Hi All,

I'm happy to announce that blue 2.3.0 is now available at:

http://blue.kunstmusik.com

The big change for this release is the introduction of LayerGroups.
LayerGroups are plugins that provide types of layers.  Blue's
SoundObject system is now one kind of layer; this release introduces a
new PatternLayer for using a SoundObject as the basis of pattern score
editing. Pattern LayerGroups allow drawing directly on the timeline on
a pattern grid to denote where the SoundObject plays.  A screen shot
and documentation can be found at:

http://blue.kunstmusik.com/manual/html/scoreTimeline.html

This release also adds a new Python Console, updates to PMask, as well
numerous bug fixes. I have also closed down the Wiki and returned to
using Docbook for documentation; releases now include both a PDF and
HTML version of the documentation.

For 2.4.0, I will be working on an Audio LayerGroup type.  The planned
LayerGroup will allow doing DAW type work and will work together with
blue's Mixer system.  I am also starting to do some coding experiments
for making blue operate more fully in realtime, such that score
modifications, instrument modifications, and audio graph modifications
will happen in realtime.  Some of this work can be done already, while
others will require changes planned in Csound6.  I am planning to work
on this concurrently with 2.4.x though I think it will take some time
before this will be complete.  The realtime changes for blue are
planned for 3.0.0.

Also for 2.4.0, I am planning on restructuring and continuing to fill
out the manual.  Depending on how long the realtime work takes, 2.5,
2.6, etc. will continue with new layer group types planned per
release.  I am also designing blueLive changes that will take
advantage of the new layerGroup types as they develop.

ChangeLog is listed below.

Thanks and enjoy!
steven



[CHANGE LOG]

>Notes for 2.3.0<
[released 2012.11.14]

NEW

* Modular Timeline:

  * Layer Groups are now modular (plug-ins)

  * New LayerGroups: SoundObject (based on previous Score system), Pattern

  * (Please read manual entry for Score, sub-section Layer Groups for more
  information)

  * patternsLayerGroupExample.blue added to examples/general

* Added "Search Csound Manual" option in Help menu to allow searching online
  Csound Manual using search terms (i.e. "guard point"); uses Google search

* New Python Console window, allows console-interaction with current python code
  for inspection and experimentation

* Added Steven Yi's "The Living Ocean" to the examples/pieces/stevenYi folder

* Python: for Orchestra Library, added possibility to pass in either noteList or
  function that will generate a noteList(partials work too) to PerformerGroup's
  perform method.  If a noteList is passed in, that same list will get
  distributed to each Performer to perform. If a function or partial is passed
  in, it will be called to generate a new noteList for each Performer to
  perform.  Note: the function or partial should be a no-arg method, so use of
  partials (from functools) is useful here to fix args before passing in a
  function.

* Python: PMask, added FuncGen and CombiGen Generators (in pmask/generator.py),
  useful for mixing in functional-style work with Generators.  From
  py doc for the classes:

  * FuncGen: Generator that acceptors one generator and one single-arg function.
    Evaluation will call the passed-in generator, then apply the function to the
    generator. Useful with lambdas and partials for the passed in function.

  * CombiGen: Generator that acceptors two generators and one two-arg function.
    Evaluation will call valueAt on the two generators, then pass the results to
    the two-arg function for further processing. Useful with lambdas and
    partials for the passed in function.

* VirtualKeyboard: added keyboard shortcuts when keyboard is in focus:

    * up/down: increment or decrement octave
    * shift-up/shift-down: increment or decrement channel

* Debian/Ubuntu: blue starter script in blue/bin is now pre-setup to use the API
  when Csound is installed through apt-get

UPDATED

* Updated to Jython 2.5.3

* Modified UserDefinedOpcode List tables:

  * allow selection of multiple UDO's for copying and pasting

  * can now copy UDO Categories from the UDO Library manager and paste into list
  tables; all UDO's from that category and subcategory will be pasted into the
  target table (useful for keeping a group of UDO's together to paste into new
  instruments)

* can now drag and drop UDO Category from the UDO Library to a UDO Table

* SoundObjectProperties Window:

  * When editing SoundObject name, now updates as you type

  * When SoundObjectProperties windows becomes focused (selecting the window,
  pressing F3, using window menu), name textfield requests focus; makes it
  easier to edit SoundObjectName or tab down to other fields

* Manual:

  * closed the online Wiki and migrated back to using Docbook

  * release once again includes HTML and PDF versions of the manual
  (located in blue/manual folder or blue.app/manual)

  * Blue Manual link from Help menu points to HTML version of manual

FIX

* Auditioning SoundObjects would cause a crash of program due to unnecessary
  deleting of Csound Object

* Command-line compiling option for compiling .blue to CSD files was always
  reporting exit code 1 and error, even when compile was done correctly

* Using "Paste" and "Paste as PolyObject" were incorrectly pasting soundObjects
  using the x-coordinate as the time value, i.e. instead of pasting at time 4
  it might paste at time 80 if it was 20 pixels per second

* CommandlineRunner - modified how commandline runner stops Csound to prevent
  hanging csound processes on Linux

* UDO - When dragging from the library to a UDO list table, was allowing move
  option, when it should only allow copying

* when creating new UDO's, name now defaults to "newOpcode" rather than
  "New Opcode", as the latter is not a valid UDO name

* BSB - When API is not enabled, BSBDropdown should still generate with index
  value instead of dropdown item's value if automation is set to enabled

* when opening projects that had temp files, do not add the temp file to the
  recent projects list

* TrackerObject

  * made shortcut for ctrl-space and ctrl-shift-space also use control instead
  of command key on OSX to avoid issue with spotlight shortcut

  * fixed track editor sizing

  * fixed issue with OFF notes being editable, causing issues with not allowing
  moving past those notes with arrow keys. OFF notes can now only be cleared
  with ctrl-shift-space or a new note entered by using keyboard shortcut keys

  * changed backspace shortcut to shift-backspace, due to interfering when
  editing values

INTERNAL

* replaced passing of SoundObjectLibrary when saving/loading, now uses
  Map on load and Map on save, where object is
  a SoundObject and String is a uniqueId; make saving/loading generic and
  removes dependency on SoundObjectLibrary

Great, just downloaded it!

Now I really must study that manual....

cheers,
Richard



--
View this message in context: http://csound.1045644.n5.nabble.com/blue-2-3-0-tp5717955p5717965.html
Sent from the Csound - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Hi Peiman,

You'll probably be getting some emails from me while I develop the
audio layers. :)  I think I'll plan to get the basic functionality out
of the way first, then get some inputs from users with beta releases
to figure out what'll be necessary for the initial release.  As for
protools 10, they've been around for years with teams of developers,
but I'll try my best to compete! :P

