Cd was made almost >exclusively using csound, a review may be found on . I >hope you enjoy it, I would also welcome any feedback from the csound crowd. Derek your CD sounds really interesting...can you tell us more about some of the techniques used in the making of the Beatsystem Csound CD? ie granular, algo composition, analysis/resynthesis, etc? thanks KIM ________________________ <> kim.cascone <> <>sound.designer -- headspace<> <>anechoic@sirius.com<> <>http://www.sirius.com/~anechoic<> :: "blueCube( )" :: kim.cascone :: [release date: spring '98, label: Rastermusic] _____________________________________ "the meta-designer creates context, not content" -- Gene Youngblood Received: from stork.maths. Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28021; 23 Feb 98 12:08 GMT Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa20318; 23 Feb 98 12:08 GMT Received: (qmail 10078 invoked from network); 23 Feb 1998 12:08:38 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 23 Feb 1998 12:08:38 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (LAA13237); Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:49:51 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Mon, 23 Feb 98 11:48:37 GMT Received: from styx.spirit.net.au [203.8.218.1] by hermes via ESMTP (LAA22407); Mon, 23 Feb 1998 11:48:08 GMT Received: from sarod (dd242.spirit.net.au [203.13.54.242]) by styx.spirit.net.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA29491 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 22:50:54 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: <34F160B6.2BE@spirit.com.au> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 22:42:46 +1100 From: Matthew A X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.02 (Win95; I) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Subject: [composition versus] Re: Mathematics for sound. [or music?] References: <19980221130226427.AAD184@nobody> <34EFC49E.7C07873A@flash.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk The composition thread that's been meandering through the posts recently has prompted me to add my bits: RE: pete moss wrote: > > i would say that as a general rule, it is good to know as much as possible > about anything. ... > but even a little knowledege is better than none. as far as math goes > one doesnt necessarily need to know what one is doing for their work. (look > at congress for example) twiddling knobs can be very effective even if you > dont know what the knobs are actually doing. in fact some of my I tend to disagree with the "knowing" here. It's more useful to seperate knowledge of mathematical expressions from the actual personal perception of music. Sure math might provide a primitive language (some argue it is the Prime Language of God) but don't forget music is about human perception and what baggage that entails. "Twiddling knobs" happens at the mathematical level too! Just because you can express a 'sound' with formulae doesn't mean you can hear it - so there's trial-and-error here too! I like to think making sounds is liking preparing a palette of colours. Composing is stretching the canvas (time) and applying the colours to have an effect on the viewer/listener. Let's not forget the listener ;0) !MAtthew Armour Received: from stork.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28198; 23 Feb 98 13:00 GMT Received: from pat.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa22712; 23 Feb 98 13:00 GMT Received: (qmail 16136 invoked from network); 23 Feb 1998 13:00:45 -0000 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk (HELO exeter.ac.uk) (144.173.6.14) by pat.bath.ac.uk with SMTP; 23 Feb 1998 13:00:45 -0000 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (MAA21657); Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:36:14 GMT Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.ex.ac.uk; Mon, 23 Feb 98 12:35:54 GMT Received: from root@huitzilo.tezcat.com [204.128.247.17] by hermes via ESMTP (MAA02932); Mon, 23 Feb 1998 12:35:42 GMT Received: from [204.248.80.120] (antiorp.tezcat.com [204.248.80.120]) by huitzilo.tezcat.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/tezcat-96091001) with SMTP id GAA13056 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 1998 06:35:36 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199802231235.GAA13056@huitzilo.tezcat.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 1998 06:40:29 -0600 To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk From: =cw4t7abs Subject: Re: [composition versus] Re: Mathematics for sound. [or humanz] Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk >Sure math might provide a primitive language (some argue it is the Prime >Language of God) but don't forget music is about human perception and >what baggage that entails. aber >"Twiddling knobs" happens at the mathematical level too! >"Twiddling knobs" happens at the mathematical level too! agr.!d. !ntermath 4mulat!onz. >I like to think making sounds is liking preparing a palette of colours. >Composing is stretching the canvas (time) and applying the colours to >have an effect on the viewer/listener. dze v!ewr+l!stenr affekt dze kolorz. >Let's not forget the listener ;0) _+ dze v!ewr+l!stenr affekt dze kompozer _+ !f l!stenr = human muzt 2b d!skardd. >!MAtthew Armour != $ $ $ $ $ $ The traditional Macintosh error codes are displayed like this: $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ 0F0003 w e b . g F x . a u d ! o . k 0 d E . d e s ! g n $ $ $$$$$ $ $ hTTp://www.god-emil.dk/=cw4t7abs\| hTTp://www.tezcat.com/~antiorp $ $ $ $$ $ $ 0F0003 [ 0 f 0 0 0 3 \| m2 s Ch 1 n3n \| k u n Z t ] $ $ $ $ $ $ $ Where F indicates an exception occurred, and 3 indicates an illegal $ $ instruction occurred. $ $