[Csnd] Lua opcodes on OSX?

[Csnd] Lua opcodes on OSX?

Date	2013-11-07 16:00
From	Michael Gogins
Subject	[Csnd] Lua opcodes on OSX?
Attachments	None None
	Can somebody please tell me: (1) If the Lua opcodes (which require LuaJIT) run on OS X. (2) If those Lua opcodes are part of the packages distributed on SourceForge for OS X. Thanks, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions

Date	2013-11-07 16:11
From	Steven Yi
Subject	Re: [Csnd] Lua opcodes on OSX?
Attachments	None None
	Hi Michael, We've gone over this a few times. The lua opcodes are not distributed with osx. They will crash any app that tries to load them if they are x86_64 unless the app is compiled with special settings. We can't control things like that in a large number of cases, I. E. If it is a Java app, python app, etc. As then Java and python would need to be compiled with that setting. This limitation of luajit is known and listed on their site (on my phone at the moment so it's a little difficult to look up). I spent a fair amount of time trying to find a work around but came to the conclusion that unless luajit changes, we should not distribute the opcodes as too many programs will crash. Steven On Nov 7, 2013 11:01 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: Can somebody please tell me: (1) If the Lua opcodes (which require LuaJIT) run on OS X. (2) If those Lua opcodes are part of the packages distributed on SourceForge for OS X. Thanks, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions

Date	2013-11-07 16:12
From	John Colgrove
Subject	[Csnd] Re: Lua opcodes on OSX?
	I don't know about the first one but I know I'm not finding any lua opcodes in the opcode directory. Of course that's assuming you are referring to Csound 6? -- View this message in context: http://csound.1045644.n5.nabble.com/Lua-opcodes-on-OSX-tp5729252p5729256.html Sent from the Csound - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Date	2013-11-07 16:17
From	Michael Gogins
Subject	Re: [Csnd] Lua opcodes on OSX?
	Thanks, and my apologies, I will try to remember that this time. The use case here obviously is embedding score generating code, written in some high-level language, in the Csound orchestra so that it is saved with, and run with, a regular csd file. The Lua opcodes accomplish this just fine on Windows, Linux, and Android. To the best of your knowledge, is there some other language that could be used in this way on OS X? That is, a language that could be embedded in a csd file and called using opcodes that could be distributed as part of the Csound package on OS X? A Java-based language such as clojure or something? Scheme? Anything? Best, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:11 AM, Steven Yi <stevenyi@gmail.com> wrote: Hi Michael, We've gone over this a few times. The lua opcodes are not distributed with osx. They will crash any app that tries to load them if they are x86_64 unless the app is compiled with special settings. We can't control things like that in a large number of cases, I. E. If it is a Java app, python app, etc. As then Java and python would need to be compiled with that setting. This limitation of luajit is known and listed on their site (on my phone at the moment so it's a little difficult to look up). I spent a fair amount of time trying to find a work around but came to the conclusion that unless luajit changes, we should not distribute the opcodes as too many programs will crash. Steven On Nov 7, 2013 11:01 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: Can somebody please tell me: (1) If the Lua opcodes (which require LuaJIT) run on OS X. (2) If those Lua opcodes are part of the packages distributed on SourceForge for OS X. Thanks, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions

Date	2013-11-07 16:26
From	Steven Yi
Subject	Re: [Csnd] Lua opcodes on OSX?
	Just FYI, I found the relevant info from the luajit site: If you're building a 64 bit application on OSX which links directly or indirectly against LuaJIT, you need to link your main executable with these flags: -pagezero_size 10000 -image_base 100000000 Also, it's recommended to rebase all (self-compiled) shared libraries which are loaded at runtime on OSX/x64 (e.g. C extension modules for Lua). See: man rebase I don't think we have anything I can think of that embeds within the ORC. It's easy enough to use the API and generate score from the outside in though. The closest thing I can think of is using the python opcodes. I know there was an article in the Csound journal from Christopher Ariza that had athenaCL code being used from python opcodes. Java has a generic scripting API. A number of languages support the API by providing scripting engine providers. We could maybe consider something similar with generic script opcodes, and the engines could be registered at run time from opcode libs. Steven On Nov 7, 2013 11:18 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: Thanks, and my apologies, I will try to remember that this time. The use case here obviously is embedding score generating code, written in some high-level language, in the Csound orchestra so that it is saved with, and run with, a regular csd file. The Lua opcodes accomplish this just fine on Windows, Linux, and Android. To the best of your knowledge, is there some other language that could be used in this way on OS X? That is, a language that could be embedded in a csd file and called using opcodes that could be distributed as part of the Csound package on OS X? A Java-based language such as clojure or something? Scheme? Anything? Best, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:11 AM, Steven Yi <stevenyi@gmail.com> wrote: Hi Michael, We've gone over this a few times. The lua opcodes are not distributed with osx. They will crash any app that tries to load them if they are x86_64 unless the app is compiled with special settings. We can't control things like that in a large number of cases, I. E. If it is a Java app, python app, etc. As then Java and python would need to be compiled with that setting. This limitation of luajit is known and listed on their site (on my phone at the moment so it's a little difficult to look up). I spent a fair amount of time trying to find a work around but came to the conclusion that unless luajit changes, we should not distribute the opcodes as too many programs will crash. Steven On Nov 7, 2013 11:01 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: Can somebody please tell me: (1) If the Lua opcodes (which require LuaJIT) run on OS X. (2) If those Lua opcodes are part of the packages distributed on SourceForge for OS X. Thanks, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions

Date	2013-11-07 16:31
From	Michael Gogins
Subject	Re: [Csnd] Lua opcodes on OSX?
	So if we supported the generic scripting API with Csound opcodes, you could package those opcodes for OS X, and then the user could use script from a Csound orchestra if the script provider was present on the user's system? But wouldn't this mean that we would first need to call the Java scripting APIs from Csound? I suppose we could do that with JNI? Thanks, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:26 AM, Steven Yi <stevenyi@gmail.com> wrote: Just FYI, I found the relevant info from the luajit site: If you're building a 64 bit application on OSX which links directly or indirectly against LuaJIT, you need to link your main executable with these flags: -pagezero_size 10000 -image_base 100000000 Also, it's recommended to rebase all (self-compiled) shared libraries which are loaded at runtime on OSX/x64 (e.g. C extension modules for Lua). See: man rebase I don't think we have anything I can think of that embeds within the ORC. It's easy enough to use the API and generate score from the outside in though. The closest thing I can think of is using the python opcodes. I know there was an article in the Csound journal from Christopher Ariza that had athenaCL code being used from python opcodes. Java has a generic scripting API. A number of languages support the API by providing scripting engine providers. We could maybe consider something similar with generic script opcodes, and the engines could be registered at run time from opcode libs. Steven On Nov 7, 2013 11:18 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: Thanks, and my apologies, I will try to remember that this time. The use case here obviously is embedding score generating code, written in some high-level language, in the Csound orchestra so that it is saved with, and run with, a regular csd file. The Lua opcodes accomplish this just fine on Windows, Linux, and Android. To the best of your knowledge, is there some other language that could be used in this way on OS X? That is, a language that could be embedded in a csd file and called using opcodes that could be distributed as part of the Csound package on OS X? A Java-based language such as clojure or something? Scheme? Anything? Best, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:11 AM, Steven Yi <stevenyi@gmail.com> wrote: Hi Michael, We've gone over this a few times. The lua opcodes are not distributed with osx. They will crash any app that tries to load them if they are x86_64 unless the app is compiled with special settings. We can't control things like that in a large number of cases, I. E. If it is a Java app, python app, etc. As then Java and python would need to be compiled with that setting. This limitation of luajit is known and listed on their site (on my phone at the moment so it's a little difficult to look up). I spent a fair amount of time trying to find a work around but came to the conclusion that unless luajit changes, we should not distribute the opcodes as too many programs will crash. Steven On Nov 7, 2013 11:01 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: Can somebody please tell me: (1) If the Lua opcodes (which require LuaJIT) run on OS X. (2) If those Lua opcodes are part of the packages distributed on SourceForge for OS X. Thanks, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions

Date	2013-11-07 16:35
From	Steven Yi
Subject	Re: [Csnd] Lua opcodes on OSX?
	Oh I wasn't thinking we'd use Java's scripting API directly, just use it as a model and implement a similar mechanism with Csound. I do have some reservations about this though, in terms of making good out projects more fragile. Another route is to evaluate what we might need to do to extend score generation within Csound Orchestra code. On Nov 7, 2013 11:32 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: So if we supported the generic scripting API with Csound opcodes, you could package those opcodes for OS X, and then the user could use script from a Csound orchestra if the script provider was present on the user's system? But wouldn't this mean that we would first need to call the Java scripting APIs from Csound? I suppose we could do that with JNI? Thanks, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:26 AM, Steven Yi <stevenyi@gmail.com> wrote: Just FYI, I found the relevant info from the luajit site: If you're building a 64 bit application on OSX which links directly or indirectly against LuaJIT, you need to link your main executable with these flags: -pagezero_size 10000 -image_base 100000000 Also, it's recommended to rebase all (self-compiled) shared libraries which are loaded at runtime on OSX/x64 (e.g. C extension modules for Lua). See: man rebase I don't think we have anything I can think of that embeds within the ORC. It's easy enough to use the API and generate score from the outside in though. The closest thing I can think of is using the python opcodes. I know there was an article in the Csound journal from Christopher Ariza that had athenaCL code being used from python opcodes. Java has a generic scripting API. A number of languages support the API by providing scripting engine providers. We could maybe consider something similar with generic script opcodes, and the engines could be registered at run time from opcode libs. Steven On Nov 7, 2013 11:18 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: Thanks, and my apologies, I will try to remember that this time. The use case here obviously is embedding score generating code, written in some high-level language, in the Csound orchestra so that it is saved with, and run with, a regular csd file. The Lua opcodes accomplish this just fine on Windows, Linux, and Android. To the best of your knowledge, is there some other language that could be used in this way on OS X? That is, a language that could be embedded in a csd file and called using opcodes that could be distributed as part of the Csound package on OS X? A Java-based language such as clojure or something? Scheme? Anything? Best, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:11 AM, Steven Yi <stevenyi@gmail.com> wrote: Hi Michael, We've gone over this a few times. The lua opcodes are not distributed with osx. They will crash any app that tries to load them if they are x86_64 unless the app is compiled with special settings. We can't control things like that in a large number of cases, I. E. If it is a Java app, python app, etc. As then Java and python would need to be compiled with that setting. This limitation of luajit is known and listed on their site (on my phone at the moment so it's a little difficult to look up). I spent a fair amount of time trying to find a work around but came to the conclusion that unless luajit changes, we should not distribute the opcodes as too many programs will crash. Steven On Nov 7, 2013 11:01 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: Can somebody please tell me: (1) If the Lua opcodes (which require LuaJIT) run on OS X. (2) If those Lua opcodes are part of the packages distributed on SourceForge for OS X. Thanks, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions

Date	2013-11-07 16:44
From	Michael Gogins
Subject	Re: [Csnd] Lua opcodes on OSX?
	Yes, using Csound orc code. That is exactly why I was asking you about user-defined types not so long ago. If there were user-defined types and a for loop, we'd be good to go with that. Best, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:35 AM, Steven Yi <stevenyi@gmail.com> wrote: Oh I wasn't thinking we'd use Java's scripting API directly, just use it as a model and implement a similar mechanism with Csound. I do have some reservations about this though, in terms of making good out projects more fragile. Another route is to evaluate what we might need to do to extend score generation within Csound Orchestra code. On Nov 7, 2013 11:32 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: So if we supported the generic scripting API with Csound opcodes, you could package those opcodes for OS X, and then the user could use script from a Csound orchestra if the script provider was present on the user's system? But wouldn't this mean that we would first need to call the Java scripting APIs from Csound? I suppose we could do that with JNI? Thanks, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:26 AM, Steven Yi <stevenyi@gmail.com> wrote: Just FYI, I found the relevant info from the luajit site: If you're building a 64 bit application on OSX which links directly or indirectly against LuaJIT, you need to link your main executable with these flags: -pagezero_size 10000 -image_base 100000000 Also, it's recommended to rebase all (self-compiled) shared libraries which are loaded at runtime on OSX/x64 (e.g. C extension modules for Lua). See: man rebase I don't think we have anything I can think of that embeds within the ORC. It's easy enough to use the API and generate score from the outside in though. The closest thing I can think of is using the python opcodes. I know there was an article in the Csound journal from Christopher Ariza that had athenaCL code being used from python opcodes. Java has a generic scripting API. A number of languages support the API by providing scripting engine providers. We could maybe consider something similar with generic script opcodes, and the engines could be registered at run time from opcode libs. Steven On Nov 7, 2013 11:18 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: Thanks, and my apologies, I will try to remember that this time. The use case here obviously is embedding score generating code, written in some high-level language, in the Csound orchestra so that it is saved with, and run with, a regular csd file. The Lua opcodes accomplish this just fine on Windows, Linux, and Android. To the best of your knowledge, is there some other language that could be used in this way on OS X? That is, a language that could be embedded in a csd file and called using opcodes that could be distributed as part of the Csound package on OS X? A Java-based language such as clojure or something? Scheme? Anything? Best, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 11:11 AM, Steven Yi <stevenyi@gmail.com> wrote: Hi Michael, We've gone over this a few times. The lua opcodes are not distributed with osx. They will crash any app that tries to load them if they are x86_64 unless the app is compiled with special settings. We can't control things like that in a large number of cases, I. E. If it is a Java app, python app, etc. As then Java and python would need to be compiled with that setting. This limitation of luajit is known and listed on their site (on my phone at the moment so it's a little difficult to look up). I spent a fair amount of time trying to find a work around but came to the conclusion that unless luajit changes, we should not distribute the opcodes as too many programs will crash. Steven On Nov 7, 2013 11:01 AM, "Michael Gogins" <michael.gogins@gmail.com> wrote: Can somebody please tell me: (1) If the Lua opcodes (which require LuaJIT) run on OS X. (2) If those Lua opcodes are part of the packages distributed on SourceForge for OS X. Thanks, Mike ----------------------------------------------------- Michael Gogins Irreducible Productions