Steven Yi wrote:

>Hi All,
>
>Since OPCODEDIR and OPCODEDIR64 being set is coming up as an issue
>over and over again, what does everyone think about displaying a
>message to the user when they run Csound and it is not set, something
>like:
>
>###############################################################
># WARNING: OPCODEDIR IS NOT SET!                                      
>                                #
># Csound requires this environment variable to be set to find it's
>opcode libraries.#
># If It is not set, you may experience missing opcodes and audio/midi
>drivers.       #
>###############################################################
>
>I would prefer something as loud as possible as the above, but a less
>bold message would be fine too.  Any objections?
>
>steven
>
>
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excellent idea, how many times has this come up of recent...


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Steven Yi wrote:

> Since OPCODEDIR and OPCODEDIR64 being set is coming up as an issue
> over and over again, what does everyone think about displaying a
> message to the user when they run Csound and it is not set, something
> like:

Actually, there is already a message with a second of delay to make it
more noticeable, but it can be changed as you suggested, and perhaps
it could be a fatal error instead of just a warning.


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On Sep 15, 2005, at 12:43 PM, Istvan Varga wrote:

> Steven Yi wrote:
>
>> Since OPCODEDIR and OPCODEDIR64 being set is coming up as an issue
>> over and over again, what does everyone think about displaying a
>> message to the user when they run Csound and it is not set, something
>> like:
>
> Actually, there is already a message with a second of delay to make it
> more noticeable, but it can be changed as you suggested, and perhaps
> it could be a fatal error instead of just a warning.
>


YES, YES, YES!!! FATAL ERROR ALL CAPS LOUD LOUD LOUD.......

it has to be evident when running the app that this specific 
environment variable is key. Also AFAIK this is the first version of 
Csound to require this?

Is it possible to have a "reasonable default" set simply to the current 
working directory ??


-David



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David Akbari wrote:

> Is it possible to have a "reasonable default" set simply to the current 
> working directory ??

It already defaults to the current directory, with printing a warning
and a one second delay at start-up. However, if Csound is installed
rather than just being run from the build directory, the plugins are
most probably not in the current directory.


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Istvan Varga wrote:
> David Akbari wrote:
> 
>> Is it possible to have a "reasonable default" set simply to the 
>> current working directory ??
> 
> 
> It already defaults to the current directory, with printing a warning
> and a one second delay at start-up. However, if Csound is installed
> rather than just being run from the build directory, the plugins are
> most probably not in the current directory.
> 

since there is a default value, I think it should not be a fatal error 
if OPCODEDIR is not defined. this would greatly simplify the deployment 
of csound-based apps such as my own, where it is important to tweak as 
less as possible the host computer (for example, think about a portable 
csound-based system on a USB key; it would be nice to be able to run it 
directly from the key)


Stef


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now that I think about it, it would be good to have a command-line flag 
disabling the one-second delay :)


Stef


Stéphane Rollandin wrote:
> Istvan Varga wrote:
>> It already defaults to the current directory, with printing a warning
>> and a one second delay at start-up. However, if Csound is installed
>> rather than just being run from the build directory, the plugins are
>> most probably not in the current directory.
>>
> 
> since there is a default value, I think it should not be a fatal error 
> if OPCODEDIR is not defined. this would greatly simplify the deployment 
> of csound-based apps such as my own, where it is important to tweak as 
> less as possible the host computer (for example, think about a portable 
> csound-based system on a USB key; it would be nice to be able to run it 
> directly from the key)
> 
> 
> Stef
> 



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On Sep 15, 2005, at 1:03 PM, Istvan Varga wrote:

> David Akbari wrote:
>
>> Is it possible to have a "reasonable default" set simply to the 
>> current working directory ??
>
> It already defaults to the current directory, with printing a warning
> and a one second delay at start-up. However, if Csound is installed
> rather than just being run from the build directory, the plugins are
> most probably not in the current directory.
>

That is an excellent feature. I did not notice it until today's CVS 
build... this should be quite nice in the future.

I prefer for example to be having 3-4 different parallel builds of 
Csound5 with different hardware config, FLTK, figuring out csound's 
extensions, etc etc thus I really like the concept of the OPCODEDIR and 
environment variables in general (users can use different shells to run 
simultaneous instances of Csound5 in parallel).

Off topic, but does any facility exist at present to ignore all text in 
the  flag? like

-+ignore_csopts=

... i think this could be a really nice debugging feature....



-David



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You can set OPCODEDIR and/or OPCODEDIR64 to ".", which is the same as
the default, but without the annoying message and delay.

Stéphane Rollandin wrote:

> now that I think about it, it would be good to have a command-line flag 
> disabling the one-second delay :)


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David Akbari wrote:

> Off topic, but does any facility exist at present to ignore all text in 
> the  flag? like
> 
> -+ignore_csopts=
> 
> ... i think this could be a really nice debugging feature....

