loscil question

Date	1997-04-12 22:19
From	Scott Lindroth
Subject	loscil question
	Hello, When I use loscil to work on an aiff source file, the output soundfile has no amplitude. The source soundfile is read into a table (GEN 01) without any problem, and, yes, I am adding an argument for the base frequency. I'm using the Mills - Mac PPC version of Csound on a Mac 7200/120. Everything works fine when I use oscili, specifying a specific power of two for the table size. What am I doing wrong? //////////////////////////////// ;orchestra sr = 44100 kr = 441 ksmps = 100 nchnls = 1 instr 1 asig loscil 3000, 1/p3, 1, 100 out asig endin ///////////////////////////////// ;score f1 0 0 1 "file.aiff" 0 4 0 ; ^^^ ; I'd like to let GEN 01 handle the table size. i1 0 4 e ////////////////////////////////// Thanks! Scott Lindroth Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa13727; 13 Apr 97 14:40 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28356; 13 Apr 97 14:40 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 14:40:19 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (OAA24760); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 14:35:19 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Sun, 13 Apr 97 14:35:02 +0100 Received: from milhouse.infohouse.com [206.30.88.4] by hermes via ESMTP (CAA12620); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 02:22:16 +0100 Received: from [206.30.88.110] by milhouse2.infohouse.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-12482) with ESMTP id AAA162; Sat, 12 Apr 1997 21:22:15 -0400 X-Sender: ic11748@mail.infohouse.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 21:26:44 -0400 To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk From: tolve Subject: postponing sones Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk thanks to gb for pointing me to p22 of Elements and to R for a well detailed and elegant response. certainly convinced to abandon all hope at this time. in the meantime i suppose i will gain whatever perceptive sense there is to gain for manipulating timbre just working with plain old decibels. as my primary objective is to improve judgement for tweaking relative strengths of partials within a musical tone constructed via additive synthesis, rather than the overall perceived volume of the resulting musical tone, let alone its presence in the overall mix, i may just as easily struggle, as i go, to develop a sense for adjusting volume of sine waves using different numbers of decibels at different frequencies. moreover any such decibel perception may prove useful in other situations and would certainly not be gained through reliance on a mathematical model programmed by others. still think sones would be a great marketing coup though. can't you just see that multicolored 3D fletcher-munson leaping through your eyeballs the minute you turn to that page in the magazine? yours, tolve Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa13733; 13 Apr 97 14:41 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28365; 13 Apr 97 14:41 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 14:40:20 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (OAA24781); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 14:35:47 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Sun, 13 Apr 97 14:35:27 +0100 Received: from whale.gu.net [194.93.190.4] by hermes via ESMTP (XAA08850); Sat, 12 Apr 1997 23:03:36 +0100 Received: from creator.gu.kiev.ua (creator.gu.kiev.ua [194.93.190.3]) by whale.gu.kiev.ua (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA109074; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 01:01:18 +0300 Received: from frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua (frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua [193.124.62.254]) by creator.gu.kiev.ua with ESMTP id AAA04358; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 00:56:34 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua by frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua with ESMTP id AAA26092; (8.7.5/vak+evp/1.8e) Sun, 13 Apr 1997 00:46:30 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua by mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua with ESMTP id AAA29928; (8.7.5/vak+evp/1.8e) Sun, 13 Apr 1997 00:46:01 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa13733; 13 Apr 97 14:41 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28365; 13 Apr 97 14:41 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 14:40:20 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (OAA24781); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 14:35:47 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Sun, 13 Apr 97 14:35:27 +0100 Received: from whale.gu.net [194.93.190.4] by hermes via ESMTP (XAA08850); Sat, 12 Apr 1997 23:03:36 +0100 Received: from creator.gu.kiev.ua (creator.gu.kiev.ua [194.93.190.3]) by whale.gu.kiev.ua (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA109074; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 01:01:18 +0300 Received: from frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua (frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua [193.124.62.254]) by creator.gu.kiev.ua with ESMTP id AAA04358; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 00:56:34 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua by frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua with ESMTP id AAA26092; (8.7.5/vak+evp/1.8e) Sun, 13 Apr 1997 00:46:30 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua by mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua with ESMTP id AAA29928; (8.7.5/vak+evp/1.8e) Sun, 13 Apr 1997 00:46:01 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from snt.vadims by snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua with SMTP id XAA25168; (8.7.5/zah/1.4b) Sat, 12 Apr 1997 23:43:26 +0300 (EET DST) Message-Id: <334FE304.315D@snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua> Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 20:31:16 +0100 From: "Vadim V. Sytnikov" Reply-To: vadims@snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua Organization: Gamos JSC, Moscow, Russia X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Mark Altin Cc: CSound Mailing List Subject: Re: Comprehensive Csound Info References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Mark Altin wrote: > Dr. Boulanger (of Berklee College of Music) is either writing of editing > (I'm not sure which) a book on Csound. It' will be released by MIT press > any month now. You mean Professor Richard Boulanger, I presume ? Yes, that would be a valuable source, I know. But everything released "in print" in USA is virtually unavailable to me, perhaps except for Dr. Dobb's Journal and printed manuals which I purchase along with software products from local dealers -- just look at my reply address. > You might also want to check out the Keyboard web site. > They did an article on Csound awile back (january) and had a fairly > complete set of info about Csound at their site. Could you please provide the URL ? Thank you. Vadim. Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa13832; 13 Apr 97 14:48 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28514; 13 Apr 97 14:48 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 14:48:24 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (OAA24933); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 14:42:23 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Sun, 13 Apr 97 14:35:34 +0100 Received: from scott1@godzilla2.acpub.duke.edu [152.3.233.43] by hermes via ESMTP (WAA07854); Sat, 12 Apr 1997 22:19:07 +0100 Received: (from scott1@localhost) by godzilla2.acpub.duke.edu (8.8.4/Duke-4.0) id RAA27307; Sat, 12 Apr 1997 17:19:09 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 17:19:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Scott Lindroth To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Subject: loscil question Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Hello, When I use loscil to work on an aiff source file, the output soundfile has no amplitude. The source soundfile is read into a table (GEN 01) without any problem, and, yes, I am adding an argument for the base frequency. I'm using the Mills - Mac PPC version of Csound on a Mac 7200/120. Everything works fine when I use oscili, specifying a specific power of two for the table size. What am I doing wrong? //////////////////////////////// ;orchestra sr = 44100 kr = 441 ksmps = 100 nchnls = 1 instr 1 asig loscil 3000, 1/p3, 1, 100 out asig endin ///////////////////////////////// ;score f1 0 0 1 "file.aiff" 0 4 0 ; ^^^ ; I'd like to let GEN 01 handle the table size. i1 0 4 e ////////////////////////////////// Thanks! Scott Lindroth Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa14204; 13 Apr 97 15:05 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28768; 13 Apr 97 15:04 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 15:04:34 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (PAA25317); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 15:00:33 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Sun, 13 Apr 97 14:35:02 +0100 Received: from milhouse.infohouse.com [206.30.88.4] by hermes via ESMTP (CAA12620); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 02:22:16 +0100 Received: from [206.30.88.110] by milhouse2.infohouse.com (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-12482) with ESMTP id AAA162; Sat, 12 Apr 1997 21:22:15 -0400 X-Sender: ic11748@mail.infohouse.com Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 21:26:44 -0400 To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk From: tolve Subject: postponing sones Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk thanks to gb for pointing me to p22 of Elements and to R for a well detailed and elegant response. certainly convinced to abandon all hope at this time. in the meantime i suppose i will gain whatever perceptive sense there is to gain for manipulating timbre just working with plain old decibels. as my primary objective is to improve judgement for tweaking relative strengths of partials within a musical tone constructed via additive synthesis, rather than the overall perceived volume of the resulting musical tone, let alone its presence in the overall mix, i may just as easily