Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?

I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
asking just to be sure.

Pete

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Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and what
version of csound was that?

On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and instantiate
> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful with your
> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time ago with
> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the issue then
> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of scenario!
>
> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess 
> wrote:
>>
>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?
>>
>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>> asking just to be sure.
>>
>> Pete
>>
>> Csound mailing list
>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>> Send bugs reports to
>>         https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>
>
> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
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> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
> be posted here

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I think there is an array used to lookup the instrument definition, but I don't know if it dynamically allocated. (Not on a computer to check the code at the moment.)

There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the highest 
instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments but 
9999997 empty slots
==John ff

On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:

> Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
> 12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and what
> version of csound was that?
>
> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and instantiate
>> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful with your
>> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time ago with
>> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the issue then
>> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of scenario!
>>
>> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
>>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
>>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?
>>>
>>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>>> asking just to be sure.
>>>
>>> Pete
>>>
>>> Csound mailing list
>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>         https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>
>>
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>
> Csound mailing list
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> Send bugs reports to
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> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>

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I think there is an array used to lookup the instrument definition, but I don't know if it dynamically allocated. (Not on a computer to check the code at the moment.)

On Wed, Jan 6, 2016, 10:20 AM Peter Burgess <pete.soundtechnician@gmail.com> wrote:

Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and what
version of csound was that?

On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh <rorywalsh@ear.ie> wrote:
> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and instantiate
> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful with your
> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time ago with
> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the issue then
> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of scenario!
>
> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess <pete.soundtechnician@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?
>>
>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>> asking just to be sure.
>>
>> Pete
>>
>> Csound mailing list
>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>> Send bugs reports to
>>         https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>
>
> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
> be posted here

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Ok, well based on that I've had a rethink, and I'm going to create my
long lists of instrs in c++, and send whatever instrs I'm using at the
time to csound as instr 1, instr 2, instr 3, etc. That should avoid
the costs, and probably makes more sense to my app in the long run :D

On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 3:39 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
> [edit] MIGHT be checking empty instrument slots, depending on how you number
> your instruments...
>
> On 6 January 2016 at 15:38, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>
>> Does this mean that when Csound is processing each instrument in turn, it
>> is continuously checking empty instruments slots in that vector you mention?
>> Can I ask why the vector isn't the same size as the number of instruments
>> defined? Probably some low level C answer to this one..
>>
>> On 6 January 2016 at 15:30, jpff  wrote:
>>>
>>> There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the highest
>>> instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments but
>>> 9999997 empty slots
>>> ==John ff
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:
>>>
>>>> Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
>>>> 12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and what
>>>> version of csound was that?
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and
>>>>> instantiate
>>>>> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful with
>>>>> your
>>>>> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time ago
>>>>> with
>>>>> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the issue
>>>>> then
>>>>> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of scenario!
>>>>>
>>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess
>>>>> 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>>>>>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
>>>>>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
>>>>>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>>>>>> asking just to be sure.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Pete
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>>>         https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>>>>> features can
>>>>> be posted here
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Csound mailing list
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>>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>
>>>
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>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>
>>
>
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> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
> be posted here

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Does this mean that when Csound is processing each instrument in turn, it is continuously checking empty instruments slots in that vector you mention? Can I ask why the vector isn't the same size as the number of instruments defined? Probably some low level C answer to this one.. 

On 6 January 2016 at 15:30, jpff <jpff@codemist.co.uk> wrote:

There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the highest instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments but 9999997 empty slots
==John ff

On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:

Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and what
version of csound was that?

On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh <rorywalsh@ear.ie> wrote:

If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and instantiate
two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful with your
instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time ago with
an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the issue then
however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of scenario!

On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess <pete.soundtechnician@gmail.com>
wrote:

Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?

I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
asking just to be sure.

Pete

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That makes sense. I better be careful or I'm eventually going to understand how Csound works! 

On 6 January 2016 at 15:50, Victor Lazzarini <Victor.Lazzarini@nuim.ie> wrote:

No, it goes from one instance to another. One thing is the instr list, the other the active instances.

Victor Lazzarini

Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy

Maynooth University

Ireland

On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:38, Rory Walsh <rorywalsh@EAR.IE> wrote:

Does this mean that when Csound is processing each instrument in turn, it is continuously checking empty instruments slots in that vector you mention? Can I ask why the vector isn't the same size as the number of instruments defined? Probably some low level C answer to this one.. 