steven

On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 11:31 PM, peiman khosravi
 wrote:
> Wow! I can't wait to get my hands (and ears) dirty.
>
> And audio layer is very exciting. I'm going to hold off on buying protools
> 10, the stakes are high!
>
> Cheers,
> Peiman
>
> On 15 November 2012 03:27, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> I'm happy to announce that blue 2.3.0 is now available at:
>>
>> http://blue.kunstmusik.com
>>
>> The big change for this release is the introduction of LayerGroups.
>> LayerGroups are plugins that provide types of layers.  Blue's
>> SoundObject system is now one kind of layer; this release introduces a
>> new PatternLayer for using a SoundObject as the basis of pattern score
>> editing. Pattern LayerGroups allow drawing directly on the timeline on
>> a pattern grid to denote where the SoundObject plays.  A screen shot
>> and documentation can be found at:
>>
>> http://blue.kunstmusik.com/manual/html/scoreTimeline.html
>>
>> This release also adds a new Python Console, updates to PMask, as well
>> numerous bug fixes. I have also closed down the Wiki and returned to
>> using Docbook for documentation; releases now include both a PDF and
>> HTML version of the documentation.
>>
>> For 2.4.0, I will be working on an Audio LayerGroup type.  The planned
>> LayerGroup will allow doing DAW type work and will work together with
>> blue's Mixer system.  I am also starting to do some coding experiments
>> for making blue operate more fully in realtime, such that score
>> modifications, instrument modifications, and audio graph modifications
>> will happen in realtime.  Some of this work can be done already, while
>> others will require changes planned in Csound6.  I am planning to work
>> on this concurrently with 2.4.x though I think it will take some time
>> before this will be complete.  The realtime changes for blue are
>> planned for 3.0.0.
>>
>> Also for 2.4.0, I am planning on restructuring and continuing to fill
>> out the manual.  Depending on how long the realtime work takes, 2.5,
>> 2.6, etc. will continue with new layer group types planned per
>> release.  I am also designing blueLive changes that will take
>> advantage of the new layerGroup types as they develop.
>>
>> ChangeLog is listed below.
>>
>> Thanks and enjoy!
>> steven
>>
>>
>>
>> [CHANGE LOG]
>>
>> >Notes for 2.3.0<
>> [released 2012.11.14]
>>
>> NEW
>>
>> * Modular Timeline:
>>
>>   * Layer Groups are now modular (plug-ins)
>>
>>   * New LayerGroups: SoundObject (based on previous Score system), Pattern
>>
>>   * (Please read manual entry for Score, sub-section Layer Groups for more
>>   information)
>>
>>   * patternsLayerGroupExample.blue added to examples/general
>>
>> * Added "Search Csound Manual" option in Help menu to allow searching
>> online
>>   Csound Manual using search terms (i.e. "guard point"); uses Google
>> search
>>
>> * New Python Console window, allows console-interaction with current
>> python code
>>   for inspection and experimentation
>>
>> * Added Steven Yi's "The Living Ocean" to the examples/pieces/stevenYi
>> folder
>>
>> * Python: for Orchestra Library, added possibility to pass in either
>> noteList or
>>   function that will generate a noteList(partials work too) to
>> PerformerGroup's
>>   perform method.  If a noteList is passed in, that same list will get
>>   distributed to each Performer to perform. If a function or partial is
>> passed
>>   in, it will be called to generate a new noteList for each Performer to
>>   perform.  Note: the function or partial should be a no-arg method, so
>> use of
>>   partials (from functools) is useful here to fix args before passing in a
>>   function.
>>
>> * Python: PMask, added FuncGen and CombiGen Generators (in
>> pmask/generator.py),
>>   useful for mixing in functional-style work with Generators.  From
>>   py doc for the classes:
>>
>>   * FuncGen: Generator that acceptors one generator and one single-arg
>> function.
>>     Evaluation will call the passed-in generator, then apply the function
>> to the
>>     generator. Useful with lambdas and partials for the passed in
>> function.
>>
>>   * CombiGen: Generator that acceptors two generators and one two-arg
>> function.
>>     Evaluation will call valueAt on the two generators, then pass the
>> results to
>>     the two-arg function for further processing. Useful with lambdas and
>>     partials for the passed in function.
>>
>> * VirtualKeyboard: added keyboard shortcuts when keyboard is in focus:
>>
>>     * up/down: increment or decrement octave
>>     * shift-up/shift-down: increment or decrement channel
>>
>> * Debian/Ubuntu: blue starter script in blue/bin is now pre-setup to use
>> the API
>>   when Csound is installed through apt-get
>>
>> UPDATED
>>
>> * Updated to Jython 2.5.3
>>
>> * Modified UserDefinedOpcode List tables:
>>
>>   * allow selection of multiple UDO's for copying and pasting
>>
>>   * can now copy UDO Categories from the UDO Library manager and paste
>> into list
>>   tables; all UDO's from that category and subcategory will be pasted into
>> the
>>   target table (useful for keeping a group of UDO's together to paste into
>> new
>>   instruments)
>>
>> * can now drag and drop UDO Category from the UDO Library to a UDO Table
>>
>> * SoundObjectProperties Window:
>>
>>   * When editing SoundObject name, now updates as you type
>>
>>   * When SoundObjectProperties windows becomes focused (selecting the
>> window,
>>   pressing F3, using window menu), name textfield requests focus; makes it
>>   easier to edit SoundObjectName or tab down to other fields
>>
>> * Manual:
>>
>>   * closed the online Wiki and migrated back to using Docbook
>>
>>   * release once again includes HTML and PDF versions of the manual
>>   (located in blue/manual folder or blue.app/manual)
>>
>>   * Blue Manual link from Help menu points to HTML version of manual
>>
>> FIX
>>
>> * Auditioning SoundObjects would cause a crash of program due to
>> unnecessary
>>   deleting of Csound Object
>>
>> * Command-line compiling option for compiling .blue to CSD files was
>> always
>>   reporting exit code 1 and error, even when compile was done correctly
>>
>> * Using "Paste" and "Paste as PolyObject" were incorrectly pasting
>> soundObjects
>>   using the x-coordinate as the time value, i.e. instead of pasting at
>> time 4
>>   it might paste at time 80 if it was 20 pixels per second
>>
>> * CommandlineRunner - modified how commandline runner stops Csound to
>> prevent
>>   hanging csound processes on Linux
>>
>> * UDO - When dragging from the library to a UDO list table, was allowing
>> move
>>   option, when it should only allow copying
>>
>> * when creating new UDO's, name now defaults to "newOpcode" rather than
>>   "New Opcode", as the latter is not a valid UDO name
>>
>> * BSB - When API is not enabled, BSBDropdown should still generate with
>> index
>>   value instead of dropdown item's value if automation is set to enabled
>>
>> * when opening projects that had temp files, do not add the temp file to
>> the
>>   recent projects list
>>
>> * TrackerObject
>>
>>   * made shortcut for ctrl-space and ctrl-shift-space also use control
>> instead
>>   of command key on OSX to avoid issue with spotlight shortcut
>>
>>   * fixed track editor sizing
>>
>>   * fixed issue with OFF notes being editable, causing issues with not
>> allowing
>>   moving past those notes with arrow keys. OFF notes can now only be
>> cleared
>>   with ctrl-shift-space or a new note entered by using keyboard shortcut
>> keys
>>
>>   * changed backspace shortcut to shift-backspace, due to interfering when
>>   editing values
>>
>> INTERNAL
>>
>> * replaced passing of SoundObjectLibrary when saving/loading, now uses
>>   Map on load and Map on save, where object
>> is
>>   a SoundObject and String is a uniqueId; make saving/loading generic and
>>   removes dependency on SoundObjectLibrary
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>> csound"
>>
>

>> And audio layer is very exciting. I'm going to hold off on buying protools
>> 10, the stakes are high!

No pressure Steven!

Recording is easy...
a1, a2 ins
;...
outs a1, a2

Works like a charm.

On 11/16/12, peiman khosravi  wrote:
> Hi Steven,
>
> Yes please do send me beta versions and more. I'll have lots of time on my
> hands as form tomorrow!
>
> Frankly I don't think it'll be that difficult for Blue to compete with
> protools as far as a composition tools goes (recording is another matter).
> But then it's easy for me to say!
>
> All the best,
> Peiman
>
> PS I have a composition student that has decided to make one of his
> portfolio pieces entirely in blue!
>
>
>
> On 15 November 2012 13:54, Steven Yi  wrote:
>
>> Hi Peiman,
>>
>> You'll probably be getting some emails from me while I develop the
>> audio layers. :)  I think I'll plan to get the basic functionality out
>> of the way first, then get some inputs from users with beta releases
>> to figure out what'll be necessary for the initial release.  As for
>> protools 10, they've been around for years with teams of developers,
>> but I'll try my best to compete! :P
>>
>> steven
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 11:31 PM, peiman khosravi