struggle, as i go, to develop a sense for adjusting volume of sine waves using different numbers of decibels at different frequencies. moreover any such decibel perception may prove useful in other situations and would certainly not be gained through reliance on a mathematical model programmed by others. still think sones would be a great marketing coup though. can't you just see that multicolored 3D fletcher-munson leaping through your eyeballs the minute you turn to that page in the magazine? yours, tolve Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa14311; 13 Apr 97 15:10 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa28838; 13 Apr 97 15:09 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 15:09:28 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (PAA25473); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 15:04:41 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Sun, 13 Apr 97 14:35:27 +0100 Received: from whale.gu.net [194.93.190.4] by hermes via ESMTP (XAA08850); Sat, 12 Apr 1997 23:03:36 +0100 Received: from creator.gu.kiev.ua (creator.gu.kiev.ua [194.93.190.3]) by whale.gu.kiev.ua (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA109074; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 01:01:18 +0300 Received: from frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua (frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua [193.124.62.254]) by creator.gu.kiev.ua with ESMTP id AAA04358; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 00:56:34 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua by frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua with ESMTP id AAA26092; (8.7.5/vak+evp/1.8e) Sun, 13 Apr 1997 00:46:30 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua by mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua with ESMTP id AAA29928; (8.7.5/vak+evp/1.8e) Sun, 13 Apr 1997 00:46:01 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from snt.vadims by snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua with SMTP id XAA25168; (8.7.5/zah/1.4b) Sat, 12 Apr 1997 23:43:26 +0300 (EET DST) Message-Id: <334FE304.315D@snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua> Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 20:31:16 +0100 From: "Vadim V. Sytnikov" Reply-To: vadims@snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua Organization: Gamos JSC, Moscow, Russia X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Mark Altin Cc: CSound Mailing List Subject: Re: Comprehensive Csound Info References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Mark Altin wrote: > Dr. Boulanger (of Berklee College of Music) is either writing of editing > (I'm not sure which) a book on Csound. It' will be released by MIT press > any month now. You mean Professor Richard Boulanger, I presume ? Yes, that would be a valuable source, I know. But everything released "in print" in USA is virtually unavailable to me, perhaps except for Dr. Dobb's Journal and printed manuals which I purchase along with software products from local dealers -- just look at my reply address. > You might also want to check out the Keyboard web site. > They did an article on Csound awile back (january) and had a fairly > complete set of info about Csound at their site. Could you please provide the URL ? Thank you. Vadim. Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa15085; 13 Apr 97 15:54 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa29444; 13 Apr 97 15:54 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 15:54:16 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (PAA26405); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 15:45:33 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Sun, 13 Apr 97 15:45:27 +0100 Received: from root@big.fishnet.net [205.216.133.3] by hermes via ESMTP (PAA26402); Sun, 13 Apr 1997 15:45:25 +0100 Received: from sinewave (port017.vta.fishnet.net [205.216.133.166]) by big.fishnet.net (8.7.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id GAA26541; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 06:51:05 -0700 Message-Id: <3350E413.50FEB9DA@rcsreg.com> Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 06:48:03 -0700 From: Toby X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; Linux 2.0.27 i486) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Scott Lindroth Cc: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Subject: Re: loscil question References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Scott Lindroth wrote: > > Hello, > > When I use loscil to work on an aiff source file, the output soundfile has > no amplitude. > ;orchestra > sr = 44100 > kr = 441 > ksmps = 100 > nchnls = 1 > > instr 1 > asig loscil 3000, 1/p3, 1, 100 > out asig > endin > The second argument to loscil is the pitch of the resultant sound in cps. Make it match what you specify as the sound's base freq. in order to play the sound unchanged. Toby -There otta be a law- Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa22457; 14 Apr 97 0:52 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id ab07756; 14 Apr 97 0:51 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 00:51:35 