On 6 January 2016 at 15:30, jpff <jpff@codemist.co.uk> wrote:

There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the highest instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments but 9999997 empty slots
==John ff

On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:

Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and what
version of csound was that?

On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh <rorywalsh@ear.ie> wrote:

If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and instantiate
two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful with your
instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time ago with
an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the issue then
however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of scenario!

On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess <pete.soundtechnician@gmail.com>
wrote:

Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?

I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
asking just to be sure.

Pete

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Ok, so what I'm gathering you're saying is that the performance cost
would only happen once at either the beginning of the performance or
during compilation, but it won't happen every time it plays an
instrument, is that right?

On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 4:03 PM, Victor Lazzarini
 wrote:
> Steven must still have some slides from his talk at Berklee. Don't go
> anywhere them.
>
> Victor Lazzarini
> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
> Maynooth University
> Ireland
>
> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:59, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>
> That makes sense. I better be careful or I'm eventually going to understand
> how Csound works!
>
> On 6 January 2016 at 15:50, Victor Lazzarini 
> wrote:
>>
>> No, it goes from one instance to another. One thing is the instr list, the
>> other the active instances.
>>
>> Victor Lazzarini
>> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>> Maynooth University
>> Ireland
>>
>> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:38, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>
>> Does this mean that when Csound is processing each instrument in turn, it
>> is continuously checking empty instruments slots in that vector you mention?
>> Can I ask why the vector isn't the same size as the number of instruments
>> defined? Probably some low level C answer to this one..
>>
>> On 6 January 2016 at 15:30, jpff  wrote:
>>>
>>> There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the highest
>>> instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments but
>>> 9999997 empty slots
>>> ==John ff
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:
>>>
>>>> Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
>>>> 12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and what
>>>> version of csound was that?
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and
>>>>> instantiate
>>>>> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful with
>>>>> your
>>>>> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time ago
>>>>> with
>>>>> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the issue
>>>>> then
>>>>> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of scenario!
>>>>>
>>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess
>>>>> 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>>>>>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
>>>>>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
>>>>>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>>>>>> asking just to be sure.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Pete
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>>>         https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>>>>> features can
>>>>> be posted here
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>
>>>
>>> Csound mailing list
>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>
>>
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>>
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>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>
>
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> be posted here
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I think the cost is mostly memory, rather than performance. 99799 x 8 bytes of extra memory use.

Victor Lazzarini
Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
Maynooth University
Ireland

> On 6 Jan 2016, at 17:00, Peter Burgess  wrote:
> 
> Ok, so what I'm gathering you're saying is that the performance cost
> would only happen once at either the beginning of the performance or
> during compilation, but it won't happen every time it plays an
> instrument, is that right?
> 
> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 4:03 PM, Victor Lazzarini
>  wrote:
>> Steven must still have some slides from his talk at Berklee. Don't go
>> anywhere them.
>> 
>> Victor Lazzarini
>> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>> Maynooth University
>> Ireland
>> 
>> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:59, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>> 
>> That makes sense. I better be careful or I'm eventually going to understand
>> how Csound works!
>> 
>> On 6 January 2016 at 15:50, Victor Lazzarini 
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> No, it goes from one instance to another. One thing is the instr list, the
>>> other the active instances.
>>> 
>>> Victor Lazzarini
>>> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>>> Maynooth University
>>> Ireland
>>> 
>>> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:38, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Does this mean that when Csound is processing each instrument in turn, it
>>> is continuously checking empty instruments slots in that vector you mention?
>>> Can I ask why the vector isn't the same size as the number of instruments
>>> defined? Probably some low level C answer to this one..
>>> 
>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 15:30, jpff  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the highest
>>>> instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments but
>>>> 9999997 empty slots
>>>> ==John ff
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
>>>>> 12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and what
>>>>> version of csound was that?
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and
>>>>>> instantiate
>>>>>> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful with
>>>>>> your
>>>>>> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time ago
>>>>>> with
>>>>>> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the issue
>>>>>> then
>>>>>> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of scenario!
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>>>>>>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
>>>>>>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
>>>>>>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>>>>>>> asking just to be sure.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Pete
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>>>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>>>>>> features can
>>>>>> be posted here
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>>       https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>> 
>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>       https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>>> be posted here
>>> 
>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>>> be posted here
>> 
>> 
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>> 
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
> 
> Csound mailing list
> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
> Send bugs reports to
>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

Csound mailing list
Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
Send bugs reports to
        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

That's not a whole lot, but more memory than came with the IBM PS/2 back in 1986? I guess Csounders only counted till 64 back then ;)

On 6 January 2016 at 17:18, Victor Lazzarini <Victor.Lazzarini@nuim.ie> wrote:

I think the cost is mostly memory, rather than performance. 99799 x 8 bytes of extra memory use.