>>  wrote:
>> > Wow! I can't wait to get my hands (and ears) dirty.
>> >
>> > And audio layer is very exciting. I'm going to hold off on buying
>> protools
>> > 10, the stakes are high!
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> > Peiman
>> >
>> > On 15 November 2012 03:27, Steven Yi  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Hi All,
>> >>
>> >> I'm happy to announce that blue 2.3.0 is now available at:
>> >>
>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com
>> >>
>> >> The big change for this release is the introduction of LayerGroups.
>> >> LayerGroups are plugins that provide types of layers.  Blue's
>> >> SoundObject system is now one kind of layer; this release introduces a
>> >> new PatternLayer for using a SoundObject as the basis of pattern score
>> >> editing. Pattern LayerGroups allow drawing directly on the timeline on
>> >> a pattern grid to denote where the SoundObject plays.  A screen shot
>> >> and documentation can be found at:
>> >>
>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com/manual/html/scoreTimeline.html
>> >>
>> >> This release also adds a new Python Console, updates to PMask, as well
>> >> numerous bug fixes. I have also closed down the Wiki and returned to
>> >> using Docbook for documentation; releases now include both a PDF and
>> >> HTML version of the documentation.
>> >>
>> >> For 2.4.0, I will be working on an Audio LayerGroup type.  The planned
>> >> LayerGroup will allow doing DAW type work and will work together with
>> >> blue's Mixer system.  I am also starting to do some coding experiments
>> >> for making blue operate more fully in realtime, such that score
>> >> modifications, instrument modifications, and audio graph modifications
>> >> will happen in realtime.  Some of this work can be done already, while
>> >> others will require changes planned in Csound6.  I am planning to work
>> >> on this concurrently with 2.4.x though I think it will take some time
>> >> before this will be complete.  The realtime changes for blue are
>> >> planned for 3.0.0.
>> >>
>> >> Also for 2.4.0, I am planning on restructuring and continuing to fill
>> >> out the manual.  Depending on how long the realtime work takes, 2.5,
>> >> 2.6, etc. will continue with new layer group types planned per
>> >> release.  I am also designing blueLive changes that will take
>> >> advantage of the new layerGroup types as they develop.
>> >>
>> >> ChangeLog is listed below.
>> >>
>> >> Thanks and enjoy!
>> >> steven
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> [CHANGE LOG]
>> >>
>> >> >Notes for 2.3.0<
>> >> [released 2012.11.14]
>> >>
>> >> NEW
>> >>
>> >> * Modular Timeline:
>> >>
>> >>   * Layer Groups are now modular (plug-ins)
>> >>
>> >>   * New LayerGroups: SoundObject (based on previous Score system),
>> Pattern
>> >>
>> >>   * (Please read manual entry for Score, sub-section Layer Groups for
>> more
>> >>   information)
>> >>
>> >>   * patternsLayerGroupExample.blue added to examples/general
>> >>
>> >> * Added "Search Csound Manual" option in Help menu to allow searching
>> >> online
>> >>   Csound Manual using search terms (i.e. "guard point"); uses Google
>> >> search
>> >>
>> >> * New Python Console window, allows console-interaction with current
>> >> python code
>> >>   for inspection and experimentation
>> >>
>> >> * Added Steven Yi's "The Living Ocean" to the examples/pieces/stevenYi
>> >> folder
>> >>
>> >> * Python: for Orchestra Library, added possibility to pass in either
>> >> noteList or
>> >>   function that will generate a noteList(partials work too) to
>> >> PerformerGroup's
>> >>   perform method.  If a noteList is passed in, that same list will get
>> >>   distributed to each Performer to perform. If a function or partial
>> >> is
>> >> passed
>> >>   in, it will be called to generate a new noteList for each Performer
>> >> to
>> >>   perform.  Note: the function or partial should be a no-arg method,
>> >> so
>> >> use of
>> >>   partials (from functools) is useful here to fix args before passing
>> in a
>> >>   function.
>> >>
>> >> * Python: PMask, added FuncGen and CombiGen Generators (in
>> >> pmask/generator.py),
>> >>   useful for mixing in functional-style work with Generators.  From
>> >>   py doc for the classes:
>> >>
>> >>   * FuncGen: Generator that acceptors one generator and one single-arg
>> >> function.
>> >>     Evaluation will call the passed-in generator, then apply the
>> function
>> >> to the
>> >>     generator. Useful with lambdas and partials for the passed in
>> >> function.
>> >>
>> >>   * CombiGen: Generator that acceptors two generators and one two-arg
>> >> function.
>> >>     Evaluation will call valueAt on the two generators, then pass the
>> >> results to
>> >>     the two-arg function for further processing. Useful with lambdas
>> >> and
>> >>     partials for the passed in function.
>> >>
>> >> * VirtualKeyboard: added keyboard shortcuts when keyboard is in focus:
>> >>
>> >>     * up/down: increment or decrement octave
>> >>     * shift-up/shift-down: increment or decrement channel
>> >>
>> >> * Debian/Ubuntu: blue starter script in blue/bin is now pre-setup to
>> >> use
>> >> the API
>> >>   when Csound is installed through apt-get
>> >>
>> >> UPDATED
>> >>
>> >> * Updated to Jython 2.5.3
>> >>
>> >> * Modified UserDefinedOpcode List tables:
>> >>
>> >>   * allow selection of multiple UDO's for copying and pasting
>> >>
>> >>   * can now copy UDO Categories from the UDO Library manager and paste
>> >> into list
>> >>   tables; all UDO's from that category and subcategory will be pasted
>> into
>> >> the
>> >>   target table (useful for keeping a group of UDO's together to paste
>> into
>> >> new
>> >>   instruments)
>> >>
>> >> * can now drag and drop UDO Category from the UDO Library to a UDO
>> >> Table
>> >>
>> >> * SoundObjectProperties Window:
>> >>
>> >>   * When editing SoundObject name, now updates as you type
>> >>
>> >>   * When SoundObjectProperties windows becomes focused (selecting the
>> >> window,
>> >>   pressing F3, using window menu), name textfield requests focus;
>> >> makes
>> it
>> >>   easier to edit SoundObjectName or tab down to other fields
>> >>
>> >> * Manual:
>> >>
>> >>   * closed the online Wiki and migrated back to using Docbook
>> >>
>> >>   * release once again includes HTML and PDF versions of the manual
>> >>   (located in blue/manual folder or blue.app/manual)
>> >>
>> >>   * Blue Manual link from Help menu points to HTML version of manual
>> >>
>> >> FIX
>> >>
>> >> * Auditioning SoundObjects would cause a crash of program due to
>> >> unnecessary
>> >>   deleting of Csound Object
>> >>
>> >> * Command-line compiling option for compiling .blue to CSD files was
>> >> always
>> >>   reporting exit code 1 and error, even when compile was done
>> >> correctly
>> >>
>> >> * Using "Paste" and "Paste as PolyObject" were incorrectly pasting
>> >> soundObjects
>> >>   using the x-coordinate as the time value, i.e. instead of pasting at
>> >> time 4
>> >>   it might paste at time 80 if it was 20 pixels per second
>> >>
>> >> * CommandlineRunner - modified how commandline runner stops Csound to
>> >> prevent
>> >>   hanging csound processes on Linux
>> >>
>> >> * UDO - When dragging from the library to a UDO list table, was
>> >> allowing
>> >> move
>> >>   option, when it should only allow copying
>> >>
>> >> * when creating new UDO's, name now defaults to "newOpcode" rather
>> >> than
>> >>   "New Opcode", as the latter is not a valid UDO name
>> >>
>> >> * BSB - When API is not enabled, BSBDropdown should still generate
>> >> with
>> >> index
>> >>   value instead of dropdown item's value if automation is set to
>> >> enabled
>> >>
>> >> * when opening projects that had temp files, do not add the temp file
>> >> to
>> >> the
>> >>   recent projects list
>> >>
>> >> * TrackerObject
>> >>
>> >>   * made shortcut for ctrl-space and ctrl-shift-space also use control
>> >> instead
>> >>   of command key on OSX to avoid issue with spotlight shortcut
>> >>
>> >>   * fixed track editor sizing
>> >>
>> >>   * fixed issue with OFF notes being editable, causing issues with not
>> >> allowing
>> >>   moving past those notes with arrow keys. OFF notes can now only be
>> >> cleared
>> >>   with ctrl-shift-space or a new note entered by using keyboard
>> >> shortcut
>> >> keys
>> >>
>> >>   * changed backspace shortcut to shift-backspace, due to interfering
>> when
>> >>   editing values
>> >>
>> >> INTERNAL
>> >>
>> >> * replaced passing of SoundObjectLibrary when saving/loading, now uses
>> >>   Map on load and Map on save, where
>> object
>> >> is
>> >>   a SoundObject and String is a uniqueId; make saving/loading generic
>> and
>> >>   removes dependency on SoundObjectLibrary
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>> >>
>> >> https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> >> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> >> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>> "unsubscribe
>> >> csound"
>> >>
>> >
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>> csound"
>>
>>
>
> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
> csound"
>
>