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (AAA08346); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 00:46:30 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa22457; 14 Apr 97 0:52 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id ab07756; 14 Apr 97 0:51 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 00:51:35 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (AAA08346); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 00:46:30 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Mon, 14 Apr 97 00:46:24 +0100 Received: from whale.gu.net [194.93.190.4] by hermes via ESMTP (AAA08343); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 00:46:20 +0100 Received: from creator.gu.kiev.ua (creator.gu.kiev.ua [194.93.190.3]) by whale.gu.kiev.ua (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id CAA20646; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 02:46:15 +0300 Received: from frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua (frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua [193.124.62.254]) by creator.gu.kiev.ua with ESMTP id CAA15142; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 02:45:43 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua by frya.zgik.zaporizhzhe.ua with ESMTP id CAA28643; (8.7.5/vak+evp/1.8e) Mon, 14 Apr 1997 02:39:07 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua by mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua with ESMTP id CAA19491; (8.7.5/vak+evp/1.8e) Mon, 14 Apr 1997 02:36:01 +0300 (EET DST) Received: from snt.vadims by snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua with SMTP id BAA12801; (8.7.5/zah/1.4b) Mon, 14 Apr 1997 01:28:51 +0300 (EET DST) Message-Id: <335177D8.2917@snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua> Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 01:18:32 +0100 From: "Vadim V. Sytnikov" Reply-To: vadims@snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua Organization: Gamos JSC, Moscow, Russia X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: Toby Cc: CSound Mailing List Subject: Re: Reply address. References: <334FE304.315D@snt.mlt.zaporizhzhe.ua> <3350E4D9.13A0CCC2@rcsreg.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Toby wrote: > > Vadim V. Sytnikov wrote: > > just look at my reply address. > > Where is that? > .ua stands for Ukraine ( it should be .uk, but we were stuck with .su too long :-) ), a nice country on the Black Sea, but -- almost the opposite side of the globe ( vs. MIT Press ), not to mention it's ex-USSR. Vadim. Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa24554; 14 Apr 97 3:11 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa09942; 14 Apr 97 3:10 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 03:10:37 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (DAA10646); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 03:05:52 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Mon, 14 Apr 97 03:05:46 +0100 Received: from mail-hub1.weeg.uiowa.edu [128.255.56.31] by hermes via ESMTP (DAA10643); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 03:05:43 +0100 Received: from green.weeg.uiowa.edu (jdsouth@green.weeg.uiowa.edu [128.255.56.25]) by mail-hub1.weeg.uiowa.edu (8.7.6/8.7.3) with ESMTP id VAA17492 for ; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 21:05:39 -0500 Received: from localhost by green.weeg.uiowa.edu (8.7.6/client-1.3) id VAA70990; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 21:05:37 -0500 Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 21:05:37 -0500 (CDT) From: "J. Southwood" X-Sender: jdsouth@green.weeg.uiowa.edu To: CSound Mailing List Subject: Csound vs. SoundHack Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Is there any way to do things like SoundHack's spectral extraction, spectral dynamics, and mutation in Csound right out of the box? If not, how difficult would it be to either create stand-alone add-on programs to do them or to add UGs that would carry it out? The reason I ask is that I have a PC--I can run SoundHack using the Mac emulator Executor (by ARDI), but only the non-FPU version so it runs like a turtle. Or, better yet, is there a program that does these things (spectral extraction, etc.) for the Windows(95) platform? Thanks, Jon Southwood jdsouth@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu Jon Southwood ********************************************** I hear and I forget. I see and I remember. * I do and I understand. * * --Chinese Proverb * ********************************************** jdsouth@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25256; 14 Apr 97 3:56 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa10708; 14 Apr 97 3:55 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 03:55:44 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (DAA11405); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 03:45:51 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Mon, 14 Apr 97 03:45:46 +0100 Received: from root@discover-net.net [208.134.196.20] by hermes via ESMTP (DAA11398); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 03:45:37 +0100 Received: from PC_hljmm.discover-net.net (max-ec2-189.discover-net.net [208.134.205.189]) by discover.discover-net.net (8.7.