Victor Lazzarini
Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
Maynooth University
Ireland

> On 6 Jan 2016, at 17:00, Peter Burgess <pete.soundtechnician@GMAIL.COM> wrote:
>
> Ok, so what I'm gathering you're saying is that the performance cost
> would only happen once at either the beginning of the performance or
> during compilation, but it won't happen every time it plays an
> instrument, is that right?
>
> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 4:03 PM, Victor Lazzarini
> <Victor.Lazzarini@nuim.ie> wrote:
>> Steven must still have some slides from his talk at Berklee. Don't go
>> anywhere them.
>>
>> Victor Lazzarini
>> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>> Maynooth University
>> Ireland
>>
>> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:59, Rory Walsh <rorywalsh@EAR.IE> wrote:
>>
>> That makes sense. I better be careful or I'm eventually going to understand
>> how Csound works!
>>
>> On 6 January 2016 at 15:50, Victor Lazzarini <Victor.Lazzarini@nuim.ie>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> No, it goes from one instance to another. One thing is the instr list, the
>>> other the active instances.
>>>
>>> Victor Lazzarini
>>> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>>> Maynooth University
>>> Ireland
>>>
>>> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:38, Rory Walsh <rorywalsh@EAR.IE> wrote:
>>>
>>> Does this mean that when Csound is processing each instrument in turn, it
>>> is continuously checking empty instruments slots in that vector you mention?
>>> Can I ask why the vector isn't the same size as the number of instruments
>>> defined? Probably some low level C answer to this one..
>>>
>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 15:30, jpff <jpff@codemist.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the highest
>>>> instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments but
>>>> 9999997 empty slots
>>>> ==John ff
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
>>>>> 12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and what
>>>>> version of csound was that?
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh <rorywalsh@ear.ie> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and
>>>>>> instantiate
>>>>>> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful with
>>>>>> your
>>>>>> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time ago
>>>>>> with
>>>>>> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the issue
>>>>>> then
>>>>>> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of scenario!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess
>>>>>> <pete.soundtechnician@gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>>>>>>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
>>>>>>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
>>>>>>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>>>>>>> asking just to be sure.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Pete
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>>>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>>>>>> features can
>>>>>> be posted here
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>>       https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>
>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>       https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>
>>>
>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>>> be posted here
>>>
>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>>> be posted here
>>
>>
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>>
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>
> Csound mailing list
> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
> Send bugs reports to
>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

Csound mailing list
Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
Send bugs reports to
        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

Ah, I was making the assumption that it was running on that machine. Wasn't it one of the more popular systems back then? Keep in mind I wasn't long out of nappies then, so what do I know?    

On 6 January 2016 at 17:40, Victor Lazzarini <Victor.Lazzarini@nuim.ie> wrote:

No Csound for DOS or OS/2 in 86, I am afraid.

Victor Lazzarini

Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy

Maynooth University

Ireland

On 6 Jan 2016, at 17:30, Rory Walsh <rorywalsh@EAR.IE> wrote:

That's not a whole lot, but more memory than came with the IBM PS/2 back in 1986? I guess Csounders only counted till 64 back then ;)

On 6 January 2016 at 17:18, Victor Lazzarini <Victor.Lazzarini@nuim.ie> wrote:

I think the cost is mostly memory, rather than performance. 99799 x 8 bytes of extra memory use.

Victor Lazzarini
Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
Maynooth University
Ireland