Hi Peiman,

As for composing, I think blue's has some very unique features, just
the recording/DAW part is another matter. :)  I'll email you when I
get to a point where some testing is necessary.  Thanks!

Also, great to hear about your student!

steven

On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 5:59 AM, peiman khosravi
 wrote:
> Hi Steven,
>
> Yes please do send me beta versions and more. I'll have lots of time on my
> hands as form tomorrow!
>
> Frankly I don't think it'll be that difficult for Blue to compete with
> protools as far as a composition tools goes (recording is another matter).
> But then it's easy for me to say!
>
> All the best,
> Peiman
>
> PS I have a composition student that has decided to make one of his
> portfolio pieces entirely in blue!
>
>
>
>
> On 15 November 2012 13:54, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>
>> Hi Peiman,
>>
>> You'll probably be getting some emails from me while I develop the
>> audio layers. :)  I think I'll plan to get the basic functionality out
>> of the way first, then get some inputs from users with beta releases
>> to figure out what'll be necessary for the initial release.  As for
>> protools 10, they've been around for years with teams of developers,
>> but I'll try my best to compete! :P
>>
>> steven
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 11:31 PM, peiman khosravi
>>  wrote:
>> > Wow! I can't wait to get my hands (and ears) dirty.
>> >
>> > And audio layer is very exciting. I'm going to hold off on buying
>> > protools
>> > 10, the stakes are high!
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> > Peiman
>> >
>> > On 15 November 2012 03:27, Steven Yi  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Hi All,
>> >>
>> >> I'm happy to announce that blue 2.3.0 is now available at:
>> >>
>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com
>> >>
>> >> The big change for this release is the introduction of LayerGroups.
>> >> LayerGroups are plugins that provide types of layers.  Blue's
>> >> SoundObject system is now one kind of layer; this release introduces a
>> >> new PatternLayer for using a SoundObject as the basis of pattern score
>> >> editing. Pattern LayerGroups allow drawing directly on the timeline on
>> >> a pattern grid to denote where the SoundObject plays.  A screen shot
>> >> and documentation can be found at:
>> >>
>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com/manual/html/scoreTimeline.html
>> >>
>> >> This release also adds a new Python Console, updates to PMask, as well
>> >> numerous bug fixes. I have also closed down the Wiki and returned to
>> >> using Docbook for documentation; releases now include both a PDF and
>> >> HTML version of the documentation.
>> >>
>> >> For 2.4.0, I will be working on an Audio LayerGroup type.  The planned
>> >> LayerGroup will allow doing DAW type work and will work together with
>> >> blue's Mixer system.  I am also starting to do some coding experiments
>> >> for making blue operate more fully in realtime, such that score
>> >> modifications, instrument modifications, and audio graph modifications
>> >> will happen in realtime.  Some of this work can be done already, while
>> >> others will require changes planned in Csound6.  I am planning to work
>> >> on this concurrently with 2.4.x though I think it will take some time
>> >> before this will be complete.  The realtime changes for blue are
>> >> planned for 3.0.0.
>> >>
>> >> Also for 2.4.0, I am planning on restructuring and continuing to fill
>> >> out the manual.  Depending on how long the realtime work takes, 2.5,
>> >> 2.6, etc. will continue with new layer group types planned per
>> >> release.  I am also designing blueLive changes that will take
>> >> advantage of the new layerGroup types as they develop.
>> >>
>> >> ChangeLog is listed below.
>> >>
>> >> Thanks and enjoy!
>> >> steven
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> [CHANGE LOG]
>> >>
>> >> >Notes for 2.3.0<
>> >> [released 2012.11.14]
>> >>
>> >> NEW
>> >>
>> >> * Modular Timeline:
>> >>
>> >>   * Layer Groups are now modular (plug-ins)
>> >>
>> >>   * New LayerGroups: SoundObject (based on previous Score system),
>> >> Pattern
>> >>
>> >>   * (Please read manual entry for Score, sub-section Layer Groups for
>> >> more
>> >>   information)
>> >>
>> >>   * patternsLayerGroupExample.blue added to examples/general
>> >>
>> >> * Added "Search Csound Manual" option in Help menu to allow searching
>> >> online
>> >>   Csound Manual using search terms (i.e. "guard point"); uses Google
>> >> search
>> >>
>> >> * New Python Console window, allows console-interaction with current
>> >> python code
>> >>   for inspection and experimentation
>> >>
>> >> * Added Steven Yi's "The Living Ocean" to the examples/pieces/stevenYi
>> >> folder
>> >>
>> >> * Python: for Orchestra Library, added possibility to pass in either
>> >> noteList or
>> >>   function that will generate a noteList(partials work too) to
>> >> PerformerGroup's
>> >>   perform method.  If a noteList is passed in, that same list will get
>> >>   distributed to each Performer to perform. If a function or partial is
>> >> passed
>> >>   in, it will be called to generate a new noteList for each Performer
>> >> to
>> >>   perform.  Note: the function or partial should be a no-arg method, so
>> >> use of
>> >>   partials (from functools) is useful here to fix args before passing
>> >> in a
>> >>   function.
>> >>
>> >> * Python: PMask, added FuncGen and CombiGen Generators (in
>> >> pmask/generator.py),
>> >>   useful for mixing in functional-style work with Generators.  From
>> >>   py doc for the classes:
>> >>
>> >>   * FuncGen: Generator that acceptors one generator and one single-arg
>> >> function.
>> >>     Evaluation will call the passed-in generator, then apply the
>> >> function
>> >> to the
>> >>     generator. Useful with lambdas and partials for the passed in
>> >> function.
>> >>
>> >>   * CombiGen: Generator that acceptors two generators and one two-arg
>> >> function.
>> >>     Evaluation will call valueAt on the two generators, then pass the
>> >> results to
>> >>     the two-arg function for further processing. Useful with lambdas
>> >> and
>> >>     partials for the passed in function.
>> >>
>> >> * VirtualKeyboard: added keyboard shortcuts when keyboard is in focus:
>> >>
>> >>     * up/down: increment or decrement octave
>> >>     * shift-up/shift-down: increment or decrement channel
>> >>
>> >> * Debian/Ubuntu: blue starter script in blue/bin is now pre-setup to
>> >> use
>> >> the API
>> >>   when Csound is installed through apt-get
>> >>
>> >> UPDATED
>> >>
>> >> * Updated to Jython 2.5.3
>> >>
>> >> * Modified UserDefinedOpcode List tables:
>> >>
>> >>   * allow selection of multiple UDO's for copying and pasting
>> >>
>> >>   * can now copy UDO Categories from the UDO Library manager and paste
>> >> into list
>> >>   tables; all UDO's from that category and subcategory will be pasted
>> >> into
>> >> the
>> >>   target table (useful for keeping a group of UDO's together to paste
>> >> into
>> >> new
>> >>   instruments)
>> >>
>> >> * can now drag and drop UDO Category from the UDO Library to a UDO
>> >> Table
>> >>
>> >> * SoundObjectProperties Window:
>> >>
>> >>   * When editing SoundObject name, now updates as you type
>> >>
>> >>   * When SoundObjectProperties windows becomes focused (selecting the
>> >> window,
>> >>   pressing F3, using window menu), name textfield requests focus; makes
>> >> it
>> >>   easier to edit SoundObjectName or tab down to other fields
>> >>
>> >> * Manual:
>> >>
>> >>   * closed the online Wiki and migrated back to using Docbook
>> >>
>> >>   * release once again includes HTML and PDF versions of the manual
>> >>   (located in blue/manual folder or blue.app/manual)
>> >>
>> >>   * Blue Manual link from Help menu points to HTML version of manual
>> >>
>> >> FIX
>> >>
>> >> * Auditioning SoundObjects would cause a crash of program due to
>> >> unnecessary
>> >>   deleting of Csound Object
>> >>
>> >> * Command-line compiling option for compiling .blue to CSD files was
>> >> always
>> >>   reporting exit code 1 and error, even when compile was done correctly
>> >>
>> >> * Using "Paste" and "Paste as PolyObject" were incorrectly pasting
>> >> soundObjects
>> >>   using the x-coordinate as the time value, i.e. instead of pasting at
>> >> time 4
>> >>   it might paste at time 80 if it was 20 pixels per second
>> >>
>> >> * CommandlineRunner - modified how commandline runner stops Csound to
>> >> prevent
>> >>   hanging csound processes on Linux
>> >>
>> >> * UDO - When dragging from the library to a UDO list table, was
>> >> allowing
>> >> move
>> >>   option, when it should only allow copying
>> >>
>> >> * when creating new UDO's, name now defaults to "newOpcode" rather than
>> >>   "New Opcode", as the latter is not a valid UDO name
>> >>
>> >> * BSB - When API is not enabled, BSBDropdown should still generate with
>> >> index
>> >>   value instead of dropdown item's value if automation is set to
>> >> enabled
>> >>
>> >> * when opening projects that had temp files, do not add the temp file
>> >> to
>> >> the
>> >>   recent projects list
>> >>
>> >> * TrackerObject
>> >>
>> >>   * made shortcut for ctrl-space and ctrl-shift-space also use control
>> >> instead
>> >>   of command key on OSX to avoid issue with spotlight shortcut
>> >>
>> >>   * fixed track editor sizing
>> >>
>> >>   * fixed issue with OFF notes being editable, causing issues with not
>> >> allowing
>> >>   moving past those notes with arrow keys. OFF notes can now only be
>> >> cleared
>> >>   with ctrl-shift-space or a new note entered by using keyboard
>> >> shortcut
>> >> keys
>> >>
>> >>   * changed backspace shortcut to shift-backspace, due to interfering
>> >> when
>> >>   editing values
>> >>
>> >> INTERNAL
>> >>
>> >> * replaced passing of SoundObjectLibrary when saving/loading, now uses
>> >>   Map on load and Map on save, where
>> >> object
>> >> is
>> >>   a SoundObject and String is a uniqueId; make saving/loading generic
>> >> and
>> >>   removes dependency on SoundObjectLibrary
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>> >>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> >> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> >> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>> >> "unsubscribe
>> >> csound"
>> >>
>> >
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>> csound"
>>
>

