mmm, I'm not so sure if it really means sound can have particle-like behaviour.
IIR, The term phonon was coined by Einstein and relates to vibrations
in certain crystal atoms, considered the smallest quanta of sound.
This was mentioned in Road's "Microsound". I don't have the book with
me so can't check the precise words used. Still, as far as I
understand, it behaves as waves.
best
Oeyvind

2013/10/19 peiman khosravi :
> yes that's it. I can't understand it!
>
>
>
>
> www.peimankhosravi.co.uk || RSS Feed || Concert News
>
>
> On 18 October 2013 16:50, Partev Barr Sarkissian 
> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I think it's called a "phonon".
>>
>> -partev
>>
>> ========================================
>>
>> --- peimankhosravi@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> From: peiman khosravi 
>> To: "csound@lists.bath.ac.uk" 
>> Subject: Re: [Csnd] RE: pitch and speed
>> Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2013 00:40:32 +0100
>>
>>
>> A complete diversion, but one that might aid the building of a time
>> machine.
>>
>> Recently I was chatting to a physicist and he told me that even sound,
>> beyond a certain frequency (I think it was frequency) exhibits particle
>> behaviour, like light. The particle even has a name I think. True?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> www.peimankhosravi.co.uk || RSS Feed || Concert News
>>
>>
>> On 18 October 2013 00:35, Andres Cabrera  wrote:
>>
>> Yes, you have to get these plugin opcodes using csound6 itself:
>>
>> idays = 15
>> systemruninfuture "wget
>> https://www.csounds.com/conference/timemachine.so", idays*24*60
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Andrés
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>
>> Didn't Joachim write a UDO for this in two weeks time already?
>>
>> On 17 October 2013 22:38, Andres Cabrera  wrote:
>> > That's a clever idea, hadn't thought of that!
>> >
>> > It would look:
>> >
>> > ktime line -10, p3, 0
>> > aphasor phasor 10
>> >
>> > backintime itime
>> > ain soundin Sfile, itime + aphasor
>> > ain audiotopresent
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> > Andrés
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Wed, Oct 16, 2013 at 3:10 PM, peiman khosravi
>> > 
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Alternatively find yourself a time machine and modulate its output with
>> >> phasor, as you slow the tape machine down.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> www.peimankhosravi.co.uk || RSS Feed || Concert News
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On 16 October 2013 21:05, Enrico Francioni 
>> >> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Thanks Iain,
>> >>>
>> >>> e
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> View this message in context:
>> >>>
>> >>> http://csound.1045644.n5.nabble.com/pitch-and-speed-tp5728418p5728421.html
>> >>> Sent from the Csound - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug trackers
>> >>> csound6:
>> >>>             https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/tickets/
>> >>> csound5:
>> >>>             https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/bugs/
>> >>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> >>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>> >>> "unsubscribe
>> >>> csound"
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug trackers
>> csound6:
>>             https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/tickets/
>> csound5:
>>             https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/bugs/
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>> csound"
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>> Netscape.  Just the Net You Need.
>
>



-- 

Oeyvind Brandtsegg
Professor of Music Technology
NTNU
7491 Trondheim
Norway
Cell: +47 92 203 205

http://flyndresang.no/
http://www.partikkelaudio.com/
http://soundcloud.com/brandtsegg
http://soundcloud.com/t-emp

Interesting... Light is described both as waves and as particles... I 
suspect that sound acts as a wave when there is a lot of it present and 
yet in smaller numbers it is perceptible as particles...

granular synthesis...