> On 6 Jan 2016, at 17:00, Peter Burgess <pete.soundtechnician@GMAIL.COM> wrote:
>
> Ok, so what I'm gathering you're saying is that the performance cost
> would only happen once at either the beginning of the performance or
> during compilation, but it won't happen every time it plays an
> instrument, is that right?
>
> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 4:03 PM, Victor Lazzarini
> <Victor.Lazzarini@nuim.ie> wrote:
>> Steven must still have some slides from his talk at Berklee. Don't go
>> anywhere them.
>>
>> Victor Lazzarini
>> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>> Maynooth University
>> Ireland
>>
>> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:59, Rory Walsh <rorywalsh@EAR.IE> wrote:
>>
>> That makes sense. I better be careful or I'm eventually going to understand
>> how Csound works!
>>
>> On 6 January 2016 at 15:50, Victor Lazzarini <Victor.Lazzarini@nuim.ie>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> No, it goes from one instance to another. One thing is the instr list, the
>>> other the active instances.
>>>
>>> Victor Lazzarini
>>> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>>> Maynooth University
>>> Ireland
>>>
>>> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:38, Rory Walsh <rorywalsh@EAR.IE> wrote:
>>>
>>> Does this mean that when Csound is processing each instrument in turn, it
>>> is continuously checking empty instruments slots in that vector you mention?
>>> Can I ask why the vector isn't the same size as the number of instruments
>>> defined? Probably some low level C answer to this one..
>>>
>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 15:30, jpff <jpff@codemist.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the highest
>>>> instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments but
>>>> 9999997 empty slots
>>>> ==John ff
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
>>>>> 12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and what
>>>>> version of csound was that?
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh <rorywalsh@ear.ie> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and
>>>>>> instantiate
>>>>>> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful with
>>>>>> your
>>>>>> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time ago
>>>>>> with
>>>>>> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the issue
>>>>>> then
>>>>>> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of scenario!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess
>>>>>> <pete.soundtechnician@gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>>>>>>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
>>>>>>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
>>>>>>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>>>>>>> asking just to be sure.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Pete
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>>>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>>>>>> features can
>>>>>> be posted here
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>>       https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>
>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>       https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>
>>>
>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>>> be posted here
>>>
>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>>> be posted here
>>
>>
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>>
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>
> Csound mailing list
> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
> Send bugs reports to
>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

Csound mailing list
Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
Send bugs reports to
        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

Lol. Well, I can live with the extra memory. My app still has a pretty
small memory footprint, far smaller than I guessed it would. Though I
reckon dynamic orchestra construction is probably a good bet anyway.

On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 5:59 PM, Victor Lazzarini
 wrote:
> It might have been, but Csound was strictly UNIX until someone on this list
> ported it to DOS on a rainy Saturday. It was also ported to the Mac at MIT
> in the early 90s.
>
> Victor Lazzarini
> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
> Maynooth University
> Ireland
>
> On 6 Jan 2016, at 17:51, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>
> Ah, I was making the assumption that it was running on that machine. Wasn't
> it one of the more popular systems back then? Keep in mind I wasn't long out
> of nappies then, so what do I know?
>
> On 6 January 2016 at 17:40, Victor Lazzarini 
> wrote:
>>
>> No Csound for DOS or OS/2 in 86, I am afraid.
>>
>> Victor Lazzarini
>> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>> Maynooth University
>> Ireland
>>
>> On 6 Jan 2016, at 17:30, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>
>> That's not a whole lot, but more memory than came with the IBM PS/2 back
>> in 1986? I guess Csounders only counted till 64 back then ;)
>>
>> On 6 January 2016 at 17:18, Victor Lazzarini 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I think the cost is mostly memory, rather than performance. 99799 x 8
>>> bytes of extra memory use.
>>>
>>> Victor Lazzarini
>>> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>>> Maynooth University
>>> Ireland
>>>
>>> > On 6 Jan 2016, at 17:00, Peter Burgess 
>>> > wrote:
>>> >
>>> > Ok, so what I'm gathering you're saying is that the performance cost
>>> > would only happen once at either the beginning of the performance or
>>> > during compilation, but it won't happen every time it plays an
>>> > instrument, is that right?
>>> >
>>> > On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 4:03 PM, Victor Lazzarini
>>> >  wrote:
>>> >> Steven must still have some slides from his talk at Berklee. Don't go
>>> >> anywhere them.
>>> >>
>>> >> Victor Lazzarini
>>> >> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>>> >> Maynooth University
>>> >> Ireland
>>> >>
>>> >> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:59, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> That makes sense. I better be careful or I'm eventually going to
>>> >> understand
>>> >> how Csound works!
>>> >>
>>> >> On 6 January 2016 at 15:50, Victor Lazzarini
>>> >> 
>>> >> wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> No, it goes from one instance to another. One thing is the instr
>>> >>> list, the
>>> >>> other the active instances.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Victor Lazzarini
>>> >>> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>>> >>> Maynooth University
>>> >>> Ireland
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:38, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Does this mean that when Csound is processing each instrument in
>>> >>> turn, it
>>> >>> is continuously checking empty instruments slots in that vector you
>>> >>> mention?
>>> >>> Can I ask why the vector isn't the same size as the number of
>>> >>> instruments
>>> >>> defined? Probably some low level C answer to this one..
>>> >>>
>>> >>>> On 6 January 2016 at 15:30, jpff  wrote:
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the
>>> >>>> highest
>>> >>>> instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments
>>> >>>> but
>>> >>>> 9999997 empty slots
>>> >>>> ==John ff
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>> On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
>>> >>>>> 12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and
>>> >>>>> what
>>> >>>>> version of csound was that?
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh 
>>> >>>>>> wrote:
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and
>>> >>>>>> instantiate
>>> >>>>>> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful
>>> >>>>>> with
>>> >>>>>> your
>>> >>>>>> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time
>>> >>>>>> ago
>>> >>>>>> with
>>> >>>>>> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the
>>> >>>>>> issue
>>> >>>>>> then
>>> >>>>>> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of
>>> >>>>>> scenario!
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess
>>> >>>>>> 
>>> >>>>>> wrote:
>>> >>>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>>> >>>>>>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only
>>> >>>>>>> two
>>> >>>>>>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999,
>>> >>>>>>> would it
>>> >>>>>>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999
>>> >>>>>>> instruments?
>>> >>>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>>> >>>>>>> asking just to be sure.
>>> >>>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>> Pete
>>> >>>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>> Csound mailing list
>>> >>>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> >>>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>> >>>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>> >>>>>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>> >>>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>>
>>> >>>>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> >>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports
>>> >>>>>> to
>>> >>>>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>>> >>>>>> features can
>>> >>>>>> be posted here
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Csound mailing list
>>> >>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> >>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>> >>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>> >>>>>       https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>> >>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Csound mailing list
>>> >>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> >>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>> >>>> Send bugs reports to
>>> >>>>       https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>> >>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> >>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>> >>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>>> >>> features can
>>> >>> be posted here
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> >>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>> >>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>>> >>> features can
>>> >>> be posted here
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> >> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>> >> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>>> >> features can
>>> >> be posted here
>>> >>
>>> >> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> >> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>> >> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>>> >> features can
>>> >> be posted here
>>> >
>>> > Csound mailing list
>>> > Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> > https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>> > Send bugs reports to
>>> >        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>> > Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>
>>> Csound mailing list
>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>         https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>
>>
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>>
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>
>
> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
> be posted here
>
> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
> be posted here

