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Dear csounders,
I have been trying to use excel as a text editor, it
works partly well, but I experienced some problems.
Maybe someone has suggestions for solution...
Problems so far experienced are:
-Csound recognizes any ; used in excel as ";"
and produces lots of errors therefore
Some f- tables can not be read or are read falsely:
-Soundfile names in Gen 1 like "sundfile.aif" are not
recognised
-Gen 10 with only 1 given as the first argument
(sometimes) produces everything but a sinewave
(someting far more complex, but with definitely no
other arguments given)
Additional information:
-I work in the save as "text only- spaces shown as
blanks" -mode in excel, office 98 version
any help appreciated.
Many greetings, Jan Jacob
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Reply-To: Michael Rhoades
From: Michael Rhoades
To: Csound
References: <19991106140711.16941.rocketmail@web2906.mail.yahoo.com>
Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 10:26:21 -0500
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Subject: Re: [Csnd] excel as text editor
Hi Jan,
I have been using Excel as a score editor for Csound for over a year
with great results. The versatility and power of Excel are perfect for
simplification of many otherwise mundane and time-consuming scoring
activities. Here is what I do:
1.) Save all .sco files as text (tab delimited) .txt
2.) When opening a .sco file, select the file, in step one of the Text
Import Wizard, select the delimited radial button. In step two, check both
tab and space in the delimiters section and " as your text qualifier. Then
hit the finish button at the bottom.
3.) As a hint, when you want a + or a - sign always proceed them with a
' and they will work.
4.) When I want to transpose a pitch or start time or whatever on a set of
cells, I put a formula, which refers to the cells I want to modify, in a
parellel but blank set of cells, drag it down as far as I need to, then copy
those cells and "paste special" "values" only into the old cells. Works
great and saves much time when you get the hang of it.
I want to experiment around, when I learn VB, with inserting VB
progarms into certain cells for a computer aided compositional tool. Very
exciting.
Hope this helps you out. If you have any questions, feel free to let me
know.
Michael Rhoades
Make the Rhoadsmith Web Connection at
http://www.innerlightpub.com/rhoadsmith
> -Csound recognizes any ; used in excel as ";"
> and produces lots of errors therefore
> Some f- tables can not be read or are read falsely:
> -Soundfile names in Gen 1 like "sundfile.aif" are not
> recognised
> -Gen 10 with only 1 given as the first argument
> (sometimes) produces everything but a sinewave
> (someting far more complex, but with definitely no
> other arguments given)
>
>
> Additional information:
> -I work in the save as "text only- spaces shown as
> blanks" -mode in excel, office 98 version
>
> any help appreciated.
>
> Many greetings, Jan Jacob
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Subject: Re: [Csnd] Phase Vocoder help
Thanks, richard and german, they both worked great!
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To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
Subject: [Csnd] [ot]
>Hi Jan,
zum apel +?
> Hope this helps you out. If you have any questions, feel free to let me
>know.
>Michael Rhoades
>
>
>Make the Rhoadsmith Web Connection at
>http://www.innerlightpub.com/rhoadsmith
konzum>g!glb!tz
+
1 kuer!.
= Web Development by Inner Light Publishing
= ultra !kk non +?
+ Dicsography =_?
-
innerlightpub - perm!t zom 12 fa!nt
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From: Michael Gogins
To: Paul Barton-Davis
Cc: Csound List
Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 11:55:08 -0500
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Subject: Re: [Csnd] [CUD] line event problem
The open and close functions are for opening and closing the Csound side of
these interfaces - not for opening and closing the operating system devices.
This relates to synchronizing streams and so on. The client (the actual
Csound application) of the Csound object would (a) open an operating system
device,typically in an independent thread, (b) create an AbstractMonitor
object using OS synchronization primitives, (c) open the Csound object side
of the interface, (d) run the Csound object. The IO threads synchronize the
buffering of data between the OS devices and the Csound object by signaling
the monitor.
Thanks for the libsigc++ URL. This looks like useful stuff for writing the
OS device handlers themselves, but is not required in the C++ class for
Csound I am discussing here.
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Barton-Davis [mailto:pbd@Op.Net]
Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 12:29 AM
To: Michael Gogins
Cc: Csound List
Subject: Re: [Csnd] [CUD] line event problem
>Why are MIDI and audio part of my Csound class? Actually, there ARE
separate
>MIDI and audio objects feeding data into and out of my Csound class, I just
>didn't show them. What I showed is simply the lowest-level interface where
>the data does somehow have to get into and out of Csound.
your API shows the Csound object opening and closing MIDI and
devices. this is the part that seems wrong to me. or perhaps i'm
misinterpreting the function names ?