On 10/19/13 7:05 PM, Oeyvind Brandtsegg wrote:
> mmm, I'm not so sure if it really means sound can have particle-like behaviour.
> IIR, The term phonon was coined by Einstein and relates to vibrations
> in certain crystal atoms, considered the smallest quanta of sound.
> This was mentioned in Road's "Microsound". I don't have the book with
> me so can't check the precise words used. Still, as far as I
> understand, it behaves as waves.
> best
> Oeyvind
>
> 2013/10/19 peiman khosravi :
>> yes that's it. I can't understand it!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> www.peimankhosravi.co.uk || RSS Feed || Concert News
>>
>>
>> On 18 October 2013 16:50, Partev Barr Sarkissian 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I think it's called a "phonon".
>>>
>>> -partev
>>>
>>> ========================================
>>>
>>> --- peimankhosravi@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>> From: peiman khosravi 
>>> To: "csound@lists.bath.ac.uk" 
>>> Subject: Re: [Csnd] RE: pitch and speed
>>> Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2013 00:40:32 +0100
>>>
>>>
>>> A complete diversion, but one that might aid the building of a time
>>> machine.
>>>
>>> Recently I was chatting to a physicist and he told me that even sound,
>>> beyond a certain frequency (I think it was frequency) exhibits particle
>>> behaviour, like light. The particle even has a name I think. True?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> www.peimankhosravi.co.uk || RSS Feed || Concert News
>>>
>>>
>>> On 18 October 2013 00:35, Andres Cabrera  wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, you have to get these plugin opcodes using csound6 itself:
>>>
>>> idays = 15
>>> systemruninfuture "wget
>>> https://www.csounds.com/conference/timemachine.so", idays*24*60
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Andrés
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 2:56 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>>>
>>> Didn't Joachim write a UDO for this in two weeks time already?
>>>
>>> On 17 October 2013 22:38, Andres Cabrera  wrote:
>>>> That's a clever idea, hadn't thought of that!
>>>>
>>>> It would look:
>>>>
>>>> ktime line -10, p3, 0
>>>> aphasor phasor 10
>>>>
>>>> backintime itime
>>>> ain soundin Sfile, itime + aphasor
>>>> ain audiotopresent
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Andrés
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Oct 16, 2013 at 3:10 PM, peiman khosravi
>>>> 
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Alternatively find yourself a time machine and modulate its output with
>>>>> phasor, as you slow the tape machine down.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> www.peimankhosravi.co.uk || RSS Feed || Concert News
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 16 October 2013 21:05, Enrico Francioni 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> Thanks Iain,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> e
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> View this message in context:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://csound.1045644.n5.nabble.com/pitch-and-speed-tp5728418p5728421.html
>>>>>> Sent from the Csound - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug trackers
>>>>>> csound6:
>>>>>>              https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/tickets/
>>>>>> csound5:
>>>>>>              https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/bugs/
>>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>>>>>> "unsubscribe
>>>>>> csound"
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>
>>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug trackers
>>> csound6:
>>>              https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/tickets/
>>> csound5:
>>>              https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/bugs/
>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>>> csound"
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>> Netscape.  Just the Net You Need.
>>
>
>

Very interesting. I have never heard the uncertainty principle applied 
to sound. It is logical.

On 10/19/13 8:23 PM, Michael Gogins wrote:
> Sound waves are back and forth motions of air molecules. The molecules 
> rush together and get dense, that is the peak of the wave. The 
> molecules rush apart and get thin, that is the trough of the wave.
>
> A "phonon" is a virtual particle that is composed of sound waves. If 
> you have ever seen a Chladni plate, then you have seen the piles of 
> sand that form where there are stationary troughs in the standing 
> waves. These are similar to phonons. They are "quasi-particles."
>
> There is no wave/particle duality in acoustics as there is quantum 
> mechanics. Sound waves are not dual to air molecules.
>
> There is an uncertainty relation in acoustics as there is in quantum 
> mechanics, however. Just as Heisenberg stated the uncertainty 
> principle whereby more information about momentum means less 
> information about position, and vice versa, with a minimum "area" of 
> information that is Planck's constant, so there is Gabor's uncertainty 
> relation in sound whereby the more precisely you know frequency, the 
> less precisely you know time, with a minimum "area" of information 
> that is the Gabor logon.
>
> Regards,
> Mike

The uncertainty principle comes from the Fourier Transform which is a 
maths tool used in quantum mechanics and in acoustics as well. If you 
dislike maths, you can consider this heuristic view: if a phenomenon 
repeats in time (frequency), you will need a minimum duration of measure 
to count some periods of the signal so that you can determine its 
frequency. The shorter is the duration of the measure (time becomes more 
precise) the lesser is the precision of the frequency measure.


Le 20/10/2013 03:49, Michael Rhoades a écrit :
> Very interesting. I have never heard the uncertainty principle applied 
> to sound. It is logical.
>
> On 10/19/13 8:23 PM, Michael Gogins wrote:
>> Sound waves are back and forth motions of air molecules. The 
>> molecules rush together and get dense, that is the peak of the wave. 
>> The molecules rush apart and get thin, that is the trough of the wave.
>>
>> A "phonon" is a virtual particle that is composed of sound waves. If 
>> you have ever seen a Chladni plate, then you have seen the piles of 
>> sand that form where there are stationary troughs in the standing 
>> waves. These are similar to phonons. They are "quasi-particles."
>>
>> There is no wave/particle duality in acoustics as there is quantum 
>> mechanics. Sound waves are not dual to air molecules.
>>
>> There is an uncertainty relation in acoustics as there is in quantum 
>> mechanics, however. Just as Heisenberg stated the uncertainty 
>> principle whereby more information about momentum means less 
>> information about position, and vice versa, with a minimum "area" of 
>> information that is Planck's constant, so there is Gabor's 
>> uncertainty relation in sound whereby the more precisely you know 
>> frequency, the less precisely you know time, with a minimum "area" of 
>> information that is the Gabor logon.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Mike
>
>
> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug trackers
> csound6:
>            https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/tickets/
> csound5:
>            https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/bugs/
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body 
> "unsubscribe csound"
>
>

What a fascinating conversation! These things always were of huge interest to
me.



--
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