This sounds great, really great. Any chance you'll add support for
VSTs, or audio plugins? We could cook up some blue cabbage! Actually,
it might not be too hard to just load Cabbage instruments directly
without the need for dlls. I do it already in my own host. Would be
nice if users from each side could share more instruments! in fact it
might also be possible, and probably easier too to just wrap Cabbage
instruments with your own native GUIs like other hosts do. Does Blue
already support CsoundQT instruments?

On 16 November 2012 21:26, Steven Yi  wrote:
> Hi Peiman,
>
> As for composing, I think blue's has some very unique features, just
> the recording/DAW part is another matter. :)  I'll email you when I
> get to a point where some testing is necessary.  Thanks!
>
> Also, great to hear about your student!
>
> steven
>
> On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 5:59 AM, peiman khosravi
>  wrote:
>> Hi Steven,
>>
>> Yes please do send me beta versions and more. I'll have lots of time on my
>> hands as form tomorrow!
>>
>> Frankly I don't think it'll be that difficult for Blue to compete with
>> protools as far as a composition tools goes (recording is another matter).
>> But then it's easy for me to say!
>>
>> All the best,
>> Peiman
>>
>> PS I have a composition student that has decided to make one of his
>> portfolio pieces entirely in blue!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 15 November 2012 13:54, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Peiman,
>>>
>>> You'll probably be getting some emails from me while I develop the
>>> audio layers. :)  I think I'll plan to get the basic functionality out
>>> of the way first, then get some inputs from users with beta releases
>>> to figure out what'll be necessary for the initial release.  As for
>>> protools 10, they've been around for years with teams of developers,
>>> but I'll try my best to compete! :P
>>>
>>> steven
>>>
>>> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 11:31 PM, peiman khosravi
>>>  wrote:
>>> > Wow! I can't wait to get my hands (and ears) dirty.
>>> >
>>> > And audio layer is very exciting. I'm going to hold off on buying
>>> > protools
>>> > 10, the stakes are high!
>>> >
>>> > Cheers,
>>> > Peiman
>>> >
>>> > On 15 November 2012 03:27, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> Hi All,
>>> >>
>>> >> I'm happy to announce that blue 2.3.0 is now available at:
>>> >>
>>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com
>>> >>
>>> >> The big change for this release is the introduction of LayerGroups.
>>> >> LayerGroups are plugins that provide types of layers.  Blue's
>>> >> SoundObject system is now one kind of layer; this release introduces a
>>> >> new PatternLayer for using a SoundObject as the basis of pattern score
>>> >> editing. Pattern LayerGroups allow drawing directly on the timeline on
>>> >> a pattern grid to denote where the SoundObject plays.  A screen shot
>>> >> and documentation can be found at:
>>> >>
>>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com/manual/html/scoreTimeline.html
>>> >>
>>> >> This release also adds a new Python Console, updates to PMask, as well
>>> >> numerous bug fixes. I have also closed down the Wiki and returned to
>>> >> using Docbook for documentation; releases now include both a PDF and
>>> >> HTML version of the documentation.
>>> >>
>>> >> For 2.4.0, I will be working on an Audio LayerGroup type.  The planned
>>> >> LayerGroup will allow doing DAW type work and will work together with
>>> >> blue's Mixer system.  I am also starting to do some coding experiments
>>> >> for making blue operate more fully in realtime, such that score
>>> >> modifications, instrument modifications, and audio graph modifications
>>> >> will happen in realtime.  Some of this work can be done already, while
>>> >> others will require changes planned in Csound6.  I am planning to work
>>> >> on this concurrently with 2.4.x though I think it will take some time
>>> >> before this will be complete.  The realtime changes for blue are
>>> >> planned for 3.0.0.
>>> >>
>>> >> Also for 2.4.0, I am planning on restructuring and continuing to fill
>>> >> out the manual.  Depending on how long the realtime work takes, 2.5,
>>> >> 2.6, etc. will continue with new layer group types planned per
>>> >> release.  I am also designing blueLive changes that will take
>>> >> advantage of the new layerGroup types as they develop.
>>> >>
>>> >> ChangeLog is listed below.
>>> >>
>>> >> Thanks and enjoy!
>>> >> steven
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> [CHANGE LOG]
>>> >>
>>> >> >Notes for 2.3.0<
>>> >> [released 2012.11.14]
>>> >>
>>> >> NEW
>>> >>
>>> >> * Modular Timeline:
>>> >>
>>> >>   * Layer Groups are now modular (plug-ins)
>>> >>
>>> >>   * New LayerGroups: SoundObject (based on previous Score system),
>>> >> Pattern
>>> >>
>>> >>   * (Please read manual entry for Score, sub-section Layer Groups for
>>> >> more
>>> >>   information)
>>> >>
>>> >>   * patternsLayerGroupExample.blue added to examples/general
>>> >>
>>> >> * Added "Search Csound Manual" option in Help menu to allow searching
>>> >> online
>>> >>   Csound Manual using search terms (i.e. "guard point"); uses Google
>>> >> search
>>> >>
>>> >> * New Python Console window, allows console-interaction with current
>>> >> python code
>>> >>   for inspection and experimentation
>>> >>
>>> >> * Added Steven Yi's "The Living Ocean" to the examples/pieces/stevenYi
>>> >> folder
>>> >>
>>> >> * Python: for Orchestra Library, added possibility to pass in either
>>> >> noteList or
>>> >>   function that will generate a noteList(partials work too) to
>>> >> PerformerGroup's
>>> >>   perform method.  If a noteList is passed in, that same list will get
>>> >>   distributed to each Performer to perform. If a function or partial is
>>> >> passed
>>> >>   in, it will be called to generate a new noteList for each Performer
>>> >> to
>>> >>   perform.  Note: the function or partial should be a no-arg method, so
>>> >> use of
>>> >>   partials (from functools) is useful here to fix args before passing
>>> >> in a
>>> >>   function.
>>> >>
>>> >> * Python: PMask, added FuncGen and CombiGen Generators (in
>>> >> pmask/generator.py),
>>> >>   useful for mixing in functional-style work with Generators.  From
>>> >>   py doc for the classes:
>>> >>
>>> >>   * FuncGen: Generator that acceptors one generator and one single-arg
>>> >> function.
>>> >>     Evaluation will call the passed-in generator, then apply the
>>> >> function
>>> >> to the
>>> >>     generator. Useful with lambdas and partials for the passed in
>>> >> function.
>>> >>
>>> >>   * CombiGen: Generator that acceptors two generators and one two-arg
>>> >> function.
>>> >>     Evaluation will call valueAt on the two generators, then pass the
>>> >> results to
>>> >>     the two-arg function for further processing. Useful with lambdas
>>> >> and
>>> >>     partials for the passed in function.
>>> >>
>>> >> * VirtualKeyboard: added keyboard shortcuts when keyboard is in focus:
>>> >>
>>> >>     * up/down: increment or decrement octave
>>> >>     * shift-up/shift-down: increment or decrement channel
>>> >>
>>> >> * Debian/Ubuntu: blue starter script in blue/bin is now pre-setup to
>>> >> use
>>> >> the API
>>> >>   when Csound is installed through apt-get
>>> >>
>>> >> UPDATED
>>> >>
>>> >> * Updated to Jython 2.5.3
>>> >>
>>> >> * Modified UserDefinedOpcode List tables:
>>> >>
>>> >>   * allow selection of multiple UDO's for copying and pasting
>>> >>
>>> >>   * can now copy UDO Categories from the UDO Library manager and paste
>>> >> into list
>>> >>   tables; all UDO's from that category and subcategory will be pasted
>>> >> into
>>> >> the
>>> >>   target table (useful for keeping a group of UDO's together to paste
>>> >> into
>>> >> new
>>> >>   instruments)
>>> >>
>>> >> * can now drag and drop UDO Category from the UDO Library to a UDO
>>> >> Table
>>> >>
>>> >> * SoundObjectProperties Window:
>>> >>
>>> >>   * When editing SoundObject name, now updates as you type
>>> >>
>>> >>   * When SoundObjectProperties windows becomes focused (selecting the
>>> >> window,
>>> >>   pressing F3, using window menu), name textfield requests focus; makes
>>> >> it
>>> >>   easier to edit SoundObjectName or tab down to other fields
>>> >>
>>> >> * Manual:
>>> >>
>>> >>   * closed the online Wiki and migrated back to using Docbook
>>> >>
>>> >>   * release once again includes HTML and PDF versions of the manual
>>> >>   (located in blue/manual folder or blue.app/manual)
>>> >>
>>> >>   * Blue Manual link from Help menu points to HTML version of manual
>>> >>
>>> >> FIX
>>> >>
>>> >> * Auditioning SoundObjects would cause a crash of program due to
>>> >> unnecessary
>>> >>   deleting of Csound Object
>>> >>
>>> >> * Command-line compiling option for compiling .blue to CSD files was
>>> >> always
>>> >>   reporting exit code 1 and error, even when compile was done correctly
>>> >>
>>> >> * Using "Paste" and "Paste as PolyObject" were incorrectly pasting
>>> >> soundObjects
>>> >>   using the x-coordinate as the time value, i.e. instead of pasting at
>>> >> time 4
>>> >>   it might paste at time 80 if it was 20 pixels per second
>>> >>
>>> >> * CommandlineRunner - modified how commandline runner stops Csound to
>>> >> prevent
>>> >>   hanging csound processes on Linux
>>> >>
>>> >> * UDO - When dragging from the library to a UDO list table, was
>>> >> allowing
>>> >> move
>>> >>   option, when it should only allow copying
>>> >>
>>> >> * when creating new UDO's, name now defaults to "newOpcode" rather than
>>> >>   "New Opcode", as the latter is not a valid UDO name
>>> >>
>>> >> * BSB - When API is not enabled, BSBDropdown should still generate with
>>> >> index
>>> >>   value instead of dropdown item's value if automation is set to
>>> >> enabled
>>> >>
>>> >> * when opening projects that had temp files, do not add the temp file
>>> >> to
>>> >> the
>>> >>   recent projects list
>>> >>
>>> >> * TrackerObject
>>> >>
>>> >>   * made shortcut for ctrl-space and ctrl-shift-space also use control
>>> >> instead
>>> >>   of command key on OSX to avoid issue with spotlight shortcut
>>> >>
>>> >>   * fixed track editor sizing
>>> >>
>>> >>   * fixed issue with OFF notes being editable, causing issues with not
>>> >> allowing
>>> >>   moving past those notes with arrow keys. OFF notes can now only be
>>> >> cleared
>>> >>   with ctrl-shift-space or a new note entered by using keyboard
>>> >> shortcut
>>> >> keys
>>> >>
>>> >>   * changed backspace shortcut to shift-backspace, due to interfering
>>> >> when
>>> >>   editing values
>>> >>
>>> >> INTERNAL
>>> >>
>>> >> * replaced passing of SoundObjectLibrary when saving/loading, now uses
>>> >>   Map on load and Map on save, where
>>> >> object
>>> >> is
>>> >>   a SoundObject and String is a uniqueId; make saving/loading generic
>>> >> and
>>> >>   removes dependency on SoundObjectLibrary
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>> >>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>>> >> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>> >> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>>> >> "unsubscribe
>>> >> csound"
>>> >>
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>>> csound"
>>>
>>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>

