On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 10:21 AM, Prent Rodgers
 wrote:
> Could anyone do this in Csound? http://supercollider.sourceforge.net/sc140/
> My scores tend towards a megabyte or more. Anyone want to try a contest to
> take on the Colliders?
>
> Prent Rodgers

I'd love to try, thought I doubt it could be done as elegantly as with
Supercollider. The smallest a working CSD is roughly 109 characters
long. This is what I consider the smallest possible CSD.



instr 1
endin





There are of course other ways of attacking the problem, but nothing
that would be program complete like the supercollider pieces.

Best,
Jake

Well, you can use ORC/SCO files to get around the CSD's extra tags.

On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 1:38 PM, Jacob Joaquin  wrote:
> On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 10:21 AM, Prent Rodgers
>  wrote:
>> Could anyone do this in Csound? http://supercollider.sourceforge.net/sc140/
>> My scores tend towards a megabyte or more. Anyone want to try a contest to
>> take on the Colliders?
>>
>> Prent Rodgers
>
> I'd love to try, thought I doubt it could be done as elegantly as with
> Supercollider. The smallest a working CSD is roughly 109 characters
> long. This is what I consider the smallest possible CSD.
>
> 
> 
> instr 1
> endin
> 
> 
> 
> 
>
> There are of course other ways of attacking the problem, but nothing
> that would be program complete like the supercollider pieces.
>
> Best,
> Jake
> --
> The Csound Blog - http://csound.noisepages.com/
>
>
> Send bugs reports to this list.
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>


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This sounds like a challenge?

2009/12/10 Steven Yi :
> Well, you can use ORC/SCO files to get around the CSD's extra tags.
>
> On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 1:38 PM, Jacob Joaquin  wrote:
>> On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 10:21 AM, Prent Rodgers
>>  wrote:
>>> Could anyone do this in Csound? http://supercollider.sourceforge.net/sc140/
>>> My scores tend towards a megabyte or more. Anyone want to try a contest to
>>> take on the Colliders?
>>>
>>> Prent Rodgers
>>
>> I'd love to try, thought I doubt it could be done as elegantly as with
>> Supercollider. The smallest a working CSD is roughly 109 characters
>> long. This is what I consider the smallest possible CSD.
>>
>> 
>> 
>> instr 1
>> endin
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>
>> There are of course other ways of attacking the problem, but nothing
>> that would be program complete like the supercollider pieces.
>>
>> Best,
>> Jake
>> --
>> The Csound Blog - http://csound.noisepages.com/
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to this list.
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>


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Attempt # 1

instr 1
a2 line 1,p3,0
a1 oscils 8000,440*(2^(rnd(24)/12)),1
out a1*a2
if p2<60 then
event_i "i",1,rnd(1),1
endif
endin

i 1 0 1
e 60

Best,
Jake
-- 
The Csound Blog - http://csound.noisepages.com/


On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 10:52 AM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
> This sounds like a challenge?
>
> 2009/12/10 Steven Yi :
>> Well, you can use ORC/SCO files to get around the CSD's extra tags.
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 1:38 PM, Jacob Joaquin  wrote:
>>> On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 10:21 AM, Prent Rodgers
>>>  wrote:
>>>> Could anyone do this in Csound? http://supercollider.sourceforge.net/sc140/
>>>> My scores tend towards a megabyte or more. Anyone want to try a contest to
>>>> take on the Colliders?
>>>>
>>>> Prent Rodgers
>>>
>>> I'd love to try, thought I doubt it could be done as elegantly as with
>>> Supercollider. The smallest a working CSD is roughly 109 characters
>>> long. This is what I consider the smallest possible CSD.
>>>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> instr 1
>>> endin
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>
>>> There are of course other ways of attacking the problem, but nothing
>>> that would be program complete like the supercollider pieces.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Jake
>>> --
>>> The Csound Blog - http://csound.noisepages.com/
>>>
>>>
>>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>>>
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to this list.
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>


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Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't some of the SC lines also load in samples
on their side of the creating something interesting with 140 characters
concept?

Interesting recursive instrument. What about changing the envelope
to
a2 expon 1,p3, 0.001
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jacob Joaquin" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, December 10, 2009 7:06 PM
Subject: [Csnd] Re: Re: Re: Re: SuperCollider in 140 characters or less


> Attempt # 1
>
> instr 1
> a2 line 1,p3,0
> a1 oscils 8000,440*(2^(rnd(24)/12)),1
> out a1*a2
> if p2<60 then
> event_i "i",1,rnd(1),1
> endif
> endin
>
> i 1 0 1
> e 60
>
> Best,
> Jake
> -- 
> The Csound Blog - http://csound.noisepages.com/
>
>
> On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 10:52 AM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>> This sounds like a challenge?
>>
>> 2009/12/10 Steven Yi :
>>> Well, you can use ORC/SCO files to get around the CSD's extra tags.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 1:38 PM, Jacob Joaquin  
>>> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 10:21 AM, Prent Rodgers
>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> Could anyone do this in Csound? 
>>>>> http://supercollider.sourceforge.net/sc140/
>>>>> My scores tend towards a megabyte or more. Anyone want to try a 
>>>>> contest to
>>>>> take on the Colliders?
>>>>>
>>>>> Prent Rodgers
>>>>
>>>> I'd love to try, thought I doubt it could be done as elegantly as with
>>>> Supercollider. The smallest a working CSD is roughly 109 characters
>>>> long. This is what I consider the smallest possible CSD.
>>>>
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> instr 1
>>>> endin
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>
>>>> There are of course other ways of attacking the problem, but nothing
>>>> that would be program complete like the supercollider pieces.
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>> Jake
>>>> --
>>>> The Csound Blog - http://csound.noisepages.com/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body 
>>>> "unsubscribe csound"
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe 
>>> csound"
>>>
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to this list.
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>> csound"
>>
>
>
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> csound" 