Csound mailing list
Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
Send bugs reports to
        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

The sentence is ambiguous: I want to believe it was meant to be "Don't
go anywhere without them" but I fear you meant "Don't go anywhere near
them". :P

The slides are available at:

http://www.kunstmusik.com/howCsoundWorksPresentation/index.html

To elaborate on Victor's and John's answers, the instrument
definitions are organized in two ways.  First is the array: each
instrument definition is stored by their instrument number as the
index into the array.  This makes lookup very fast when an i-event is
processed. (For named instruments, instrument names are mapped to an
instrument number, then the number used to index into the array.)

For performance, the instrument definitions (INSTRTXT) also have
pointers to the next instrument definition (i.e. they're singly-linked
lists).  This organization is used at perf-time to iterate through all
instrument definitions in a loop.  For each instrument definition, the
performance code checks and performs any active instance of the
instrument. So even if there's an instrument 999999, if there's only
three real instrument definitions, the perf-code will only loop
through three times to run instances of instruments.

So using large numbers for instrument definitions only affects that
array size for lookup, but has no performance cost for processing at
perf-time.  Performance then is only affected by actual number of
instrument definitions.  If you're concerned about performance, you
may need to watch how many instrument definitions you have (and that
includes UDOs, which are instrument definitions under the hood). I
would suspect that for most people though that any kind of performance
penalty is a non-issue.

On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 11:03 AM, Victor Lazzarini
 wrote:
> Steven must still have some slides from his talk at Berklee. Don't go
> anywhere them.
>
> Victor Lazzarini
> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
> Maynooth University
> Ireland
>
> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:59, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>
> That makes sense. I better be careful or I'm eventually going to understand
> how Csound works!
>
> On 6 January 2016 at 15:50, Victor Lazzarini 
> wrote:
>>
>> No, it goes from one instance to another. One thing is the instr list, the
>> other the active instances.
>>
>> Victor Lazzarini
>> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>> Maynooth University
>> Ireland
>>
>> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:38, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>
>> Does this mean that when Csound is processing each instrument in turn, it
>> is continuously checking empty instruments slots in that vector you mention?
>> Can I ask why the vector isn't the same size as the number of instruments
>> defined? Probably some low level C answer to this one..
>>
>> On 6 January 2016 at 15:30, jpff  wrote:
>>>
>>> There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the highest
>>> instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments but
>>> 9999997 empty slots
>>> ==John ff
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:
>>>
>>>> Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
>>>> 12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and what
>>>> version of csound was that?
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and
>>>>> instantiate
>>>>> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful with
>>>>> your
>>>>> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time ago
>>>>> with
>>>>> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the issue
>>>>> then
>>>>> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of scenario!
>>>>>
>>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess
>>>>> 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>>>>>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
>>>>>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would it
>>>>>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999 instruments?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>>>>>> asking just to be sure.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Pete
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>>>         https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>>>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>>>>> features can
>>>>> be posted here
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Csound mailing list
>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>
>>>
>>> Csound mailing list
>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>>> Send bugs reports to
>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>
>>
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>>
>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
>> be posted here
>
>
> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
> be posted here
>
> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
> be posted here