Hi Rory,

CsoundQt now supports generating Cabbage text from the widget panel,
so it can serve as an IDE for Cabbage. I'm wondering what's the best
workflow. Is there a way of launching Cabbage so that it opens the
file or to make Cabbage reload the text?

Cheers,
Andrés

On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 6:19 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
> This sounds great, really great. Any chance you'll add support for
> VSTs, or audio plugins? We could cook up some blue cabbage! Actually,
> it might not be too hard to just load Cabbage instruments directly
> without the need for dlls. I do it already in my own host. Would be
> nice if users from each side could share more instruments! in fact it
> might also be possible, and probably easier too to just wrap Cabbage
> instruments with your own native GUIs like other hosts do. Does Blue
> already support CsoundQT instruments?
>
> On 16 November 2012 21:26, Steven Yi  wrote:
>> Hi Peiman,
>>
>> As for composing, I think blue's has some very unique features, just
>> the recording/DAW part is another matter. :)  I'll email you when I
>> get to a point where some testing is necessary.  Thanks!
>>
>> Also, great to hear about your student!
>>
>> steven
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 5:59 AM, peiman khosravi
>>  wrote:
>>> Hi Steven,
>>>
>>> Yes please do send me beta versions and more. I'll have lots of time on my
>>> hands as form tomorrow!
>>>
>>> Frankly I don't think it'll be that difficult for Blue to compete with
>>> protools as far as a composition tools goes (recording is another matter).
>>> But then it's easy for me to say!
>>>
>>> All the best,
>>> Peiman
>>>
>>> PS I have a composition student that has decided to make one of his
>>> portfolio pieces entirely in blue!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 15 November 2012 13:54, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Peiman,
>>>>
>>>> You'll probably be getting some emails from me while I develop the
>>>> audio layers. :)  I think I'll plan to get the basic functionality out
>>>> of the way first, then get some inputs from users with beta releases
>>>> to figure out what'll be necessary for the initial release.  As for
>>>> protools 10, they've been around for years with teams of developers,
>>>> but I'll try my best to compete! :P
>>>>
>>>> steven
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 11:31 PM, peiman khosravi
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> > Wow! I can't wait to get my hands (and ears) dirty.
>>>> >
>>>> > And audio layer is very exciting. I'm going to hold off on buying
>>>> > protools
>>>> > 10, the stakes are high!
>>>> >
>>>> > Cheers,
>>>> > Peiman
>>>> >
>>>> > On 15 November 2012 03:27, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Hi All,
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I'm happy to announce that blue 2.3.0 is now available at:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com
>>>> >>
>>>> >> The big change for this release is the introduction of LayerGroups.
>>>> >> LayerGroups are plugins that provide types of layers.  Blue's
>>>> >> SoundObject system is now one kind of layer; this release introduces a
>>>> >> new PatternLayer for using a SoundObject as the basis of pattern score
>>>> >> editing. Pattern LayerGroups allow drawing directly on the timeline on
>>>> >> a pattern grid to denote where the SoundObject plays.  A screen shot
>>>> >> and documentation can be found at:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com/manual/html/scoreTimeline.html
>>>> >>
>>>> >> This release also adds a new Python Console, updates to PMask, as well
>>>> >> numerous bug fixes. I have also closed down the Wiki and returned to
>>>> >> using Docbook for documentation; releases now include both a PDF and
>>>> >> HTML version of the documentation.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> For 2.4.0, I will be working on an Audio LayerGroup type.  The planned
>>>> >> LayerGroup will allow doing DAW type work and will work together with
>>>> >> blue's Mixer system.  I am also starting to do some coding experiments
>>>> >> for making blue operate more fully in realtime, such that score
>>>> >> modifications, instrument modifications, and audio graph modifications
>>>> >> will happen in realtime.  Some of this work can be done already, while
>>>> >> others will require changes planned in Csound6.  I am planning to work
>>>> >> on this concurrently with 2.4.x though I think it will take some time
>>>> >> before this will be complete.  The realtime changes for blue are
>>>> >> planned for 3.0.0.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Also for 2.4.0, I am planning on restructuring and continuing to fill
>>>> >> out the manual.  Depending on how long the realtime work takes, 2.5,
>>>> >> 2.6, etc. will continue with new layer group types planned per
>>>> >> release.  I am also designing blueLive changes that will take
>>>> >> advantage of the new layerGroup types as they develop.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> ChangeLog is listed below.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Thanks and enjoy!
>>>> >> steven
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> [CHANGE LOG]
>>>> >>
>>>> >> >Notes for 2.3.0<
>>>> >> [released 2012.11.14]
>>>> >>
>>>> >> NEW
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Modular Timeline:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * Layer Groups are now modular (plug-ins)
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * New LayerGroups: SoundObject (based on previous Score system),
>>>> >> Pattern
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * (Please read manual entry for Score, sub-section Layer Groups for
>>>> >> more
>>>> >>   information)
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * patternsLayerGroupExample.blue added to examples/general
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Added "Search Csound Manual" option in Help menu to allow searching
>>>> >> online
>>>> >>   Csound Manual using search terms (i.e. "guard point"); uses Google
>>>> >> search
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * New Python Console window, allows console-interaction with current
>>>> >> python code
>>>> >>   for inspection and experimentation
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Added Steven Yi's "The Living Ocean" to the examples/pieces/stevenYi
>>>> >> folder
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Python: for Orchestra Library, added possibility to pass in either
>>>> >> noteList or
>>>> >>   function that will generate a noteList(partials work too) to
>>>> >> PerformerGroup's
>>>> >>   perform method.  If a noteList is passed in, that same list will get
>>>> >>   distributed to each Performer to perform. If a function or partial is
>>>> >> passed
>>>> >>   in, it will be called to generate a new noteList for each Performer
>>>> >> to
>>>> >>   perform.  Note: the function or partial should be a no-arg method, so
>>>> >> use of
>>>> >>   partials (from functools) is useful here to fix args before passing
>>>> >> in a
>>>> >>   function.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Python: PMask, added FuncGen and CombiGen Generators (in
>>>> >> pmask/generator.py),
>>>> >>   useful for mixing in functional-style work with Generators.  From
>>>> >>   py doc for the classes:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * FuncGen: Generator that acceptors one generator and one single-arg
>>>> >> function.
>>>> >>     Evaluation will call the passed-in generator, then apply the
>>>> >> function
>>>> >> to the
>>>> >>     generator. Useful with lambdas and partials for the passed in
>>>> >> function.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * CombiGen: Generator that acceptors two generators and one two-arg
>>>> >> function.
>>>> >>     Evaluation will call valueAt on the two generators, then pass the
>>>> >> results to
>>>> >>     the two-arg function for further processing. Useful with lambdas
>>>> >> and
>>>> >>     partials for the passed in function.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * VirtualKeyboard: added keyboard shortcuts when keyboard is in focus:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>     * up/down: increment or decrement octave
>>>> >>     * shift-up/shift-down: increment or decrement channel
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Debian/Ubuntu: blue starter script in blue/bin is now pre-setup to
>>>> >> use
>>>> >> the API
>>>> >>   when Csound is installed through apt-get
>>>> >>
>>>> >> UPDATED
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Updated to Jython 2.5.3
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Modified UserDefinedOpcode List tables:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * allow selection of multiple UDO's for copying and pasting
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * can now copy UDO Categories from the UDO Library manager and paste
>>>> >> into list
>>>> >>   tables; all UDO's from that category and subcategory will be pasted
>>>> >> into
>>>> >> the
>>>> >>   target table (useful for keeping a group of UDO's together to paste
>>>> >> into
>>>> >> new
>>>> >>   instruments)
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * can now drag and drop UDO Category from the UDO Library to a UDO
>>>> >> Table
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * SoundObjectProperties Window:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * When editing SoundObject name, now updates as you type
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * When SoundObjectProperties windows becomes focused (selecting the
>>>> >> window,
>>>> >>   pressing F3, using window menu), name textfield requests focus; makes
>>>> >> it
>>>> >>   easier to edit SoundObjectName or tab down to other fields
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Manual:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * closed the online Wiki and migrated back to using Docbook
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * release once again includes HTML and PDF versions of the manual
>>>> >>   (located in blue/manual folder or blue.app/manual)
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * Blue Manual link from Help menu points to HTML version of manual
>>>> >>
>>>> >> FIX
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Auditioning SoundObjects would cause a crash of program due to
>>>> >> unnecessary
>>>> >>   deleting of Csound Object
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Command-line compiling option for compiling .blue to CSD files was
>>>> >> always
>>>> >>   reporting exit code 1 and error, even when compile was done correctly
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Using "Paste" and "Paste as PolyObject" were incorrectly pasting
>>>> >> soundObjects
>>>> >>   using the x-coordinate as the time value, i.e. instead of pasting at
>>>> >> time 4
>>>> >>   it might paste at time 80 if it was 20 pixels per second
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * CommandlineRunner - modified how commandline runner stops Csound to
>>>> >> prevent
>>>> >>   hanging csound processes on Linux
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * UDO - When dragging from the library to a UDO list table, was
>>>> >> allowing
>>>> >> move
>>>> >>   option, when it should only allow copying
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * when creating new UDO's, name now defaults to "newOpcode" rather than
>>>> >>   "New Opcode", as the latter is not a valid UDO name
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * BSB - When API is not enabled, BSBDropdown should still generate with
>>>> >> index
>>>> >>   value instead of dropdown item's value if automation is set to
>>>> >> enabled
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * when opening projects that had temp files, do not add the temp file
>>>> >> to
>>>> >> the
>>>> >>   recent projects list
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * TrackerObject
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * made shortcut for ctrl-space and ctrl-shift-space also use control
>>>> >> instead
>>>> >>   of command key on OSX to avoid issue with spotlight shortcut
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * fixed track editor sizing
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * fixed issue with OFF notes being editable, causing issues with not
>>>> >> allowing
>>>> >>   moving past those notes with arrow keys. OFF notes can now only be
>>>> >> cleared
>>>> >>   with ctrl-shift-space or a new note entered by using keyboard
>>>> >> shortcut
>>>> >> keys
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * changed backspace shortcut to shift-backspace, due to interfering
>>>> >> when
>>>> >>   editing values
>>>> >>
>>>> >> INTERNAL
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * replaced passing of SoundObjectLibrary when saving/loading, now uses
>>>> >>   Map on load and Map on save, where
>>>> >> object
>>>> >> is
>>>> >>   a SoundObject and String is a uniqueId; make saving/loading generic
>>>> >> and
>>>> >>   removes dependency on SoundObjectLibrary
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>>> >>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>>>> >> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>> >> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>>>> >> "unsubscribe
>>>> >> csound"
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>>>> csound"
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>

I've just had a thought. I can simply get Cabbage to run in a optional
mode that automatically updates when a change has been made to the
file it currently has open. It should be simple, I'll just compare the
times of the last save. In this way one can use any editor with
Cabbage. On top of that the next version has a GUI editor which lets
users drop widgets onto the form. If editors also used the same
routine to see if a file has been updated then users would be able to
use Cabbage's own drag and drop editor, with the changes they make
being updated on the file open in the editor.

Stefano and I used to use an interprocess pipe to communicate between
the Cabbage host and WinXound but it was a pain set up, although it
did work pretty well. This solution sounds much simpler and could be
just as effective. The editor with Cabbage is certainly not up to
scratch compared to CsoundQT and WinXound. We're working on it, but
it'll take a while!

In the meantime I'll implement that feature.