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA04997 for ; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 21:45:14 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: Priority: Normal To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Mime-Version: 1.0 From: Hans Mikelson Subject: 3D Sound Opcode? Date: Sun, 13 Apr 97 20:40:09 PDT Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; X-MAPIextension=".TXT" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Hello, It might be nice to have an opcode which would generate a stereo pair of = audio signals given coordinates (x,y,z) for a source and a listener, the = direction the listener is facing and optionally the direction of the sour= ce and an audio source. Considerations could be made for left/right volu= me, filtering effects and doppler effects and possibly others. This woul= d allow for functions which generate complex orbits to move sounds throug= h space. \| \| \| \ \| / Hans P. Mikelson \| __ \| __/ \| \ \| hljmm@discover-net.net \|__ \|__ \|__ \|__ \_ \|__ http://discover-net.net/~hljmm/ Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa25696; 14 Apr 97 4:22 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa11112; 14 Apr 97 4:21 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 04:21:28 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (EAA12215); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 04:13:13 +0100 Received: from axp1.wku.edu by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Mon, 14 Apr 97 04:12:50 +0100 Received: from pulsar.cs.wku.edu by axp1.wku.edu (MX V4.3 Alpha) with SMTP; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 22:12:28 CDT Received: by pulsar.cs.wku.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id WAA25351; Sun, 13 Apr 1997 22:10:27 -0500 From: Allen Adler Message-Id: <199704140310.WAA25351@pulsar.cs.wku.edu> Subject: Demo tapes To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 22:10:27 -0500 (CDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk I don't have any sound production equipment and also have been unable to install csound. While I figure out what to do about these two problems (which will probably take a while), I would be interested in listening to some audio tapes of stuff people have done with csound. Let me know if you are interested. Allan Adler adler@pulsar.cs.wku.edu Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa26980; 14 Apr 97 5:32 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa12315; 14 Apr 97 5:32 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 05:31:51 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (FAA13754); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 05:19:19 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Mon, 14 Apr 97 05:19:12 +0100 Received: from lynx-f.cbr.dit.csiro.au [192.107.9.19] by hermes via ESMTP (FAA13749); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 05:19:08 +0100 Received: from capella.cbr.dit.csiro.au by lynx.cbr.dit.csiro.au (8.8.3/1.07S) id OAA00760; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:17:08 +1000 (EST) From: Stephen Barrass Received: by capella.cbr.dit.csiro.au (8.8.3/1.09C) id OAA02215; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:17:06 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:17:06 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199704140417.OAA02215@capella.cbr.dit.csiro.au> To: hljmm@discover-net.net Subject: Re: 3D Sound Opcode? Cc: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk hi hans and csound >It might be nice to have an opcode which would generate a stereo pair of = >audio signals given coordinates (x,y,z) for a source and a listener, the = >direction the listener is facing and optionally the direction of the sour= >ce and an audio source. Considerations could be made for left/right volu= >me, filtering effects and doppler effects and possibly others. This woul= >d allow for functions which generate complex orbits to move sounds throug= >h space. well here is an orchestra for spatial audio through stereo pan that takes polar coords (azimuth, elevation, distance) it does a pseudo hrtf by roughly simulating a head shadow attenuation of loudness and high freqs, ear directions, and inter-aural delay it works ok - but the sounds always seem to be behind your head instead of in front ... a common problem in spatial displays i believe i know that hrtf code has been added to recent versions of csound but i havent tried that yet - i guess it is much better than this anyway it might interest some people so here it is (btw it requires whittles zak opcodes) stephen -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- stephen.barrass@cmis.csiro.au @ * ~ ftp://ftp.cbr.dit.csiro.au/staff/stephen/stephen.html whiz pop splash ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; ;; ; headspins.orc ; s.barrass july 95 ; ; ; 24 tracks of 3d sound ; uses binaural delay, low-pass filter and amplitude ; to provide rough position and distance cues ; ; uses the zak gen to do array routing ; sr = 22050 kr = 22050 ksmps = 1 