Csound mailing list
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Send bugs reports to
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Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

I haven't researched all the areas where the pointers are used, but
I'm not much in favor of dynamically changing instrument order myself.
If dynamic ordering is desired, I think the new processing graph
proposal (emailed to the list earlier) would be a better fit as it
works with instances of instruments rather than their definitions and
has a lot more flexibility.  Changing the ordering of instruments by
numbers in the "classic" processing (or lack of a better term) -- to
me -- invites confusion (i.e. what happens if instruments are
reordered and a new instrument definition is compiled? Where would it
get inserted?) I think the classic system may have some limitations,
but it's well-known and simple to reason about.

The new processing graph would give the user both the flexibility to
order instances of instruments as they wish as well as the
responsibility to manage it themselves. It's a well known model from
SuperCollider and I think would be very useful for realtime work as
well as assembling processing graphs for mixers/effects system. The
last I had a chance to think about this, the idea I had was to have
pre and post-processing graphs that were run before and after the
classic graph.  The idea is that:

- pre-graph - used to generate always-on control signals. For example,
oscillators used as LFO's that are read instrument wide (phase is
continuously updated then, similar to analog synths)
- classic graph - used as usual, but primarily for polyphonic
instantiation of instruments to act as source signals into a bus.
- post-graph - processes signals from the bus, to be used for
mixer/effects processing.  All dynamically re-patchable.

In the above, users can use just the graphs they'd like, or all three
of them.  They could use just the pre or post graph and none of the
others and essentially get the same processing possibilities as SC3.
Or they could use a mix to clarify what acts like synthesizers and
what acts like a mixer.

Anyways, it's all speculation. I'm very interested to start looking at
implementing and experimenting with the new graph to see what it feels
like to use and if it will indeed work out as imagined.  I was
planning to take a stab at it in a couple weeks once I'm finished with
some other work (unless someone else gets to it first :) ).