On 17 November 2012 03:07, Andres Cabrera  wrote:
> Hi Rory,
>
> CsoundQt now supports generating Cabbage text from the widget panel,
> so it can serve as an IDE for Cabbage. I'm wondering what's the best
> workflow. Is there a way of launching Cabbage so that it opens the
> file or to make Cabbage reload the text?
>
> Cheers,
> Andrés
>
> On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 6:19 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
>> This sounds great, really great. Any chance you'll add support for
>> VSTs, or audio plugins? We could cook up some blue cabbage! Actually,
>> it might not be too hard to just load Cabbage instruments directly
>> without the need for dlls. I do it already in my own host. Would be
>> nice if users from each side could share more instruments! in fact it
>> might also be possible, and probably easier too to just wrap Cabbage
>> instruments with your own native GUIs like other hosts do. Does Blue
>> already support CsoundQT instruments?
>>
>> On 16 November 2012 21:26, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>> Hi Peiman,
>>>
>>> As for composing, I think blue's has some very unique features, just
>>> the recording/DAW part is another matter. :)  I'll email you when I
>>> get to a point where some testing is necessary.  Thanks!
>>>
>>> Also, great to hear about your student!
>>>
>>> steven
>>>
>>> On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 5:59 AM, peiman khosravi
>>>  wrote:
>>>> Hi Steven,
>>>>
>>>> Yes please do send me beta versions and more. I'll have lots of time on my
>>>> hands as form tomorrow!
>>>>
>>>> Frankly I don't think it'll be that difficult for Blue to compete with
>>>> protools as far as a composition tools goes (recording is another matter).
>>>> But then it's easy for me to say!
>>>>
>>>> All the best,
>>>> Peiman
>>>>
>>>> PS I have a composition student that has decided to make one of his
>>>> portfolio pieces entirely in blue!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 15 November 2012 13:54, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Peiman,
>>>>>
>>>>> You'll probably be getting some emails from me while I develop the
>>>>> audio layers. :)  I think I'll plan to get the basic functionality out
>>>>> of the way first, then get some inputs from users with beta releases
>>>>> to figure out what'll be necessary for the initial release.  As for
>>>>> protools 10, they've been around for years with teams of developers,
>>>>> but I'll try my best to compete! :P
>>>>>
>>>>> steven
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 11:31 PM, peiman khosravi
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> > Wow! I can't wait to get my hands (and ears) dirty.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > And audio layer is very exciting. I'm going to hold off on buying
>>>>> > protools
>>>>> > 10, the stakes are high!
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Cheers,
>>>>> > Peiman
>>>>> >
>>>>> > On 15 November 2012 03:27, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> Hi All,
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> I'm happy to announce that blue 2.3.0 is now available at:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> The big change for this release is the introduction of LayerGroups.
>>>>> >> LayerGroups are plugins that provide types of layers.  Blue's
>>>>> >> SoundObject system is now one kind of layer; this release introduces a
>>>>> >> new PatternLayer for using a SoundObject as the basis of pattern score
>>>>> >> editing. Pattern LayerGroups allow drawing directly on the timeline on
>>>>> >> a pattern grid to denote where the SoundObject plays.  A screen shot
>>>>> >> and documentation can be found at:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com/manual/html/scoreTimeline.html
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> This release also adds a new Python Console, updates to PMask, as well
>>>>> >> numerous bug fixes. I have also closed down the Wiki and returned to
>>>>> >> using Docbook for documentation; releases now include both a PDF and
>>>>> >> HTML version of the documentation.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> For 2.4.0, I will be working on an Audio LayerGroup type.  The planned
>>>>> >> LayerGroup will allow doing DAW type work and will work together with
>>>>> >> blue's Mixer system.  I am also starting to do some coding experiments
>>>>> >> for making blue operate more fully in realtime, such that score
>>>>> >> modifications, instrument modifications, and audio graph modifications
>>>>> >> will happen in realtime.  Some of this work can be done already, while
>>>>> >> others will require changes planned in Csound6.  I am planning to work
>>>>> >> on this concurrently with 2.4.x though I think it will take some time
>>>>> >> before this will be complete.  The realtime changes for blue are
>>>>> >> planned for 3.0.0.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> Also for 2.4.0, I am planning on restructuring and continuing to fill
>>>>> >> out the manual.  Depending on how long the realtime work takes, 2.5,
>>>>> >> 2.6, etc. will continue with new layer group types planned per
>>>>> >> release.  I am also designing blueLive changes that will take
>>>>> >> advantage of the new layerGroup types as they develop.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> ChangeLog is listed below.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> Thanks and enjoy!
>>>>> >> steven
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> [CHANGE LOG]
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> >Notes for 2.3.0<
>>>>> >> [released 2012.11.14]
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> NEW
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Modular Timeline:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * Layer Groups are now modular (plug-ins)
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * New LayerGroups: SoundObject (based on previous Score system),
>>>>> >> Pattern
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * (Please read manual entry for Score, sub-section Layer Groups for
>>>>> >> more
>>>>> >>   information)
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * patternsLayerGroupExample.blue added to examples/general
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Added "Search Csound Manual" option in Help menu to allow searching
>>>>> >> online
>>>>> >>   Csound Manual using search terms (i.e. "guard point"); uses Google
>>>>> >> search
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * New Python Console window, allows console-interaction with current
>>>>> >> python code
>>>>> >>   for inspection and experimentation
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Added Steven Yi's "The Living Ocean" to the examples/pieces/stevenYi
>>>>> >> folder
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Python: for Orchestra Library, added possibility to pass in either
>>>>> >> noteList or
>>>>> >>   function that will generate a noteList(partials work too) to
>>>>> >> PerformerGroup's
>>>>> >>   perform method.  If a noteList is passed in, that same list will get
>>>>> >>   distributed to each Performer to perform. If a function or partial is
>>>>> >> passed
>>>>> >>   in, it will be called to generate a new noteList for each Performer
>>>>> >> to
>>>>> >>   perform.  Note: the function or partial should be a no-arg method, so
>>>>> >> use of
>>>>> >>   partials (from functools) is useful here to fix args before passing
>>>>> >> in a
>>>>> >>   function.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Python: PMask, added FuncGen and CombiGen Generators (in
>>>>> >> pmask/generator.py),
>>>>> >>   useful for mixing in functional-style work with Generators.  From
>>>>> >>   py doc for the classes:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * FuncGen: Generator that acceptors one generator and one single-arg
>>>>> >> function.
>>>>> >>     Evaluation will call the passed-in generator, then apply the
>>>>> >> function
>>>>> >> to the
>>>>> >>     generator. Useful with lambdas and partials for the passed in
>>>>> >> function.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * CombiGen: Generator that acceptors two generators and one two-arg
>>>>> >> function.
>>>>> >>     Evaluation will call valueAt on the two generators, then pass the
>>>>> >> results to
>>>>> >>     the two-arg function for further processing. Useful with lambdas
>>>>> >> and
>>>>> >>     partials for the passed in function.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * VirtualKeyboard: added keyboard shortcuts when keyboard is in focus:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>     * up/down: increment or decrement octave
>>>>> >>     * shift-up/shift-down: increment or decrement channel
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Debian/Ubuntu: blue starter script in blue/bin is now pre-setup to
>>>>> >> use
>>>>> >> the API
>>>>> >>   when Csound is installed through apt-get
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> UPDATED
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Updated to Jython 2.5.3
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Modified UserDefinedOpcode List tables:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * allow selection of multiple UDO's for copying and pasting
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * can now copy UDO Categories from the UDO Library manager and paste
>>>>> >> into list
>>>>> >>   tables; all UDO's from that category and subcategory will be pasted
>>>>> >> into
>>>>> >> the
>>>>> >>   target table (useful for keeping a group of UDO's together to paste
>>>>> >> into
>>>>> >> new
>>>>> >>   instruments)
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * can now drag and drop UDO Category from the UDO Library to a UDO
>>>>> >> Table
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * SoundObjectProperties Window:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * When editing SoundObject name, now updates as you type
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * When SoundObjectProperties windows becomes focused (selecting the
>>>>> >> window,
>>>>> >>   pressing F3, using window menu), name textfield requests focus; makes
>>>>> >> it
>>>>> >>   easier to edit SoundObjectName or tab down to other fields
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Manual:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * closed the online Wiki and migrated back to using Docbook
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * release once again includes HTML and PDF versions of the manual
>>>>> >>   (located in blue/manual folder or blue.app/manual)
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * Blue Manual link from Help menu points to HTML version of manual
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> FIX
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Auditioning SoundObjects would cause a crash of program due to
>>>>> >> unnecessary
>>>>> >>   deleting of Csound Object
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Command-line compiling option for compiling .blue to CSD files was
>>>>> >> always
>>>>> >>   reporting exit code 1 and error, even when compile was done correctly
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * Using "Paste" and "Paste as PolyObject" were incorrectly pasting
>>>>> >> soundObjects
>>>>> >>   using the x-coordinate as the time value, i.e. instead of pasting at
>>>>> >> time 4
>>>>> >>   it might paste at time 80 if it was 20 pixels per second
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * CommandlineRunner - modified how commandline runner stops Csound to
>>>>> >> prevent
>>>>> >>   hanging csound processes on Linux
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * UDO - When dragging from the library to a UDO list table, was
>>>>> >> allowing
>>>>> >> move
>>>>> >>   option, when it should only allow copying
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * when creating new UDO's, name now defaults to "newOpcode" rather than
>>>>> >>   "New Opcode", as the latter is not a valid UDO name
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * BSB - When API is not enabled, BSBDropdown should still generate with
>>>>> >> index
>>>>> >>   value instead of dropdown item's value if automation is set to
>>>>> >> enabled
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * when opening projects that had temp files, do not add the temp file
>>>>> >> to
>>>>> >> the
>>>>> >>   recent projects list
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * TrackerObject
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * made shortcut for ctrl-space and ctrl-shift-space also use control
>>>>> >> instead
>>>>> >>   of command key on OSX to avoid issue with spotlight shortcut
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * fixed track editor sizing
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * fixed issue with OFF notes being editable, causing issues with not
>>>>> >> allowing
>>>>> >>   moving past those notes with arrow keys. OFF notes can now only be
>>>>> >> cleared
>>>>> >>   with ctrl-shift-space or a new note entered by using keyboard
>>>>> >> shortcut
>>>>> >> keys
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>   * changed backspace shortcut to shift-backspace, due to interfering
>>>>> >> when
>>>>> >>   editing values
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> INTERNAL
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> * replaced passing of SoundObjectLibrary when saving/loading, now uses
>>>>> >>   Map on load and Map on save, where
>>>>> >> object
>>>>> >> is
>>>>> >>   a SoundObject and String is a uniqueId; make saving/loading generic
>>>>> >> and
>>>>> >>   removes dependency on SoundObjectLibrary
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>>>> >>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>>>>> >> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>> >> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>>>>> >> "unsubscribe
>>>>> >> csound"
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>>>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>>>>> csound"
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>>>
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>

I've added a feature to Cabbage whereby it will automatically update
if the current instrument has been modified remotely. So if users edit
Cabbage code with CsoundQT, or even design GUIs using CsoundQT's
interface they only need to hit save for their changes to be updated
in the Cabbage host. This will work for any editor, Blue, CsoundQT,
WinXound, Notepad, Emacs, etc. One just needs to turn on the
'auto-update' feature from the menu. It will be available in the next
release. For now this is a one-way process, External Editor->Cabbage.
If editors in turn had a similar function then changes users made to
Cabbage code, through Cabbage, would be updated in the editors.

Rory.

Hi Rory,

I'd love to have more interoperability, but there's a fundamental
issue that would be hard to overcome.  The issue is that something
like Cabbage and CsoundQT uses a Csound project with a global user
interface, and multiple instruments can be make up the project as a
whole. blue instruments have a GUI per instrument, and are made up of
1 csound instrument for the event generated audio, and 1 optional
always-on instrument for instrument-wide audio processing.

I think a blue instrument could be exported and with a little
transformation be made into a CSD that could run in CsoundQT and
Cabbage, but I do not know if it could work the other way around.
Similarly a blue effect could be exported and transformed.  I think
Cabbage and CsoundQT might have a few more widgets than blue does at
the moment, so it'd be alright for now, but I have some plans for new
widgets over the next few releases scheduled.  The export
possibilities though could handle differences of widgets with some
kind of workaround code.

As for loading plugins like VST's or AudioUnits, I'm sure it's
possible but I have not wanted to do it.  The primary reason is that I
believe a music system that involves binary, non-open-source items
introduces fragility to a music project.  I don't want to have the
possibility that 10 or twenty years from now a project won't be able
to be opened, studied, and used.  However, that means that many
amazing instruments and effects that are out there are unavailable to
blue. As easy as it would be to spend some money to purchase some
extremely high quality plug-ins, I'd rather invest my time and energy
towards building and using blue's open source ecosystem.

