Hi,

I'm working on a composition which will use lots of counterpoint and I
had a thought about amplitude values. The manual says they're
additive, so wouldn't it make sense to average the amplitude values
(e.g. divide one value by the number of notes in a chord)? That's my
simple question. The more complex question is: How do I keep amplitude
levels from clipping when multiple notes are playing at different
times in parallel (different voices playing at once) with different
ADSRs/accents? I would also be interested to hear about how to get the
amplitudes right for percussive instruments as well as signal input.

Thanks in advance for all replies.

Adam


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You can also use the active opcode to find out how many notes are
playing and then alter the amplitude accordingly.

On 8 July 2011 20:01, Justin Smith  wrote:
> the amplitude at maximum is addative, but on average will be closer to the
> value of a single note of the chord. the exact amplitude will tend to vary
> over time as the phase differeces drift (depending on how closely the notes
> are related harmonically and whether there is any vibratto). for example,
> two identical waveforms with 0 phase difference will be strictly addative,
> at 180 phase difference will cancel to silence. for more complex sounds the
> math is a bit more complex, and the best general purpuse solution is
> probably to use the balance opcode with a referance signal.
>
> ----- Original message -----
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm working on a composition which will use lots of counterpoint and I
>> had a thought about amplitude values. The manual says they're
>> additive, so wouldn't it make sense to average the amplitude values
>> (e.g. divide one value by the number of notes in a chord)? That's my
>> simple question. The more complex question is: How do I keep amplitude
>> levels from clipping when multiple notes are playing at different
>> times in parallel (different voices playing at once) with different
>> ADSRs/accents? I would also be interested to hear about how to get the
>> amplitudes right for percussive instruments as well as signal input.
>>
>> Thanks in advance for all replies.
>>
>> Adam
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>
>> https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>> csound"
>>
>
>


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the amplitude at maximum is addative, but on average will be closer to the value of a single note of the chord. the exact amplitude will tend to vary over time as the phase differeces drift (depending on how closely the notes are related harmonically and whether there is any vibratto). for example, two identical waveforms with 0 phase difference will be strictly addative, at 180 phase difference will cancel to silence. for more complex sounds the math is a bit more complex, and the best general purpuse solution is probably to use the balance opcode with a referance signal.

----- Original message -----
> Hi,
>
> I'm working on a composition which will use lots of counterpoint and I
> had a thought about amplitude values. The manual says they're
> additive, so wouldn't it make sense to average the amplitude values
> (e.g. divide one value by the number of notes in a chord)? That's my
> simple question. The more complex question is: How do I keep amplitude
> levels from clipping when multiple notes are playing at different
> times in parallel (different voices playing at once) with different
> ADSRs/accents? I would also be interested to hear about how to get the
> amplitudes right for percussive instruments as well as signal input.
>
> Thanks in advance for all replies.
>
> Adam
>
>
> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>                        https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
> csound"
>

or use the balance opcode


> but unless the notes are unison and in phase the amplitude of (a1 + a2)/2
> is goung to be less (likely significantly less) than the amplitude of a1
> or a2 alone. is there a good rule of thumb divisor for signal levels when
> you are mixing multiples?
>
> as a stylistic aside, if you want the pop music aesthetic where single
> notes are exactly as loud as chords are, you may as well do what the pop
> producers do and run your mix through a compressor (easy enough to do with
> a global signal and the compress opcode).
>
> ----- Original message -----
>> You can also use the active opcode to find out how many notes are
>> playing and then alter the amplitude accordingly.
>>
>> On 8 July 2011 20:01, Justin Smith  wrote:
>> > the amplitude at maximum is addative, but on average will be closer to
>> > the value of a single note of the chord. the exact amplitude will tend
>> > to vary over time as the phase differeces drift (depending on how
>> > closely the notes are related harmonically and whether there is any
>> > vibratto). for example, two identical waveforms with 0 phase
>> > difference will be strictly addative, at 180 phase difference will
>> > cancel to silence. for more complex sounds the math is a bit more
>> > complex, and the best general purpuse solution is probably to use the
>> > balance opcode with a referance signal.
>> >
>> > ----- Original message -----
>> > > Hi,
>> > >
>> > > I'm working on a composition which will use lots of counterpoint and
>> > > I had a thought about amplitude values. The manual says they're
>> > > additive, so wouldn't it make sense to average the amplitude values
>> > > (e.g. divide one value by the number of notes in a chord)? That's my
>> > > simple question. The more complex question is: How do I keep
>> > > amplitude levels from clipping when multiple notes are playing at
>> > > different times in parallel (different voices playing at once) with
>> > > different ADSRs/accents? I would also be interested to hear about
>> > > how to get the amplitudes right for percussive instruments as well
>> > > as signal input.
>> > >
>> > > Thanks in advance for all replies.
>> > >
>> > > Adam
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>> > >
>> > > https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> > > Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> > > To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>> > > "unsubscribe csound"
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>                       
>> https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>> csound"
>>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
> csound"
>
>