On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 11:03 PM, thorin kerr  wrote:
> Slightly straying from topic - sorry.
>
> Steven... when you say
>
> "The instrument definitions (INSTRTXT) also have pointers to the next
> instrument definition (i.e. they're singly-linked lists)"
>
> Does the iteration through the list lead to the situation where you need
> increasing numbered instruments to sequentially process audio stored in
> global variables?
>
> That was a long sentence. I'm referring to situations like the one referred
> to here:
> http://csound.1045644.n5.nabble.com/Order-of-triggering-instruments-td5719540.html
>
> If so, how hard would it be to change the pointers if you wanted to
> dynamically re-route audio?
>
> Thorin
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 7, 2016 at 12:32 PM, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>
>> The sentence is ambiguous: I want to believe it was meant to be "Don't
>> go anywhere without them" but I fear you meant "Don't go anywhere near
>> them". :P
>>
>> The slides are available at:
>>
>> http://www.kunstmusik.com/howCsoundWorksPresentation/index.html
>>
>> To elaborate on Victor's and John's answers, the instrument
>> definitions are organized in two ways.  First is the array: each
>> instrument definition is stored by their instrument number as the
>> index into the array.  This makes lookup very fast when an i-event is
>> processed. (For named instruments, instrument names are mapped to an
>> instrument number, then the number used to index into the array.)
>>
>> For performance, the instrument definitions (INSTRTXT) also have
>> pointers to the next instrument definition (i.e. they're singly-linked
>> lists).  This organization is used at perf-time to iterate through all
>> instrument definitions in a loop.  For each instrument definition, the
>> performance code checks and performs any active instance of the
>> instrument. So even if there's an instrument 999999, if there's only
>> three real instrument definitions, the perf-code will only loop
>> through three times to run instances of instruments.
>>
>> So using large numbers for instrument definitions only affects that
>> array size for lookup, but has no performance cost for processing at
>> perf-time.  Performance then is only affected by actual number of
>> instrument definitions.  If you're concerned about performance, you
>> may need to watch how many instrument definitions you have (and that
>> includes UDOs, which are instrument definitions under the hood). I
>> would suspect that for most people though that any kind of performance
>> penalty is a non-issue.
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 11:03 AM, Victor Lazzarini
>>  wrote:
>> > Steven must still have some slides from his talk at Berklee. Don't go
>> > anywhere them.
>> >
>> > Victor Lazzarini
>> > Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>> > Maynooth University
>> > Ireland
>> >
>> > On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:59, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>> >
>> > That makes sense. I better be careful or I'm eventually going to
>> > understand
>> > how Csound works!
>> >
>> > On 6 January 2016 at 15:50, Victor Lazzarini 
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> No, it goes from one instance to another. One thing is the instr list,
>> >> the
>> >> other the active instances.
>> >>
>> >> Victor Lazzarini
>> >> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>> >> Maynooth University
>> >> Ireland
>> >>
>> >> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:38, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Does this mean that when Csound is processing each instrument in turn,
>> >> it
>> >> is continuously checking empty instruments slots in that vector you
>> >> mention?
>> >> Can I ask why the vector isn't the same size as the number of
>> >> instruments
>> >> defined? Probably some low level C answer to this one..
>> >>
>> >> On 6 January 2016 at 15:30, jpff  wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the
>> >>> highest
>> >>> instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments
>> >>> but
>> >>> 9999997 empty slots
>> >>> ==John ff
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
>> >>>> 12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and
>> >>>> what
>> >>>> version of csound was that?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and
>> >>>>> instantiate
>> >>>>> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful
>> >>>>> with
>> >>>>> your
>> >>>>> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time
>> >>>>> ago
>> >>>>> with
>> >>>>> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the
>> >>>>> issue
>> >>>>> then
>> >>>>> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of
>> >>>>> scenario!
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess
>> >>>>> 
>> >>>>> wrote:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>> >>>>>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
>> >>>>>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would
>> >>>>>> it
>> >>>>>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999
>> >>>>>> instruments?
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>> >>>>>> asking just to be sure.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Pete
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Csound mailing list
>> >>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>> >>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>> >>>>>>         https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>> >>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> >>>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>> >>>>> features can
>> >>>>> be posted here
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Csound mailing list
>> >>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>> >>>> Send bugs reports to
>> >>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>> >>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Csound mailing list
>> >>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>> >>> Send bugs reports to
>> >>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>> >>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> >> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>> >> features can
>> >> be posted here
>> >>
>> >> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> >> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>> >> features can
>> >> be posted here
>> >
>> >
>> > Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> > https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> > https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features
>> > can
>> > be posted here
>> >
>> > Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> > https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> > https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features
>> > can
>> > be posted here
>>
>> Csound mailing list
>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>> Send bugs reports to
>>         https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>
>
> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
> be posted here

Csound mailing list
Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
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Send bugs reports to
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Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here

Cheers for all the info! That has helped immensely.

"If you're concerned about performance, you
may need to watch how many instrument definitions you have (and that
includes UDOs, which are instrument definitions under the hood). I
would suspect that for most people though that any kind of performance
penalty is a non-issue."

I would think then that dynamically sending instruments if they're
needed for the performance in question is the right way to go. I need
to squeeze every ounce of performance out of csound for my purposes,
so this is definately an area I need to address.

Thank you all for your help!

