Hi, I've tried to get Csound6 working on Ableton 64-bit using the latest
version of csound,max/msp and using version 1.1.1. of the csound~ external. 

When I load an instruments in Ableton I get:
/Syntax error unexpected S_LT (token "<")
/
I tried deleting the csound options section of my .csd file just to see what
would happen and then got:

/Csound Command ERROR: too many arguments. 
/

This only happens when using the csound~ external with Max, the instruments
compile in CSoundQT.

Any idea what I'm doing wrong here?

Thanks a million!



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Hi Michael thanks for your response, that makes a bit more sense now!  I
repeated the process using 32-bit versions of Ableton and Max to see what
would happen and the same error occurred. It seemed that regardless of the
version of Ableton or Max used, the same message would appear, suggesting it
was something else.

I set it up so that in Ableton so I could trial the max help csound example
to see if i could first get csound6 working at all. This seems to work
without incident.

When i tried to run my own instruments I was still getting the  "too many
arguments" error. This was fixed by removing a header statement (0dbfs = 1).
So in 32-bit mode ableton i can run my instruments using Csound6! Success!

One other question, when i try to run my instruments in Ableton 64-bit mode
they would compile and playback alright but the CPU usage went from about
20% in 32-bit mode Ableton to about 80% in 64-bit mode. Any ideas why this
would happen or how to avoid this ? Thanks a million!



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Sorry, yes i mean a build of Ableton for 64-bit CPU architecture. I'm running
on mac os 10.8.

At the moment my setup is either using Ableton for 32 or 64 bit CPU
architecture. I can choose by just opening either of the application
versions.

I installed Csound6 from latest .dmg on the Sourceforge page, am i correct
in thinking this version is built for 32-bit architecture and uses double
precision? If so, is it most likely that Ableton is by default bridging
these two systems since i haven't installed any bridge? Also is a version of
Csound6 built for 64bit architecture available?


Thanks a million for your help!




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About to head out, but quick answer is on OSX we build universal binaries that are both 32 and 64-bit CPU architecture builds.

Thanks for the help everybody. I queried this situation with Ableton tech
support. 

They advised that when I load a Max For Live device in Live 64 bit, it opens
Max 64-bit and then loads the device. If the device is built using standard
max objects then no problem. If the device uses any externals then the there
is no guarantee that the external will have been designed to work in 64-bit
architecture Max.

I asked what to expect if an external is written for one architecture (i.e.
32-bit) and is then loaded into Max 64-bit. For example, does it sense the
change in the environment and work differently or does it just stop or would
it maybe run with a high CPU cost.

To this question they pointed out the following section of the Max 6 SDK

"In Max 5 and prior versions, the signal chain for processing audio was
compiled by sending all objects in the patcher a "dsp" message. Objects
responding to this message then executed their dsp method, typically adding
one of the object's perform methods to the signal chain.

In Max 6, the signal chain is compiled by first sending objects a "dsp64"
message. When your object responds to this message, you can add your 64-bit
audio perform methods. If an object supports the old "dsp" message but not
the "dsp64" message, it then wraps the older 32-bit perform routine with
conversion on the inputs and outputs.

This means that the 64-bit engine will work just fine with the older 32-bit
objects. However, the conversion comes with some computational expense. For
the best performance your objects should support the 64-bit dsp chain
natively by implementing the "dsp64" message as explained below."

>From what I can gather (please correct me here) Max is running in 64-bit as
is Ableton and if Csound is distributed as both 32 and 64-bit CPU
architecture builds for mac, these should all work together right? or is
there some else that needs to happen? or is it just the current csound~
external that is causing the issue?Is there an option somewhere to enable or
configure the external for 64-bit Max so as to avoid CPU increase?

Another alternative approach is to revert back to Csound 5 possibly? Has
anybody successfully run Csound5 through the older csound~ external in
64-bit mode in with MaxMSP6 in Ableton on Mac? Thanks a million



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To note: when I integrated the sources from Davis's site into the CS6
git repo, I modified csound~.cpp to support the dsp64 message.  Also
to clarify, dsp64 has to do with double precision (the dsp message
uses float precision). I implemented dsp64 because Csound is being
released with just doubles build now for all desktop platforms.

I don't know if there is a bridge being called. Last I checked, the
dsp64 path was being taken when using Max 6.1.

Some things that are not clear yet:

* Are the same performance issues happening with Max outside of Live?
I have not seen any reports that this is the case.

* I have no idea which path, whether dsp or dsp64, is being called
within Max for Live.  (I also don't own Max for Live, so can not test
this.)