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On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 11:52 AM, victor  wrote:
> Interesting recursive instrument. What about changing the envelope
> to
> a2 expon 1,p3, 0.001

I went ahead and made this change and a few others.

instr 1
a2 expon 1,p3,.0001
a1 oscils 8000,88*(p4%9+5),1
out a1*a2
if p2<60 then
event_i "i",1,rnd(.6)+.1,4,p4+rnd(2)
endif
endin

i 1 0 1 8


That is my final version. I've made available a csd and mp3 here:
http://csound.noisepages.com/2009/12/140-characters/

Best,
Jake

The only way to make this fair would be not to count any of the bookkeeping
in csound that is otherwise set in the application environment in SC3 --
this would exclude the csd tags as well as the orchestra header, and
anything fed to csound from the command line from the 140 characters. 
"instr1" and "endin" count, though, I think, as much as "Synthdef" would --
although they have the .play convenience.

Meanwhile, since they're using sound stored in buffers (this is cheating,
obviously, since you can pre-synthesize everything and just read the file in
the entry), and since their constraints on the final product could rely a
great deal on classes and methods that are defined within the SC language
(as opposed to the c/++ code), I wonder if user-defined classes are on the
table -- this would make things more efficient in either language, as you
could define opcodes/classes with one or two character names for use in the
final entry.  Personally, I would care less about the rather silly 140
character constraint (which really has little to do with language
"efficiency") than I would the code elegance and expressive power.


Maybe it's time to hold an "obfuscated csound / SC code contest" in the
manner of:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Obfuscated_C_Code_Contest

For csound there should be a prize for best abuse of zak, and for
supercollider, best abuse of nested ugen arguments.

MB


Jacob Joaquin wrote:
> 
> On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 10:21 AM, Prent Rodgers
>  wrote:
>> Could anyone do this in Csound?
>> http://supercollider.sourceforge.net/sc140/
>> My scores tend towards a megabyte or more. Anyone want to try a contest
>> to
>> take on the Colliders?
>>
>> Prent Rodgers
> 
> I'd love to try, thought I doubt it could be done as elegantly as with
> Supercollider. The smallest a working CSD is roughly 109 characters
> long. This is what I consider the smallest possible CSD.
> 
> 
> 
> instr 1
> endin
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There are of course other ways of attacking the problem, but nothing
> that would be program complete like the supercollider pieces.
> 
> Best,
> Jake
> -- 
> The Csound Blog - http://csound.noisepages.com/
> 
> 
> Send bugs reports to this list.
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
> csound"
> 
> 

A fairer challenge was perhaps the one set up here a few months ago  
using a minimal Csound orchestra
and any score, generated with whatever means.

Having a fixed-pfield score has been criticised elsewhere as too  
limiting and backwards, but this simplicity might actually be an  
advantage, as Steven Yi has pointed out. Since the format is simple  
and well-defined, events can be created very easily.

Victor
On 11 Dec 2009, at 18:07, brbrofsvl wrote:

>
> The only way to make this fair would be not to count any of the  
> bookkeeping
> in csound that is otherwise set in the application environment in  
> SC3 --
> this would exclude the csd tags as well as the orchestra header, and
> anything fed to csound from the command line from the 140 characters.
> "instr1" and "endin" count, though, I think, as much as "Synthdef"  
> would --
> although they have the .play convenience.
>
> Meanwhile, since they're using sound stored in buffers (this is  
> cheating,
> obviously, since you can pre-synthesize everything and just read the  
> file in
> the entry), and since their constraints on the final product could  
> rely a
> great deal on classes and methods that are defined within the SC  
> language
> (as opposed to the c/++ code), I wonder if user-defined classes are  
> on the
> table -- this would make things more efficient in either language,  
> as you
> could define opcodes/classes with one or two character names for use  
> in the
> final entry.  Personally, I would care less about the rather silly 140
> character constraint (which really has little to do with language
> "efficiency") than I would the code elegance and expressive power.
>
>
> Maybe it's time to hold an "obfuscated csound / SC code contest" in  
> the
> manner of:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Obfuscated_C_Code_Contest
>
> For csound there should be a prize for best abuse of zak, and for
> supercollider, best abuse of nested ugen arguments.
>
> MB
>
>
> Jacob Joaquin wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 10, 2009 at 10:21 AM, Prent Rodgers
>>  wrote:
>>> Could anyone do this in Csound?
>>> http://supercollider.sourceforge.net/sc140/
>>> My scores tend towards a megabyte or more. Anyone want to try a  
>>> contest
>>> to
>>> take on the Colliders?
>>>
>>> Prent Rodgers
>>
>> I'd love to try, thought I doubt it could be done as elegantly as  
>> with
>> Supercollider. The smallest a working CSD is roughly 109 characters
>> long. This is what I consider the smallest possible CSD.
>>
>> 
>> 
>> instr 1
>> endin
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>
>> There are of course other ways of attacking the problem, but nothing
>> that would be program complete like the supercollider pieces.
>>
>> Best,
>> Jake
>> -- 
>> The Csound Blog - http://csound.noisepages.com/
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to this list.
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body  
>> "unsubscribe
>> csound"
>>
>>
>
> -- 
> View this message in context: http://old.nabble.com/SuperCollider-in-140-characters-or-less-tp26732163p26748899.html
> Sent from the Csound - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to this list.
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body  
> "unsubscribe csound"



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