>You are right that it is debatable whether MIDI should exist at the core of
>Csound. It would be better if it did not. That, however, would require a
>fundamental redesign of Csound in which regular score events could
>optionally have "off" events and associated "control" events, so that an
>external MIDI driver could produce score "on" events and score "off"
events.
>But if there is no fundamental redesign, then why not bring MIDI data in,
>the opcodes are already there and it is simpler that way.
right, the opcodes are already there. i just think that the MIDI data
should stop right at the opcodes. but you're right: as long as Csound
scores are based on the idea that note duration is known ahead of
time, MIDI has to exist in its own world, penetrating deep into the
core.
>I'm not familiar with libsigc++. Where does it live?
http://www.ece.ucdavis.edu/~kenelson/libsigc++/
this is the new C++ "signal" system at the heart of the next version
of Gtk--
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From: Michael Gogins
To: Stefan Kersten
Cc: Csound List ,
Csound Linux/Unix List
Subject: [CUD] RE: [Csnd] csound library was: line event problem
Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 12:09:45 -0500
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Gabriel Maldonado's DirectCsound currently implements a dynamic loader for
opcodes (plugin opcodes) that I created. He also distributes a plugin
incorporating Perry Cook's STK instruments as opcodes.
This scheme uses the existing Csound code without change except for
dynamically allocating and reallocating the opcode dispatch table, and
adding the loader routine.
I agree that it would be useful to provide a C++ interface for opcodes, and
also, by the way, for GEN routines. This raises various issues with regard
to ending instrument instances, memory allocation, what access opcodes have
to the engine, and so on. I think it would be better to proceed with the
"Csound class" idea first, and then, if agreeable, produce the plugin spec
for opcodes and GENs.
As you point out, it would be highly desirable to have an abstract C++ base
class for opcodes, so that doing new opcodes would be simplified by deriving
from the base and only implementing the virtual OnInitialization,
OnKontrolSample, and OnAudioSample routines. To this I would add an
OnFinalization call. And I would add that a similar abstract base class for
GEN routines would be desirable.
I think the problem here is that John ffitch, who has done and is doing the
world a great service by managing the canonical Csound code, does not have
the equipment, the knowledge, or the time to manage cross-platform
development on this scale. But if the Csound community could agree on the
abstract interfaces required - something like my Csound class, the
AbstractMonitor, the AbstractOpcode and the AbstractGEN - then the work
could be divided up and done by people familiar with each platform.
As I've pointed out in the past, if something like this isn't done, then in
a few years the torch will pass from Csound to some other synthesizer
implemented in a more flexible, more up to date manner.
-----Original Message-----
From: steve@cs.tu-berlin.de [mailto:steve@cs.tu-berlin.de]On Behalf Of
Stefan Kersten
Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 7:42 AM
To: Michael Gogins
Cc: Csound List; Csound Linux/Unix List
Subject: Re: [Csnd] csound library was: line event problem
Michael Gogins wrote:
> I'm increasingly convinced that Csound is the best instrument on the
planet
> at this time;
At least one of the best ;)
> To repeat, the single C++ class is absolutely the simplest interface I
could
> come up with that would separate the "kernel" from the operating system
> calls without altering the workings of Csound. Additional modules are
> unnecessary complexity.
What I meant here is just a header file with all (potentially
easy-to-use) functions and data structures declared you need to create a
new opcode. This would not complexify but greatly simplify things.
> If one desires a better language than Csound, by all means, use SAOL,
which
> is potentially better than Csound.
I think the question is not wether to improve csound as a language, as
it has evolved over the time and seems to have proven to be a quite
flexible synthesis engine, but to improve its flexibility and usability
in its combination with other software and applications. Here you could
make csound into a C++ class as you suggested earlier, or oyu could
leave the current structure mostly untouched and build up some higher
level functions from the existing ones in order to control a csound
library - which would then lack the separation of os dependent and
independent code a.o. of course. The question also arises if such a
thing is desirable at all, since e.g. John ffitch has maintained the
sources for years and seems to be quite into them ...
gruss - regards - stefan.