Thanks!
steven

On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 8:19 PM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
> This sounds great, really great. Any chance you'll add support for
> VSTs, or audio plugins? We could cook up some blue cabbage! Actually,
> it might not be too hard to just load Cabbage instruments directly
> without the need for dlls. I do it already in my own host. Would be
> nice if users from each side could share more instruments! in fact it
> might also be possible, and probably easier too to just wrap Cabbage
> instruments with your own native GUIs like other hosts do. Does Blue
> already support CsoundQT instruments?
>
> On 16 November 2012 21:26, Steven Yi  wrote:
>> Hi Peiman,
>>
>> As for composing, I think blue's has some very unique features, just
>> the recording/DAW part is another matter. :)  I'll email you when I
>> get to a point where some testing is necessary.  Thanks!
>>
>> Also, great to hear about your student!
>>
>> steven
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 5:59 AM, peiman khosravi
>>  wrote:
>>> Hi Steven,
>>>
>>> Yes please do send me beta versions and more. I'll have lots of time on my
>>> hands as form tomorrow!
>>>
>>> Frankly I don't think it'll be that difficult for Blue to compete with
>>> protools as far as a composition tools goes (recording is another matter).
>>> But then it's easy for me to say!
>>>
>>> All the best,
>>> Peiman
>>>
>>> PS I have a composition student that has decided to make one of his
>>> portfolio pieces entirely in blue!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 15 November 2012 13:54, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Peiman,
>>>>
>>>> You'll probably be getting some emails from me while I develop the
>>>> audio layers. :)  I think I'll plan to get the basic functionality out
>>>> of the way first, then get some inputs from users with beta releases
>>>> to figure out what'll be necessary for the initial release.  As for
>>>> protools 10, they've been around for years with teams of developers,
>>>> but I'll try my best to compete! :P
>>>>
>>>> steven
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 11:31 PM, peiman khosravi
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> > Wow! I can't wait to get my hands (and ears) dirty.
>>>> >
>>>> > And audio layer is very exciting. I'm going to hold off on buying
>>>> > protools
>>>> > 10, the stakes are high!
>>>> >
>>>> > Cheers,
>>>> > Peiman
>>>> >
>>>> > On 15 November 2012 03:27, Steven Yi  wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Hi All,
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I'm happy to announce that blue 2.3.0 is now available at:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com
>>>> >>
>>>> >> The big change for this release is the introduction of LayerGroups.
>>>> >> LayerGroups are plugins that provide types of layers.  Blue's
>>>> >> SoundObject system is now one kind of layer; this release introduces a
>>>> >> new PatternLayer for using a SoundObject as the basis of pattern score
>>>> >> editing. Pattern LayerGroups allow drawing directly on the timeline on
>>>> >> a pattern grid to denote where the SoundObject plays.  A screen shot
>>>> >> and documentation can be found at:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> http://blue.kunstmusik.com/manual/html/scoreTimeline.html
>>>> >>
>>>> >> This release also adds a new Python Console, updates to PMask, as well
>>>> >> numerous bug fixes. I have also closed down the Wiki and returned to
>>>> >> using Docbook for documentation; releases now include both a PDF and
>>>> >> HTML version of the documentation.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> For 2.4.0, I will be working on an Audio LayerGroup type.  The planned
>>>> >> LayerGroup will allow doing DAW type work and will work together with
>>>> >> blue's Mixer system.  I am also starting to do some coding experiments
>>>> >> for making blue operate more fully in realtime, such that score
>>>> >> modifications, instrument modifications, and audio graph modifications
>>>> >> will happen in realtime.  Some of this work can be done already, while
>>>> >> others will require changes planned in Csound6.  I am planning to work
>>>> >> on this concurrently with 2.4.x though I think it will take some time
>>>> >> before this will be complete.  The realtime changes for blue are
>>>> >> planned for 3.0.0.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Also for 2.4.0, I am planning on restructuring and continuing to fill
>>>> >> out the manual.  Depending on how long the realtime work takes, 2.5,
>>>> >> 2.6, etc. will continue with new layer group types planned per
>>>> >> release.  I am also designing blueLive changes that will take
>>>> >> advantage of the new layerGroup types as they develop.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> ChangeLog is listed below.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Thanks and enjoy!
>>>> >> steven
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> [CHANGE LOG]
>>>> >>
>>>> >> >Notes for 2.3.0<
>>>> >> [released 2012.11.14]
>>>> >>
>>>> >> NEW
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Modular Timeline:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * Layer Groups are now modular (plug-ins)
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * New LayerGroups: SoundObject (based on previous Score system),
>>>> >> Pattern
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * (Please read manual entry for Score, sub-section Layer Groups for
>>>> >> more
>>>> >>   information)
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * patternsLayerGroupExample.blue added to examples/general
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Added "Search Csound Manual" option in Help menu to allow searching
>>>> >> online
>>>> >>   Csound Manual using search terms (i.e. "guard point"); uses Google
>>>> >> search
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * New Python Console window, allows console-interaction with current
>>>> >> python code
>>>> >>   for inspection and experimentation
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Added Steven Yi's "The Living Ocean" to the examples/pieces/stevenYi
>>>> >> folder
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Python: for Orchestra Library, added possibility to pass in either
>>>> >> noteList or
>>>> >>   function that will generate a noteList(partials work too) to
>>>> >> PerformerGroup's
>>>> >>   perform method.  If a noteList is passed in, that same list will get
>>>> >>   distributed to each Performer to perform. If a function or partial is
>>>> >> passed
>>>> >>   in, it will be called to generate a new noteList for each Performer
>>>> >> to
>>>> >>   perform.  Note: the function or partial should be a no-arg method, so
>>>> >> use of
>>>> >>   partials (from functools) is useful here to fix args before passing
>>>> >> in a
>>>> >>   function.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Python: PMask, added FuncGen and CombiGen Generators (in
>>>> >> pmask/generator.py),
>>>> >>   useful for mixing in functional-style work with Generators.  From
>>>> >>   py doc for the classes:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * FuncGen: Generator that acceptors one generator and one single-arg
>>>> >> function.
>>>> >>     Evaluation will call the passed-in generator, then apply the
>>>> >> function
>>>> >> to the
>>>> >>     generator. Useful with lambdas and partials for the passed in
>>>> >> function.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * CombiGen: Generator that acceptors two generators and one two-arg
>>>> >> function.
>>>> >>     Evaluation will call valueAt on the two generators, then pass the
>>>> >> results to
>>>> >>     the two-arg function for further processing. Useful with lambdas
>>>> >> and
>>>> >>     partials for the passed in function.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * VirtualKeyboard: added keyboard shortcuts when keyboard is in focus:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>     * up/down: increment or decrement octave
>>>> >>     * shift-up/shift-down: increment or decrement channel
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Debian/Ubuntu: blue starter script in blue/bin is now pre-setup to
>>>> >> use
>>>> >> the API
>>>> >>   when Csound is installed through apt-get
>>>> >>
>>>> >> UPDATED
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Updated to Jython 2.5.3
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Modified UserDefinedOpcode List tables:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * allow selection of multiple UDO's for copying and pasting
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * can now copy UDO Categories from the UDO Library manager and paste
>>>> >> into list
>>>> >>   tables; all UDO's from that category and subcategory will be pasted
>>>> >> into
>>>> >> the
>>>> >>   target table (useful for keeping a group of UDO's together to paste
>>>> >> into
>>>> >> new
>>>> >>   instruments)
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * can now drag and drop UDO Category from the UDO Library to a UDO
>>>> >> Table
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * SoundObjectProperties Window:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * When editing SoundObject name, now updates as you type
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * When SoundObjectProperties windows becomes focused (selecting the
>>>> >> window,
>>>> >>   pressing F3, using window menu), name textfield requests focus; makes
>>>> >> it
>>>> >>   easier to edit SoundObjectName or tab down to other fields
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Manual:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * closed the online Wiki and migrated back to using Docbook
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * release once again includes HTML and PDF versions of the manual
>>>> >>   (located in blue/manual folder or blue.app/manual)
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * Blue Manual link from Help menu points to HTML version of manual
>>>> >>
>>>> >> FIX
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Auditioning SoundObjects would cause a crash of program due to
>>>> >> unnecessary
>>>> >>   deleting of Csound Object
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Command-line compiling option for compiling .blue to CSD files was
>>>> >> always
>>>> >>   reporting exit code 1 and error, even when compile was done correctly
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * Using "Paste" and "Paste as PolyObject" were incorrectly pasting
>>>> >> soundObjects
>>>> >>   using the x-coordinate as the time value, i.e. instead of pasting at
>>>> >> time 4
>>>> >>   it might paste at time 80 if it was 20 pixels per second
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * CommandlineRunner - modified how commandline runner stops Csound to
>>>> >> prevent
>>>> >>   hanging csound processes on Linux
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * UDO - When dragging from the library to a UDO list table, was
>>>> >> allowing
>>>> >> move
>>>> >>   option, when it should only allow copying
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * when creating new UDO's, name now defaults to "newOpcode" rather than
>>>> >>   "New Opcode", as the latter is not a valid UDO name
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * BSB - When API is not enabled, BSBDropdown should still generate with
>>>> >> index
>>>> >>   value instead of dropdown item's value if automation is set to
>>>> >> enabled
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * when opening projects that had temp files, do not add the temp file
>>>> >> to
>>>> >> the
>>>> >>   recent projects list
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * TrackerObject
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * made shortcut for ctrl-space and ctrl-shift-space also use control
>>>> >> instead
>>>> >>   of command key on OSX to avoid issue with spotlight shortcut
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * fixed track editor sizing
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * fixed issue with OFF notes being editable, causing issues with not
>>>> >> allowing
>>>> >>   moving past those notes with arrow keys. OFF notes can now only be
>>>> >> cleared
>>>> >>   with ctrl-shift-space or a new note entered by using keyboard
>>>> >> shortcut
>>>> >> keys
>>>> >>
>>>> >>   * changed backspace shortcut to shift-backspace, due to interfering
>>>> >> when
>>>> >>   editing values
>>>> >>
>>>> >> INTERNAL
>>>> >>
>>>> >> * replaced passing of SoundObjectLibrary when saving/loading, now uses
>>>> >>   Map on load and Map on save, where
>>>> >> object
>>>> >> is
>>>> >>   a SoundObject and String is a uniqueId; make saving/loading generic
>>>> >> and
>>>> >>   removes dependency on SoundObjectLibrary
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>>> >>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>>>> >> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>> >> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body
>>>> >> "unsubscribe
>>>> >> csound"
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>>>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>>>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe
>>>> csound"
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
>> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
>> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>>
>
>
> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>

I understand your concerns Steven. And I think you are probably right.
But blue cabbage is so good! Actually, it starts of as red cabbage
doesn't it?

Well, one of the things I emailed here about a month or two ago was
about a subcsound opcode.  It was for the purpose of loading in a
child csound instance so that I could use something like Cabbage
projects or CsoundQT projects directly within blue.  On the other
hand, it's a bit of a hack.  :P

Ah, another option, you could also implement importing of blue
instruments and effects.  Both instruments and effects in blue have
export/import options (they generate XML).

On Sat, Nov 17, 2012 at 10:45 AM, Rory Walsh  wrote:
> I understand your concerns Steven. And I think you are probably right.
> But blue cabbage is so good! Actually, it starts of as red cabbage
> doesn't it?
>
>
> Send bugs reports to the Sourceforge bug tracker
>             https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=81968&atid=564599
> Discussions of bugs and features can be posted here
> To unsubscribe, send email sympa@lists.bath.ac.uk with body "unsubscribe csound"
>