* Since Live is a closed-source program, as is Max, it seems a bit
tricky to know what is really going on behind the curtain.

steven

On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 2:45 PM, Michael Gogins
 wrote:
> OK, the Max thing starts up its own bridge software (similar to what I was
> talking about) if the dsp64 message is not supported. So yes, Max is running
> in 64 bit as is Ableton.
>
> However, the fact that the bridge starts up implies that Csound for Live, in
> spite of being a universal binary that potentially is able to handle the
> dsp64 message, does not in fact handle the dsp64 message.
>
> This would probably be easy to fix in the source code.
>
> It is also possible that there is some configuration file or setting
> somewhere that needs to be set to tell Csound to handle dsp64.
>
> Hope this helps,
> Mike
>
>
> -----------------------------------------------------
> Michael Gogins
> Irreducible Productions
> http://michaelgogins.tumblr.com
> Michael dot Gogins at gmail dot com
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 2:18 PM, Dave Mooney 
> wrote:
>>
>> Thanks for the help everybody. I queried this situation with Ableton tech
>> support.
>>
>> They advised that when I load a Max For Live device in Live 64 bit, it
>> opens
>> Max 64-bit and then loads the device. If the device is built using
>> standard
>> max objects then no problem. If the device uses any externals then the
>> there
>> is no guarantee that the external will have been designed to work in
>> 64-bit
>> architecture Max.
>>
>> I asked what to expect if an external is written for one architecture
>> (i.e.
>> 32-bit) and is then loaded into Max 64-bit. For example, does it sense the
>> change in the environment and work differently or does it just stop or
>> would
>> it maybe run with a high CPU cost.
>>
>> To this question they pointed out the following section of the Max 6 SDK
>>
>> "In Max 5 and prior versions, the signal chain for processing audio was
>> compiled by sending all objects in the patcher a "dsp" message. Objects
>> responding to this message then executed their dsp method, typically
>> adding
>> one of the object's perform methods to the signal chain.
>>
>> In Max 6, the signal chain is compiled by first sending objects a "dsp64"
>> message. When your object responds to this message, you can add your
>> 64-bit
>> audio perform methods. If an object supports the old "dsp" message but not
>> the "dsp64" message, it then wraps the older 32-bit perform routine with
>> conversion on the inputs and outputs.
>>
>> This means that the 64-bit engine will work just fine with the older
>> 32-bit
>> objects. However, the conversion comes with some computational expense.
>> For
>> the best performance your objects should support the 64-bit dsp chain
>> natively by implementing the "dsp64" message as explained below."
>>
>> From what I can gather (please correct me here) Max is running in 64-bit
>> as
>> is Ableton and if Csound is distributed as both 32 and 64-bit CPU
>> architecture builds for mac, these should all work together right? or is
>> there some else that needs to happen? or is it just the current csound~
>> external that is causing the issue?Is there an option somewhere to enable
>> or
>> configure the external for 64-bit Max so as to avoid CPU increase?
>>
>> Another alternative approach is to revert back to Csound 5 possibly? Has
>> anybody successfully run Csound5 through the older csound~ external in
>> 64-bit mode in with MaxMSP6 in Ableton on Mac? Thanks a million
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://csound.1045644.n5.nabble.com/Csound-6-MaxMSP6-1-6-Ableton-9-1-Compilation-Issue-tp5733179p5733222.html
>> Sent from the Csound - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug trackers
>> csound6:
>>             https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/tickets/
>> csound5:
>>             https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/bugs/
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>> csound"
>>
>>
>

Yehp Max For Live requires that max 6 be installed to run and edit devices
with Live 9.


Ableton 9.1
64 bit architecture
>From the Ableton Manual: "64-bit summing is applied to each single mix point
but overall Live‘s internal processing is done at 32-bit. " <--- Could this
be the source of the problem?

Max 6.1.6 and is using 64-bit bit depth and is 64-bit architecture.

Csound is the latest version v6.02

Are these details you were looking for??


Also i'll try run the instruments in Max alone to see what happens, the
issue could just be specific to using Ableton and Max together.

Thanks again for your help guys!



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Yeh seems to be a problem with Ableton, i can run the patches without
incident in Max Standalone and In 32-bit mode Ableton Max For Live. In
64-bit mode the Program crashes when i try to load a Csound Device or the
CPU usage is 2-3 times what it is in 32-bit mode. Dunno what's causing it
but thanks for the help!



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Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug trackers
csound6:
            https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/tickets/
csound5:
            https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/bugs/
Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"

Haha yeh!



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Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug trackers
csound6:
            https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/tickets/
csound5:
            https://sourceforge.net/p/csound/bugs/
Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"