PS: SAOL might have a design better than csound's, but it surely has its
drawbacks, too; if you want the state of the art, use super collider :)
__________________________________________________________________________
K-Labz [a K-Hornz subdivision] - steve-k@gmx.net - http://w3.to/K-Hornz
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From: Michael Gogins
To: Stefan Kersten
Cc: Csound List ,
Csound Linux/Unix List
Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 12:09:45 -0500
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Subject: Re: [Csnd] csound library was: line event problem
Gabriel Maldonado's DirectCsound currently implements a dynamic loader for
opcodes (plugin opcodes) that I created. He also distributes a plugin
incorporating Perry Cook's STK instruments as opcodes.
This scheme uses the existing Csound code without change except for
dynamically allocating and reallocating the opcode dispatch table, and
adding the loader routine.
I agree that it would be useful to provide a C++ interface for opcodes, and
also, by the way, for GEN routines. This raises various issues with regard
to ending instrument instances, memory allocation, what access opcodes have
to the engine, and so on. I think it would be better to proceed with the
"Csound class" idea first, and then, if agreeable, produce the plugin spec
for opcodes and GENs.
As you point out, it would be highly desirable to have an abstract C++ base
class for opcodes, so that doing new opcodes would be simplified by deriving
from the base and only implementing the virtual OnInitialization,
OnKontrolSample, and OnAudioSample routines. To this I would add an
OnFinalization call. And I would add that a similar abstract base class for
GEN routines would be desirable.
I think the problem here is that John ffitch, who has done and is doing the
world a great service by managing the canonical Csound code, does not have
the equipment, the knowledge, or the time to manage cross-platform
development on this scale. But if the Csound community could agree on the
abstract interfaces required - something like my Csound class, the
AbstractMonitor, the AbstractOpcode and the AbstractGEN - then the work
could be divided up and done by people familiar with each platform.
As I've pointed out in the past, if something like this isn't done, then in
a few years the torch will pass from Csound to some other synthesizer
implemented in a more flexible, more up to date manner.
-----Original Message-----
From: steve@cs.tu-berlin.de [mailto:steve@cs.tu-berlin.de]On Behalf Of
Stefan Kersten
Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 7:42 AM
To: Michael Gogins
Cc: Csound List; Csound Linux/Unix List
Subject: Re: [Csnd] csound library was: line event problem
Michael Gogins wrote:
> I'm increasingly convinced that Csound is the best instrument on the
planet
> at this time;
At least one of the best ;)
> To repeat, the single C++ class is absolutely the simplest interface I
could
> come up with that would separate the "kernel" from the operating system
> calls without altering the workings of Csound. Additional modules are
> unnecessary complexity.
What I meant here is just a header file with all (potentially
easy-to-use) functions and data structures declared you need to create a
new opcode. This would not complexify but greatly simplify things.
> If one desires a better language than Csound, by all means, use SAOL,
which
> is potentially better than Csound.
I think the question is not wether to improve csound as a language, as
it has evolved over the time and seems to have proven to be a quite
flexible synthesis engine, but to improve its flexibility and usability
in its combination with other software and applications. Here you could
make csound into a C++ class as you suggested earlier, or oyu could
leave the current structure mostly untouched and build up some higher
level functions from the existing ones in order to control a csound
library - which would then lack the separation of os dependent and
independent code a.o. of course. The question also arises if such a
thing is desirable at all, since e.g. John ffitch has maintained the
sources for years and seems to be quite into them ...
gruss - regards - stefan.
PS: SAOL might have a design better than csound's, but it surely has its
drawbacks, too; if you want the state of the art, use super collider :)
__________________________________________________________________________
K-Labz [a K-Hornz subdivision] - steve-k@gmx.net - http://w3.to/K-Hornz
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To: Csound List ,
Csound Linux/Unix List
Subject: Re: [CUD] RE: [Csnd] csound library was: line event problem
In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 06 Nov 1999 12:09:45 EST."
Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 13:08:51 -0500
From: Paul Barton-Davis
Sender: owner-csound-unix-dev@ilogic.com.au
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it will be hard for me to say this without sounding bitter, which i
don't mean to at all. i really mean that. this is all "free" software,
and we are all welcome to do whatever we want. i am really, really,
really not griping. honest.
what michael is describing is *exactly* what i have tried to do with
Quasimodo. it seems that because i didn't write it for Windows or
Java, michael feels it needs to be done again.
as it stands, Quasimodo is moving toward reliance on a very minimal
set of OS/compiler functionality requirements, cross-platform
compilability, and so forth. i have no doubt that a port to a
non-POSIX-ish OS would be more work than the existing ports to IRIX
and Solaris, but not much more if pthreads are available. such an
effort would greatly benefit quasimodo, just as stephane conversy's
ports to IRIX and Solaris have done by identifying the
platform-dependent parts more clearly so that they can be isolated and
abstracted. our new use of autoconf (still pretty minimal at this
point, but we are using it) makes the prospect of a port to say, BeOS,
much closer than it was a month ago.
The Quasimodo engine has plugin opcodes, plugin function table
generators, plugin language parsers, plugin-just-about-anything-you-want.
it was written with the intent of moving completely away from the
tangled code that Csound's engine itself has become, but keeping
compatibility with the opcode source. it already has a GTK GUI
interface, a Python GUI interface and a TCP/IP server implementation.
yes, it uses more than a base ANSI C++ runtime environment. is that
enough of a reason to do this work all over again ? i would have
thought that the simple presence of a formal language definition (in
the form of a bison grammar) within Quasimodo would be enough to give
it a strong advantage over Csound. perhaps not. there are *many, many*
issues that i have already dealt with as i moved the opcodes into
running in a multithreaded, more formally defined environment. i can
guarantee that most will come up again in any attempt to do this.
michael - what specific aspects of quasimodo lead you to want to avoid
the path it tries to follow ? i can imagine some for myself, but i
would be interested in your feedback.
--p
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To: Csound List ,
Csound Linux/Unix List
In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 06 Nov 1999 12:09:45 EST."
Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 13:08:51 -0500
From: Paul Barton-Davis
Subject: Re: [Csnd] [CUD] RE: [Csnd] csound library was: line event problem
it will be hard for me to say this without sounding bitter, which i
don't mean to at all. i really mean that. this is all "free" software,
and we are all welcome to do whatever we want. i am really, really,
really not griping. honest.
what michael is describing is *exactly* what i have tried to do with
Quasimodo. it seems that because i didn't write it for Windows or
Java, michael feels it needs to be done again.
as it stands, Quasimodo is moving toward reliance on a very minimal
set of OS/compiler functionality requirements, cross-platform
compilability, and so forth. i have no doubt that a port to a
non-POSIX-ish OS would be more work than the existing ports to IRIX
and Solaris, but not much more if pthreads are available. such an
effort would greatly benefit quasimodo, just as stephane conversy's
ports to IRIX and Solaris have done by identifying the
platform-dependent parts more clearly so that they can be isolated and
abstracted. our new use of autoconf (still pretty minimal at this
point, but we are using it) makes the prospect of a port to say, BeOS,
much closer than it was a month ago.
The Quasimodo engine has plugin opcodes, plugin function table
generators, plugin language parsers, plugin-just-about-anything-you-want.
it was written with the intent of moving completely away from the
tangled code that Csound's engine itself has become, but keeping
compatibility with the opcode source. it already has a GTK GUI
interface, a Python GUI interface and a TCP/IP server implementation.
yes, it uses more than a base ANSI C++ runtime environment. is that
enough of a reason to do this work all over again ? i would have
thought that the simple presence of a formal language definition (in
the form of a bison grammar) within Quasimodo would be enough to give
it a strong advantage over Csound. perhaps not. there are *many, many*
issues that i have already dealt with as i moved the opcodes into
running in a multithreaded, more formally defined environment. i can
guarantee that most will come up again in any attempt to do this.
michael - what specific aspects of quasimodo lead you to want to avoid
the path it tries to follow ? i can imagine some for myself, but i
would be interested in your feedback.
--p
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Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 11:55:14 +0100 (CET)
From: Nicola Bernardini
To: Gabriel Maldonado
cc: Csound Mailing List
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Subject: Re: [Csnd] [Beta Tester Team] template example
Dear Gabriel,
even though I did not subscribe to your call for beta tester (I'm
a bug producer already), I'm of course interested in the work done
by the group.
Thursday, Gabriel Maldonado mi scrisse cio` che segue:
> After the suggestions of Rasmus Ekman, I wrote this template example orchestra. The importat things are the comment lines at the beginning of the orchestra. It must inform about which platform the orchestra has been tested with, as well as the sr, kr etc. Eventually it should remark if some bug rises under determinate circumstances.
