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[Csnd] Re: Re: Re: Re: Mozart effect

Date2008-05-03 15:21
Fromvictor
Subject[Csnd] Re: Re: Re: Re: Mozart effect
Stravinsky was the way in for me too... firebird, petrouchka and
le sacre...then everything else. Great Music.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dave Seidel" 
To: 
Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: [Csnd] Re: Re: Re: Mozart effect


> Agreed.  This music is very much bound to a particular (Euro-centric) 
> musical tradition.  I might accept the idea that if a person had a 
> background in this music (meaning: some training or education, or at least 
> immersion) that listening to it might have some beneficial effects, 
> because then the listener had some cognitive and perceptual preparation. 
> But if you are from a completely different musical culture, I don't expect 
> it would mean very much at all, and might even be perceived as cacophonous 
> (no offense to cacophony).
>
> I'm not sure if this is part of the "theory", but if there's an assumption 
> that Mozart is *objectively* or *inherently* beneficial to one's 
> neurology, then that seems to me to be pretty arrogant.  (This criticism 
> is not aimed at you, David, just trying to put the idea in a more 
> objective or culture-neutral context.)
>
> Personally, as someone who grew up in the States and heard both classical 
> and folk music all the time growing up, it was years before I was able to 
> listen music from the classical era with any interest at all -- it just 
> left me cold.  For me, Stravinsky was the way in, and I worked both 
> backward and forward from that.
>
> - Dave
>
> Pedro Ferreira wrote:
>> I think that _teaching_ music to kids is a great way of stimulating
>> their intelligence and the development of their abilities, but I find
>> it hard to believe that the simple fact that they just _listen_ to
>> music will make them smarter. Maybe your intelligence actually
>> increases (for a limited amount of time) in response to sound
>> frequencies: you can stimulate it artificially by other known means,
>> though with no permanent results. However, all the hype around this
>> effect seems to be a huge load of BS (actually, the "Mozart effect" is
>> widely known as a classical example of a scientific myth).
>> In any case, teach your kids the practice of listening to good music
>> :). It won't hurt them for sure...
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Pedro
>
>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to this list.
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe 
> csound" 


Date2008-05-10 20:27
FromMario Pantin Cox
Subject[Csnd] Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Mozart effect
Jeje... Gotta love this quote from Michael Linton's article:

"Music academics are no better. The annual meeting of the American Musicological Society is full of displays of one-upmanship, conceit, and subtle and not-so-subtle public back-stabbing and professional murder. And our greatest musicians, the star virtuosi, are more than infrequently notorious for their cruelty, faithlessness, arrogance, selfishness, and stupidity. And in all of these areas, Mozart’s music only makes matters worse. ..."

The Mozart Effect



On 3 May, 2008, at 9:51 AM, victor wrote:

Stravinsky was the way in for me too... firebird, petrouchka and
le sacre...then everything else. Great Music.

----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Seidel" <dave@superluminal.com>
To: <csound@lists.bath.ac.uk>
Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: [Csnd] Re: Re: Re: Mozart effect


Agreed.  This music is very much bound to a particular (Euro-centric) musical tradition.  I might accept the idea that if a person had a background in this music (meaning: some training or education, or at least immersion) that listening to it might have some beneficial effects, because then the listener had some cognitive and perceptual preparation. But if you are from a completely different musical culture, I don't expect it would mean very much at all, and might even be perceived as cacophonous (no offense to cacophony).

I'm not sure if this is part of the "theory", but if there's an assumption that Mozart is *objectively* or *inherently* beneficial to one's neurology, then that seems to me to be pretty arrogant.  (This criticism is not aimed at you, David, just trying to put the idea in a more objective or culture-neutral context.)

Personally, as someone who grew up in the States and heard both classical and folk music all the time growing up, it was years before I was able to listen music from the classical era with any interest at all -- it just left me cold.  For me, Stravinsky was the way in, and I worked both backward and forward from that.

- Dave

Pedro Ferreira wrote:
I think that _teaching_ music to kids is a great way of stimulating
their intelligence and the development of their abilities, but I find
it hard to believe that the simple fact that they just _listen_ to
music will make them smarter. Maybe your intelligence actually
increases (for a limited amount of time) in response to sound
frequencies: you can stimulate it artificially by other known means,
though with no permanent results. However, all the hype around this
effect seems to be a huge load of BS (actually, the "Mozart effect" is
widely known as a classical example of a scientific myth).
In any case, teach your kids the practice of listening to good music
:). It won't hurt them for sure...

Cheers,

Pedro




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To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"



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Date2008-05-11 01:20
Frompeiman khosravi
Subject[Csnd] Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Mozart effect
haha this reminds me of what they used to say about Tchaikovsky's 6th symphony: "people with clinical depression have committed suicide listening to it". 

At least the 6th seemed to work on Tchaikovsky himself, whereas the Mozart effect didn't effect Mozart's health by the sound of things. 


On 10 May 2008, at 20:27, Mario Pantin Cox wrote:

Jeje... Gotta love this quote from Michael Linton's article:

"Music academics are no better. The annual meeting of the American Musicological Society is full of displays of one-upmanship, conceit, and subtle and not-so-subtle public back-stabbing and professional murder. And our greatest musicians, the star virtuosi, are more than infrequently notorious for their cruelty, faithlessness, arrogance, selfishness, and stupidity. And in all of these areas, Mozart’s music only makes matters worse. ..."

The Mozart Effect



On 3 May, 2008, at 9:51 AM, victor wrote:

Stravinsky was the way in for me too... firebird, petrouchka and
le sacre...then everything else. Great Music.

----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Seidel" <dave@superluminal.com>
To: <csound@lists.bath.ac.uk>
Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: [Csnd] Re: Re: Re: Mozart effect


Agreed.  This music is very much bound to a particular (Euro-centric) musical tradition.  I might accept the idea that if a person had a background in this music (meaning: some training or education, or at least immersion) that listening to it might have some beneficial effects, because then the listener had some cognitive and perceptual preparation. But if you are from a completely different musical culture, I don't expect it would mean very much at all, and might even be perceived as cacophonous (no offense to cacophony).

I'm not sure if this is part of the "theory", but if there's an assumption that Mozart is *objectively* or *inherently* beneficial to one's neurology, then that seems to me to be pretty arrogant.  (This criticism is not aimed at you, David, just trying to put the idea in a more objective or culture-neutral context.)

Personally, as someone who grew up in the States and heard both classical and folk music all the time growing up, it was years before I was able to listen music from the classical era with any interest at all -- it just left me cold.  For me, Stravinsky was the way in, and I worked both backward and forward from that.

- Dave

Pedro Ferreira wrote:
I think that _teaching_ music to kids is a great way of stimulating
their intelligence and the development of their abilities, but I find
it hard to believe that the simple fact that they just _listen_ to
music will make them smarter. Maybe your intelligence actually
increases (for a limited amount of time) in response to sound
frequencies: you can stimulate it artificially by other known means,
though with no permanent results. However, all the hype around this
effect seems to be a huge load of BS (actually, the "Mozart effect" is
widely known as a classical example of a scientific myth).
In any case, teach your kids the practice of listening to good music
:). It won't hurt them for sure...

Cheers,

Pedro




Send bugs reports to this list.
To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"



Send bugs reports to this list.
To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"