nchnls = 2 ; global ------------------------------------------------ ginyq = sr0.4 gipi = 3.14159265 giattack = 0.005 girelease = 0.005 ; channels gichannels = 24 zakinit gichannels,gichannels ; pseudo HRTF gidelaymax = 0.001 gidelaymid = gidelaymax/2.0 gidelaymin = 0.0001 gifmin = 2.0/gidelaymax gifscale = ginyq/2.171 ; pinnae notch cue ginotchf = 11000 ginotchw = 200 giamplut = 90 ; distance-to-amplitude lookup table ; angle of the ear relative to the side of the head (in degrees) giearangle = 10 ; ellipse gie = 0.6 ; eccentricity gik = (1-gie)/gie ; normalise ; ; cable ; plug a sound into a channel ; instr start dur channel patch pitch ; ;======================================================= ; channel instr 1 ; input parameters --------------------------------------------- idur = p3 ich = p4 ; channel ipatch = p5 ; patch ipitch = p6 ; pitch octave.class format 8.00 = middle C ; derived parameters --------------------------------------------- ifroot = cpspch(ipitch) ; root frequency in hz print idur, ich, ipatch, ipitch, ifroot kamp linen 1, giattack, idur, girelease ; declicking envelope ivib iunirand 20 ; random vibrato frequency print ivib avib oscil 4,ivib+20,91 ; vibrato ach oscil 1, ifroot+avib, ipatch zaw ach, ich ; route to the z channel endin ; this placer uses the declick envelope ; placer ; place a channel in the scene ; and write to stereo output ; ; ; instr start dur channel distance angle height instr 3 ; input parameters ---------------------------------------- idur = p3 ach zar p4 ; channel to play idistance = p5 ; distance 0 to 127 metres iangle = p6 ; angle 0_360 degrees where 0 = right hand iheight = p7 ; height -10_10 below_level_above print idur,idistance,iangle,iheight ; derived parameters ---------------------------------------- idb table idistance, giamplut ; convert distance-to-amplitude iamp = ampdb(idb) irevtime = idistance/5 ; reverb in seconds iradians = iangle2gipi/360 ; convert degreees-to-radians print idb, iamp, iradians, irevtime ; delay ix = cos(iradians) idelay = abs(ix)gidelaymax + gidelaymin irdelay = (ix < 0 ? idelay : gidelaymin) ildelay = (ix < 0 ? gidelaymin : idelay) print ix, idelay, ildelay, irdelay ; approx HRTF using elliptical functions for each ear ; right ear irearangle = iangle-giearangle irhrtf = gikgie/(1-giecos(irearangle2gipi/360)) ; left ear ilearangle = iangle-180+giearangle ilhrtf = gikgie/(1-giecos(ilearangle2gipi/360)) print ilhrtf,irhrtf ; k-rate ------------------------------------------------ ; de-clicking envelope kamp linen iamp, giattack, idur, girelease ; a-rate ------------------------------------------------ ; distance related reverb ;arev reverb ach, irevtime ; angle positioning by binaural delay ; note : there really should be frequency dependence here... ; used fixed delay lines because deltap is stuffed ! al0 = achilhrtf al1 delay al0, ildelay ar0 = achirhrtf ar1 delay ar0, irdelay ; attenuate upper frequencies for head shadow al2 tone al1, exp(ilhrtf)gifscale ar2 tone ar1, exp(irhrtf)gifscale ; put in a frequency notch as a pinnae cue ;al3 areson al0, ginotchf, ginotchw ;ar3 areson ar0, ginotchf, ginotchw dispfft al2, 0.3, 1024 dispfft ar2, 0.3, 1024 outs al2kamp, ar2kamp endin ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; ;; ; headspins.sco ; s.barrass july 95 ; ; f1 0 2049 11 8 ; buzz f90 0 128 -5 100 126 30 1 ; loudness exponential f91 0 1025 10 1 ; sin ; source ; start up each sound source ;i1 start dur channel ftable pitch ; 1..24 1..16 octave.class ; ;======================================================= i1 0 3 1 1 6.00 ;i1 0 3 2 1 7.01 ; spin each sound source around ;instr start dur channel dist angle height i3 0 0.3 2 30 0 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . 360 0 e Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa27260; 14 Apr 97 5:48 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa12561; 14 Apr 97 5:48 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 05:48:01 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (FAA14206); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 05:41:59 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Mon, 14 Apr 97 05:41:53 +0100 Received: from lynx-f.cbr.dit.csiro.au [192.107.9.19] by hermes via ESMTP (FAA14201); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 05:41:51 +0100 Received: from capella.cbr.dit.csiro.au by lynx.cbr.dit.csiro.au (8.8.3/1.07S) id OAA01758; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:40:04 +1000 (EST) From: Stephen Barrass Received: by capella.cbr.dit.csiro.au (8.8.3/1.09C) id OAA02218; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:40:02 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 14:40:02 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199704140440.OAA02218@capella.cbr.dit.csiro.au> To: hljmm@discover-net.net Subject: Re: 3D Sound Opcode? Cc: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk wooops, sorryy that headspins.sco has the wrong channel turned on so nothing will come out.. heres a score that will work ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; ;; ; headspins.sco ; s.barrass july 95 ; ; f1 0 2049 11 8 ; buzz f90 0 128 -5 100 126 30 1 ; loudness exponential f91 0 1025 10 1 ; sin ; source ; start up each sound source ;i1 start dur channel ftable pitch ; 1..24 1..16 octave.class ; ;======================================================= i1 0 3 1 1 6.00 ;i1 0 3 2 1 7.01 ; spin each sound source around ;instr start dur channel dist angle height i3 0 0.3 1 30 0 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . > 0 i3 + . . . 