> Any comments, additions and suggestions are welcome.
Your template seems indeed very useful and nice. I don't know if this
has been discussed already, but with something like that you can indeed
test if the application does not crash (even though it may crash under
some conditions and not crash under other, but let's leave it like that),
test if the opcode works (in the sense that it produces some output),
and test if it runs on platform X and/or platform Y.
What about the quality of the output? What I mean by that is:
1) is there a reference output (perhaps done with some other precision
tool that is trustable at least more than csound, or more than one)
so that deviation from the output can be measured?
2) these measurements would probably differ from platform to platform...
3) there could be numerical bugs in the algorithms which could be
uncovered by the reference implementation of the algorithm in some
other language (say Matlab/Octave, or Mathematica, or whatever you like)
Sinewaves oscillators can be easy to test, but when you get to some
nifty filters or reverbs, then it gets harder, does'nt it?
Have you already discussed this aspect?
ciao
Nicola
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nicola Bernardini
E-mail: nicb@axnet.it
Re graphics: A picture is worth 10K words -- but only those to describe
the picture. Hardly any sets of 10K words can be adequately described
with pictures.
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Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 21:00:37 +0100
From: Jens Groh
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Subject: [Csnd] MIDI controller utility for Windows Csound
Hello Csound/Windows and DirectCsound users!
If you use to control your Csound orchestras with real-time MIDI
controllers and have always been wondering (like me) how to restore the
controller states after stopping and restarting a Csound orchestra, I
can recommend a little software called "CCmemo" that I found on the 'net
today. It tracks MIDI control change messages and can take and replay
snapshots of them. It is freeware; you can get it here:
http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/Strasse/3731/mysoftwares.html
You may need "Hubi's Loopback Device" as well in order to route the MIDI
data between the applications (freeware, too):
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/2872/hmidilb/hmdlpbk.html
Happy real-time Csound tweaking!
Jens Groh
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From: Michael Gogins
To: Paul Barton-Davis , Csound List ,
Csound Linux/Unix List
Subject: RE: [Csnd] [CUD] RE: [Csnd] csound library was: line event problem
Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 22:20:23 -0500
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I'll take another look at Quasimodo. I'm not trying to make anybody bitter.
To answer your question, what kept me from using it:
1. When downloaded it, I didn't seem to end up with the whole source code
base. This was a while ago, and I may have done something wrong, or things
may have changed.
2. When I downloaded it again, I still didn't seem to end up with the whole
source code base. I did note that (a) it did not look like it would compile
straight off on Windows, and (b) it looked like the opcode code had to be
massaged to fit within the Quasimodo engine.
Please understand, I'm not a full time music developer. I have a day job
writing C++ for foreign currency trading systems. In my free time, I want to
spend most of my time writing music, not developing software. If something
looks like it's going to take more than a few hours a week, I don't do it.
That's why I rolled my own ActiveX Csound project back to a shell for the
consound or winsound or DirectCsound programs, instead of continuing to grow
it into an all-in-one, library-based, re-entrant engine like Quasimodo. This
project was going quite well, but when the latest version of Csound came out
I threw up my hands and said, enough, I don't want to keep patching this
thing. It was getting further and further removed from the Csound code base.
Also understand, Windows (C++ or Java) is my platform. I'm not a Linux guy
(yet, anyway). I don't see why this should make you bitter - it's just a
fact about me. Windows PCs are cheap, they don't need any maintenance time
(in my experience), and there's a lot of great Windows commercial software
that I use, like Cool Edit Pro and Cubase VST, not to mention the Visual C++
development environment, which is light years ahead of anything else I've
tried.
As I said, I'll make another stab at using Quasimodo. I'll let you know what
I find. If it meets my needs, I'll use it in a flash, and I'll advise others
to use it also - but one of those needs is that it be easy to use on
Windows.