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but unless the notes are unison and in phase the amplitude of (a1 + a2)/2 is goung to be less (likely significantly less) than the amplitude of a1 or a2 alone. is there a good rule of thumb divisor for signal levels when you are mixing multiples?

as a stylistic aside, if you want the pop music aesthetic where single notes are exactly as loud as chords are, you may as well do what the pop producers do and run your mix through a compressor (easy enough to do with a global signal and the compress opcode).

----- Original message -----
> You can also use the active opcode to find out how many notes are
> playing and then alter the amplitude accordingly.
>
> On 8 July 2011 20:01, Justin Smith <noisesmith@gmail.com> wrote:
> > the amplitude at maximum is addative, but on average will be closer to
> > the value of a single note of the chord. the exact amplitude will tend
> > to vary over time as the phase differeces drift (depending on how
> > closely the notes are related harmonically and whether there is any
> > vibratto). for example, two identical waveforms with 0 phase
> > difference will be strictly addative, at 180 phase difference will
> > cancel to silence. for more complex sounds the math is a bit more
> > complex, and the best general purpuse solution is probably to use the
> > balance opcode with a referance signal.
> >
> > ----- Original message -----
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > I'm working on a composition which will use lots of counterpoint and
> > > I had a thought about amplitude values. The manual says they're
> > > additive, so wouldn't it make sense to average the amplitude values
> > > (e.g. divide one value by the number of notes in a chord)? That's my
> > > simple question. The more complex question is: How do I keep
> > > amplitude levels from clipping when multiple notes are playing at
> > > different times in parallel (different voices playing at once) with
> > > different ADSRs/accents? I would also be interested to hear about
> > > how to get the amplitudes right for percussive instruments as well
> > > as signal input.
> > >
> > > Thanks in advance for all replies.
> > >
> > > Adam
> > >
> > >
> > > Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
> > >
> > > https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
> > > Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> > > To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
> > > "unsubscribe csound"
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>                        https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
> csound"
>

It is a pop piece, so the compress opcode will work nicely.

On 7/8/11, jpff@cs.bath.ac.uk  wrote:
> or use the balance opcode
>
>
>> but unless the notes are unison and in phase the amplitude of (a1 + a2)/2
>> is goung to be less (likely significantly less) than the amplitude of a1
>> or a2 alone. is there a good rule of thumb divisor for signal levels when
>> you are mixing multiples?
>>
>> as a stylistic aside, if you want the pop music aesthetic where single
>> notes are exactly as loud as chords are, you may as well do what the pop
>> producers do and run your mix through a compressor (easy enough to do with
>> a global signal and the compress opcode).
>>
>> ----- Original message -----
>>> You can also use the active opcode to find out how many notes are
>>> playing and then alter the amplitude accordingly.
>>>
>>> On 8 July 2011 20:01, Justin Smith  wrote:
>>> > the amplitude at maximum is addative, but on average will be closer to
>>> > the value of a single note of the chord. the exact amplitude will tend
>>> > to vary over time as the phase differeces drift (depending on how
>>> > closely the notes are related harmonically and whether there is any
>>> > vibratto). for example, two identical waveforms with 0 phase
>>> > difference will be strictly addative, at 180 phase difference will
>>> > cancel to silence. for more complex sounds the math is a bit more
>>> > complex, and the best general purpuse solution is probably to use the
>>> > balance opcode with a referance signal.
>>> >
>>> > ----- Original message -----
>>> > > Hi,
>>> > >
>>> > > I'm working on a composition which will use lots of counterpoint and
>>> > > I had a thought about amplitude values. The manual says they're
>>> > > additive, so wouldn't it make sense to average the amplitude values
>>> > > (e.g. divide one value by the number of notes in a chord)? That's my
>>> > > simple question. The more complex question is: How do I keep
>>> > > amplitude levels from clipping when multiple notes are playing at
>>> > > different times in parallel (different voices playing at once) with
>>> > > different ADSRs/accents? I would also be interested to hear about
>>> > > how to get the amplitudes right for percussive instruments as well
>>> > > as signal input.
>>> > >
>>> > > Thanks in advance for all replies.
>>> > >
>>> > > Adam
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>> > >
>>> > > https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>>> > > Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>> > > To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>>> > > "unsubscribe csound"
>>> > >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>>
>>> https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>>> csound"
>>>
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>> csound"
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
> csound"
>
>


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