On Thu, Jan 7, 2016 at 8:11 AM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
> Thanks for posting these. I think before I figure out how Csound works, I'll
> have to figure the magic order to the slides in your presentation! Up, Left,
> Left, Down, Right.... I know sooner or later I'll unlock the next level!
>
> On 7 January 2016 at 02:32, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>
>> The sentence is ambiguous: I want to believe it was meant to be "Don't
>> go anywhere without them" but I fear you meant "Don't go anywhere near
>> them". :P
>>
>> The slides are available at:
>>
>> http://www.kunstmusik.com/howCsoundWorksPresentation/index.html
>>
>> To elaborate on Victor's and John's answers, the instrument
>> definitions are organized in two ways.  First is the array: each
>> instrument definition is stored by their instrument number as the
>> index into the array.  This makes lookup very fast when an i-event is
>> processed. (For named instruments, instrument names are mapped to an
>> instrument number, then the number used to index into the array.)
>>
>> For performance, the instrument definitions (INSTRTXT) also have
>> pointers to the next instrument definition (i.e. they're singly-linked
>> lists).  This organization is used at perf-time to iterate through all
>> instrument definitions in a loop.  For each instrument definition, the
>> performance code checks and performs any active instance of the
>> instrument. So even if there's an instrument 999999, if there's only
>> three real instrument definitions, the perf-code will only loop
>> through three times to run instances of instruments.
>>
>> So using large numbers for instrument definitions only affects that
>> array size for lookup, but has no performance cost for processing at
>> perf-time.  Performance then is only affected by actual number of
>> instrument definitions.  If you're concerned about performance, you
>> may need to watch how many instrument definitions you have (and that
>> includes UDOs, which are instrument definitions under the hood). I
>> would suspect that for most people though that any kind of performance
>> penalty is a non-issue.
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 11:03 AM, Victor Lazzarini
>>  wrote:
>> > Steven must still have some slides from his talk at Berklee. Don't go
>> > anywhere them.
>> >
>> > Victor Lazzarini
>> > Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>> > Maynooth University
>> > Ireland
>> >
>> > On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:59, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>> >
>> > That makes sense. I better be careful or I'm eventually going to
>> > understand
>> > how Csound works!
>> >
>> > On 6 January 2016 at 15:50, Victor Lazzarini 
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> No, it goes from one instance to another. One thing is the instr list,
>> >> the
>> >> other the active instances.
>> >>
>> >> Victor Lazzarini
>> >> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies, and Philosophy
>> >> Maynooth University
>> >> Ireland
>> >>
>> >> On 6 Jan 2016, at 15:38, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Does this mean that when Csound is processing each instrument in turn,
>> >> it
>> >> is continuously checking empty instruments slots in that vector you
>> >> mention?
>> >> Can I ask why the vector isn't the same size as the number of
>> >> instruments
>> >> defined? Probably some low level C answer to this one..
>> >>
>> >> On 6 January 2016 at 15:30, jpff  wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> There is a cost.  A vector of pointers is alloated as long as the
>> >>> highest
>> >>> instr number used, and it is expandable.  So yes onlyto instruments
>> >>> but
>> >>> 9999997 empty slots
>> >>> ==John ff
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Wed, 6 Jan 2016, Peter Burgess wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Lol, yeah, that was an exagoration. It's either going to be up to
>> >>>> 12,000 or 120,000. What was the number that caused the issue, and
>> >>>> what
>> >>>> version of csound was that?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> If you only have two instruments Csound will only allocate and
>> >>>>> instantiate
>> >>>>> two instruments. It can't instantiate what isn't defined. Careful
>> >>>>> with
>> >>>>> your
>> >>>>> instrument numbers however. I think I ran into a problem some time
>> >>>>> ago
>> >>>>> with
>> >>>>> an instrument number that was too large. I think John fixes the
>> >>>>> issue
>> >>>>> then
>> >>>>> however. But instr 9 million seems like an ambitious kind of
>> >>>>> scenario!
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> On 6 January 2016 at 14:22, Peter Burgess
>> >>>>> 
>> >>>>> wrote:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Hi there, as I understand it, csound allocates resources for each
>> >>>>>> instrument when it compiles an orchestra. if I were to use only two
>> >>>>>> instruments, but they were called instr 1 and instr 9999999, would
>> >>>>>> it
>> >>>>>> allocate enough resources for 2 instruments, or 9999999
>> >>>>>> instruments?
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> I'm sure it probably only allocates for 2, but I thought it worth
>> >>>>>> asking just to be sure.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Pete
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Csound mailing list
>> >>>>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >>>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>> >>>>>> Send bugs reports to
>> >>>>>>         https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>> >>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >>>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> >>>>> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>> >>>>> features can
>> >>>>> be posted here
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Csound mailing list
>> >>>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >>>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>> >>>> Send bugs reports to
>> >>>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>> >>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Csound mailing list
>> >>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>> >>> Send bugs reports to
>> >>>        https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>> >>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> >> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>> >> features can
>> >> be posted here
>> >>
>> >> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> >> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> >> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and
>> >> features can
>> >> be posted here
>> >
>> >
>> > Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> > https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> > https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features
>> > can
>> > be posted here
>> >
>> > Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> > https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
>> > https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features
>> > can
>> > be posted here
>>
>> Csound mailing list
>> Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
>> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND
>> Send bugs reports to
>>         https://github.com/csound/csound/issues
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>
>
> Csound mailing list Csound@listserv.heanet.ie
> https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A0=CSOUND Send bugs reports to
> https://github.com/csound/csound/issues Discussions of bugs and features can
> be posted here

Csound mailing list
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Send bugs reports to
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