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Barton-Davis [mailto:pbd@Op.Net]
Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 1:09 PM
To: Csound List; Csound Linux/Unix List
Subject: Re: [Csnd] [CUD] RE: [Csnd] csound library was: line event
problem
it will be hard for me to say this without sounding bitter, which i
don't mean to at all. i really mean that. this is all "free" software,
and we are all welcome to do whatever we want. i am really, really,
really not griping. honest.
what michael is describing is *exactly* what i have tried to do with
Quasimodo. it seems that because i didn't write it for Windows or
Java, michael feels it needs to be done again.
as it stands, Quasimodo is moving toward reliance on a very minimal
set of OS/compiler functionality requirements, cross-platform
compilability, and so forth. i have no doubt that a port to a
non-POSIX-ish OS would be more work than the existing ports to IRIX
and Solaris, but not much more if pthreads are available. such an
effort would greatly benefit quasimodo, just as stephane conversy's
ports to IRIX and Solaris have done by identifying the
platform-dependent parts more clearly so that they can be isolated and
abstracted. our new use of autoconf (still pretty minimal at this
point, but we are using it) makes the prospect of a port to say, BeOS,
much closer than it was a month ago.
The Quasimodo engine has plugin opcodes, plugin function table
generators, plugin language parsers, plugin-just-about-anything-you-want.
it was written with the intent of moving completely away from the
tangled code that Csound's engine itself has become, but keeping
compatibility with the opcode source. it already has a GTK GUI
interface, a Python GUI interface and a TCP/IP server implementation.
yes, it uses more than a base ANSI C++ runtime environment. is that
enough of a reason to do this work all over again ? i would have
thought that the simple presence of a formal language definition (in
the form of a bison grammar) within Quasimodo would be enough to give
it a strong advantage over Csound. perhaps not. there are *many, many*
issues that i have already dealt with as i moved the opcodes into
running in a multithreaded, more formally defined environment. i can
guarantee that most will come up again in any attempt to do this.
michael - what specific aspects of quasimodo lead you to want to avoid
the path it tries to follow ? i can imagine some for myself, but i
would be interested in your feedback.
--p
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From: Michael Gogins
To: Paul Barton-Davis , Csound List ,
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Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 22:20:23 -0500
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Subject: Re: [Csnd] [CUD] RE: [Csnd] csound library was: line event problem
I'll take another look at Quasimodo. I'm not trying to make anybody bitter.
To answer your question, what kept me from using it:
1. When downloaded it, I didn't seem to end up with the whole source code
base. This was a while ago, and I may have done something wrong, or things
may have changed.
2. When I downloaded it again, I still didn't seem to end up with the whole
source code base. I did note that (a) it did not look like it would compile
straight off on Windows, and (b) it looked like the opcode code had to be
massaged to fit within the Quasimodo engine.
Please understand, I'm not a full time music developer. I have a day job
writing C++ for foreign currency trading systems. In my free time, I want to
spend most of my time writing music, not developing software. If something
looks like it's going to take more than a few hours a week, I don't do it.
That's why I rolled my own ActiveX Csound project back to a shell for the
consound or winsound or DirectCsound programs, instead of continuing to grow
it into an all-in-one, library-based, re-entrant engine like Quasimodo. This
project was going quite well, but when the latest version of Csound came out
I threw up my hands and said, enough, I don't want to keep patching this
thing. It was getting further and further removed from the Csound code base.
Also understand, Windows (C++ or Java) is my platform. I'm not a Linux guy
(yet, anyway). I don't see why this should make you bitter - it's just a
fact about me. Windows PCs are cheap, they don't need any maintenance time
(in my experience), and there's a lot of great Windows commercial software
that I use, like Cool Edit Pro and Cubase VST, not to mention the Visual C++
development environment, which is light years ahead of anything else I've
tried.
As I said, I'll make another stab at using Quasimodo. I'll let you know what
I find. If it meets my needs, I'll use it in a flash, and I'll advise others
to use it also - but one of those needs is that it be easy to use on
Windows.
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Barton-Davis [mailto:pbd@Op.Net]
Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 1:09 PM
To: Csound List; Csound Linux/Unix List
Subject: Re: [Csnd] [CUD] RE: [Csnd] csound library was: line event
problem
it will be hard for me to say this without sounding bitter, which i
don't mean to at all. i really mean that. this is all "free" software,
and we are all welcome to do whatever we want. i am really, really,
really not griping. honest.
what michael is describing is *exactly* what i have tried to do with
Quasimodo. it seems that because i didn't write it for Windows or
Java, michael feels it needs to be done again.
as it stands, Quasimodo is moving toward reliance on a very minimal
set of OS/compiler functionality requirements, cross-platform
compilability, and so forth. i have no doubt that a port to a
non-POSIX-ish OS would be more work than the existing ports to IRIX
and Solaris, but not much more if pthreads are available. such an
effort would greatly benefit quasimodo, just as stephane conversy's
ports to IRIX and Solaris have done by identifying the
platform-dependent parts more clearly so that they can be isolated and
abstracted. our new use of autoconf (still pretty minimal at this
point, but we are using it) makes the prospect of a port to say, BeOS,
much closer than it was a month ago.