360 0 e stephen ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- stephen.barrass@cmis.csiro.au @ * ~ ftp://ftp.cbr.dit.csiro.au/staff/stephen/stephen.html whiz pop splash Received: from stork2.maths.bath.ac.uk by omphalos.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa01570; 14 Apr 97 11:48 BST Received: from goggins.bath.ac.uk by stork.maths.Bath.AC.UK id aa20669; 14 Apr 97 11:47 BST Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by goggins.bath.ac.uk with SMTP (PP); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 11:47:44 +0100 Received: from noether [144.173.8.10] by hermes via SMTP (LAA26659); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 11:24:35 +0100 Received: from hermes.ex.ac.uk by maths.exeter.ac.uk; Mon, 14 Apr 97 11:24:25 +0100 Received: from maila.surrey.ac.uk [131.227.102.8] by hermes via SMTP (LAA26649); Mon, 14 Apr 1997 11:24:24 +0100 Received: from psy.surrey.ac.uk (actually host psy1.psy.surrey.ac.uk) by maila.surrey.ac.uk with SMTP (PP) with ESMTP; Mon, 14 Apr 1997 11:23:57 +0100 Received: from PSY1/MAIL_QUEUE by psy.surrey.ac.uk (Mercury 1.21); 14 Apr 97 10:25:52 GMT0BST Received: from MAIL_QUEUE by PSY1 (Mercury 1.30); 14 Apr 97 10:25:03 GMT0BST From: Peter Kearton Organization: Psychology Dept, Surrey Univ. U.K. To: tolve , csound@maths.ex.ac.uk Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 10:24:41 GMT Subject: Re: postponing sones Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail v3.31 Message-Id: <180E8D1698@psy.surrey.ac.uk> Sender: owner-csound-outgoing@maths.ex.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Hi, I think the best book you could read on the perception of loudness in both pure and complex tones is:- 'An Introduction to the Psychology of Hearing' by Brian C.J. Moore (no relation?), a new edition of the book has just come out (Acedemic Press) The whole book is a comprehensive introduction to the psychophysics of hearing, with Chapters 2 and 3 being particularly relevant. Chapter 3 deal with 'Frequency Analysis, masking, and the critical band'. If you read about auditory filters and the critical band concept this will point in the right direction for approximate scaling of loudness for complex tones derived from additive synthesis. Basically component tones close enough in frequency to fall within the 'critical band' will interact. From the above book 2nd Ed. p.84:- 'The increase in loudness with increasing bandwidth can be understood if we assume that when the bandwidth of a sound is sufficient to occupy more than one critical band, the loudness in adjacent, but not overlapping, bands is summed to give total loudness.' Critical Bands are approximately 10 % - 15 % of therir centre frequency. (However, Moore (Brian C.J !) notes that the whole area is one of contention). On page 85 he uses Steven's Power Law that says Loudness (aprox.) = kI^0.3 k = constant (depending on units and subject !) I = Physical Intensity So, if you have two pure tones of the same intensity, that are close enough to occupy the same 'critical band' and you keep the same intensities, but slowly increase the frequency separation what is the effect on loudness perception ? When the two tones occupy different frequency bands then in effect you now have two bands with half the original intensity. Halving the intensity is equivalent to 0.81 the original loudness (by Steven's). So the total loudness in the two bands will now be 2 * 0.81 = 1.62 times the original ! It's a woolly area though. The other thing I would suggest would be to get hold of some specifications for sophisticated environmental noise meters. The good ones use algorithms that take psychophisical data into consideration. Don't despair just yet ! Pete Kearton > certainly convinced to abandon all hope at this time. in the meantime i > suppose i will gain whatever perceptive sense there is to gain for > manipulating timbre just working with plain old decibels. as my primary > objective is to improve judgement for tweaking relative strengths of > partials within a musical tone constructed via additive synthesis, rather > than the overall perceived volume of the resulting musical tone, let alone > its presence in the overall mix, i may just as easily struggle, as i go, to > develop a sense for adjusting volume of sine waves using different numbers > of decibels at different frequencies. moreover any such decibel perception > may prove useful in other situations and would certainly not be gained > through reliance on a mathematical model programmed by others. *********************************************** Peter Kearton, University of Surrey Psychology Department, Guildford, United Kingdom. GU2 5XH Tel. UK (01483) 300800 Ext.3346 e-mail - P.kearton@surrey.ac.uk ***********************************************