The Quasimodo engine has plugin opcodes, plugin function table
generators, plugin language parsers, plugin-just-about-anything-you-want.
it was written with the intent of moving completely away from the
tangled code that Csound's engine itself has become, but keeping
compatibility with the opcode source. it already has a GTK GUI
interface, a Python GUI interface and a TCP/IP server implementation.
yes, it uses more than a base ANSI C++ runtime environment. is that
enough of a reason to do this work all over again ? i would have
thought that the simple presence of a formal language definition (in
the form of a bison grammar) within Quasimodo would be enough to give
it a strong advantage over Csound. perhaps not. there are *many, many*
issues that i have already dealt with as i moved the opcodes into
running in a multithreaded, more formally defined environment. i can
guarantee that most will come up again in any attempt to do this.
michael - what specific aspects of quasimodo lead you to want to avoid
the path it tries to follow ? i can imagine some for myself, but i
would be interested in your feedback.
--p
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To: Csound List ,
Csound Linux/Unix List
Subject: Re: [Csnd] [CUD] RE: [Csnd] csound library was: line event problem
In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 06 Nov 1999 22:20:23 EST."
Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 23:25:51 -0500
From: Paul Barton-Davis
Sender: owner-csound-unix-dev@ilogic.com.au
Precedence: bulk
>2. When I downloaded it again, I still didn't seem to end up with the whole
>source code base. I did note that (a) it did not look like it would compile
>straight off on Windows, and (b) it looked like the opcode code had to be
>massaged to fit within the Quasimodo engine.
(a) and (b) are both correct. i have a small perl script that takes
care of (b), though clearly (a) is a major issue.
>Please understand, I'm not a full time music developer.
understood.
>Also understand, Windows (C++ or Java) is my platform. I'm not a Linux guy
>(yet, anyway). I don't see why this should make you bitter - it's just a
>fact about me
it doesn't! any residue of bitterness comes from having actually
implemented a system that goes considerably beyond what you describe,
yet having failed to do it in a way that makes it clearly the path to
follow, which in turn is a fact about me :)
>As I said, I'll make another stab at using Quasimodo. I'll let you know what
>I find. If it meets my needs, I'll use it in a flash, and I'll advise others
>to use it also - but one of those needs is that it be easy to use on
>Windows.
thats unlikely to happen for some time. i'm guessing that pthreads
exists for windows, but i have no idea where. without it, quasimodo is
dead as a dodo.
--p
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To: Csound List ,
Csound Linux/Unix List
In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 06 Nov 1999 22:20:23 EST."
Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 23:25:51 -0500
From: Paul Barton-Davis
Subject: Re: [Csnd] [CUD] RE: [Csnd] csound library was: line event problem
>2. When I downloaded it again, I still didn't seem to end up with the whole
>source code base. I did note that (a) it did not look like it would compile
>straight off on Windows, and (b) it looked like the opcode code had to be
>massaged to fit within the Quasimodo engine.
(a) and (b) are both correct. i have a small perl script that takes
care of (b), though clearly (a) is a major issue.
>Please understand, I'm not a full time music developer.
understood.
>Also understand, Windows (C++ or Java) is my platform. I'm not a Linux guy
>(yet, anyway). I don't see why this should make you bitter - it's just a
>fact about me
it doesn't! any residue of bitterness comes from having actually
implemented a system that goes considerably beyond what you describe,
yet having failed to do it in a way that makes it clearly the path to
follow, which in turn is a fact about me :)
>As I said, I'll make another stab at using Quasimodo. I'll let you know what
>I find. If it meets my needs, I'll use it in a flash, and I'll advise others
>to use it also - but one of those needs is that it be easy to use on
>Windows.
thats unlikely to happen for some time. i'm guessing that pthreads
exists for windows, but i have no idea where. without it, quasimodo is
dead as a dodo.
--p
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To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
Reply-To: illegalart@detritus.net
Subject: [Csnd] hey wassup CsounD ;)
here is the site you wanted... http://SEX.Interactwithme.com it's the one that gives you free membership access (all hacked) to abotu 300 membership based sex sites. k bye...
ps: why r u using noether.ex.ac.uk now? it doens't make sence, anyway *bye*...
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Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 00:52:57 -0500
From: Eloy Anzola
To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
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Subject: Re: [Csnd] hey wassup CsounD ;)
let's please fix this.
Eloy
------
leaddaet@earthlink.net
http://home.earthlink.net/~leaddaet
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Subject: [Csnd] [ot
>let's please fix this.
let you please fix this.
calling to arms entire communities = conducive to precisely
data you have called upon entire communities to fix for you.
= may wish to wake from the intellectual stupor
>Eloy
> ------
>leaddaet@earthlink.net
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Subject: Re: [Csnd] [ot
> wake from the intellectual stupor
k. tomorrow. 1st thing.
------
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Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 22:37:15 -0800 (PST)
From: "M. Nail"
To: csound mail list
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Subject: [Csnd] multichannel csound?
Hi, I just joined the list and am wondering if anyone has advice on using
Csound with nchnls >2? What formats can be output? How does one get
multiple audio signals out of a box? (Windows, or Linux) I assume multiple
soundcards would be impossible to sync. thanks for any advice.
-- mnail@u.washington.edu --- --
- visit the Casio SK-1 homepage http://weber.u.washington.edu/~mnail/sk.html
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To: csound@maths.ex.ac.uk
Cc: music-dsp@shoko.calarts.edu
Subject: [Csnd] [ot]
> FREE PAGER
>
> Get a top of the Line Brand New satellite pager for FREE!
= opn zorsz auss! non
>No long term contract
>No activation fee
>No big prepayment of airtime
big payment
>Put Free pagers on your kids
ou!. ou!. cezt magn!f!kue
>Give one to your wife
>Paging America is going to give you a top of the line full featured
>pager in your choice of color for FREE.
a. !ch l!ebe d!ch.
FREE = macht.ganz.gluckl!ch.
csound = FREE auss!
b!t perplecszd houevr. !t = onl! ar!vz
!n ultra !kk akadem!k mazkul!n 8 b!t koleurz
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> FREE PAGER
>
> Get a top of the Line Brand New satellite pager for FREE!
= opn zorsz auss! non
>No long term contract
>No activation fee
>No big prepayment of airtime
big payment
>Put Free pagers on your kids
ou!. ou!. cezt magn!f!kue
>Give one to your wife
>Paging America is going to give you a top of the line full featured
>pager in your choice of color for FREE.
a. !ch l!ebe d!ch.
FREE = macht.ganz.gluckl!ch.
csound = FREE auss!
b!t perplecszd houevr. !t = onl! ar!vz
!n ultra !kk akadem!k mazkul!n 8 b!t koleurz
dupswapdrop -- the music-dsp mailing list and website: subscription info,
FAQ, source code archive, list archive, book reviews, dsp links
http://shoko.calarts.edu/musicdsp/
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Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 11:20:22 +0000
From: Richard Dobson
Organization: Composers Desktop Project
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Subject: Re: [Csnd] multichannel csound?
Csound writes to standard MME WAVE drivers. If a soundcard 'device'
supports multiple channels (e.g Sonorus STUDI/O, Creamware Pulsar,
Frontier WaveCenter, etc), Csound can drive it. The code does not write
to multiple devices (they ~can~ be synced, but I don't think it should
be relied upon). A multi-channel driver is the way to go. At some point,
I (or someone) will add support for WAVE-EX to Csound for use under
Windows2000; this can downmix and dither (if necessary) a multi-channel
stream according to the capacity of the card. Anyone lucky enough to
have a multi-channel card under Linux (basically, just the Sonorus
STUDI/O at present, I think) can also output multi-channel audio.
Csound can write several file formats - AIFF, WAVE (32bit float and
16bit), and others. IIRC, data is just cast from floats to 16bit for
audio rendering. There is no difficulty in principle in writing 24bit
data to a card that can support it.
Richard Dobson
"M. Nail" wrote:
>
> Hi, I just joined the list and am wondering if anyone has advice on using
> Csound with nchnls >2? What formats can be output? How does one get
> multiple audio signals out of a box? (Windows, or Linux) I assume multiple
> soundcards would be impossible to sync. thanks for any advice.
>
> -- mnail@u.washington.edu --- --
> - visit the Casio SK-1 homepage http://weber.u.washington.edu/~mnail/sk.html
>
> --
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