There is no such option yet, but it can be added easily.



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NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

I usually run without defining OPCODEDIR/OPCODEDIR64 and making that an
error would be a large negative move.

I also think that loading all plugins is the wrong approach, and leads
to code bloat; but that argument is for another day.

==John ffitch


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as I said earlier, I would better not have to set anything and still get 
a possibility to set-up a csound-based distribution.

otherwise, I have to take care of giving environment variables for each 
targetted patform, which is a real hassle.

I guess the point I want to make is to keep in mind that csound can be 
just a part of a bigger system, so it should be as modulable as 
possible. it is very good to have error messages, delays, etc for an 
end-user to be warned that its installation is not complete; on the 
other hand, for a developper using csound as an internal engine within a 
musical system, there sould be a way to disable all of this.


regards,

Stef


Istvan Varga wrote:
> You can set OPCODEDIR and/or OPCODEDIR64 to ".", which is the same as
> the default, but without the annoying message and delay.
> 
> Stéphane Rollandin wrote:
> 
>> now that I think about it, it would be good to have a command-line 
>> flag disabling the one-second delay :)
> 



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OK, I will add the option.

Steven Yi wrote:

> I like this suggestion, as I think I would put it in my .csoundrc so I
> could disable csoptions altogether. =)
> 
> steven
 >
> On 9/15/05, David Akbari  wrote:
> 
>>Off topic, but does any facility exist at present to ignore all text in
>>the  flag? like
>>
>>-+ignore_csopts=
>>
>>... i think this could be a really nice debugging feature....


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Stéphane Rollandin wrote:

> as I said earlier, I would better not have to set anything and still get 
> a possibility to set-up a csound-based distribution.
> 
> otherwise, I have to take care of giving environment variables for each 
> targetted patform, which is a real hassle.
> 
> I guess the point I want to make is to keep in mind that csound can be 
> just a part of a bigger system, so it should be as modulable as 
> possible. it is very good to have error messages, delays, etc for an 
> end-user to be warned that its installation is not complete; on the 
> other hand, for a developper using csound as an internal engine within a 
> musical system, there sould be a way to disable all of this.

Well, if you can compile Csound yourself, then just comment out the
line 'csoundSleep(1000);' in Top/csmodule.c, and the delay will go
away. Also, a customized version of the command line front-end can
set environment variables before creating any instances of Csound
with csoundSetDefaultEnv() in a platform independent way.

However, not setting OPCODEDIR/OPCODEDIR64 is by far the most common
problem that is reported, and almost everyone using Csound 5 the first
time runs into this issue. So, it is more than reasonable to have an
easily noticeable warning (without the delay it would just scroll away
without even having a chance to see it), even if not a fatal error.


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... we have scons working ok and the compile happens until this:

>
> /usr/bin/ld: Undefined symbols:
> typeinfo for Fl_Window
> collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
> scons: *** [csound] Error 1
> scons: building terminated because of errors.
>


suggestions?


__________________________________________
http://jeanpiche.com



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On Sep 16, 2005, at 8:22 AM, Jean Piche wrote:

>
> ... we have scons working ok and the compile happens until this:
>
>>
>> /usr/bin/ld: Undefined symbols:
>> typeinfo for Fl_Window
>> collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
>> scons: *** [csound] Error 1
>> scons: building terminated because of errors.
>>
>
>
> suggestions?
>
>

You are building correctly!!

Now try building with 'buildFLTK=0' ... seems currently broken in CVS 
as I get teh same error at present...


-David



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Isn't it? I have to investigate. Due to the circunstances I have not build 
csound on
the Mac for two or three weeks. I'm getting back into it now that the dust has
settled.

Victor

At 14:10 16/09/2005, you wrote:

>On Sep 16, 2005, at 8:22 AM, Jean Piche wrote:
>
>>
>>... we have scons working ok and the compile happens until this:
>>
>>>
>>>/usr/bin/ld: Undefined symbols:
>>>typeinfo for Fl_Window
>>>collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
>>>scons: *** [csound] Error 1
>>>scons: building terminated because of errors.
>>
>>
>>suggestions?
>>
>
>You are building correctly!!
>
>Now try building with 'buildFLTK=0' ... seems currently broken in CVS as I 
>get teh same error at present...
>
>
>-David
>
>
>
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Victor Lazzarini
Music Technology Laboratory
Music Department
National University of Ireland, Maynooth 



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> 
> Well, if you can compile Csound yourself, then just comment out the
> line 'csoundSleep(1000);' in Top/csmodule.c, and the delay will go
> away. Also, a customized version of the command line front-end can
> set environment variables before creating any instances of Csound
> with csoundSetDefaultEnv() in a platform independent way.
> 

I do not compile Csound. my environnment uses it via command-line 
invocations.

> However, not setting OPCODEDIR/OPCODEDIR64 is by far the most common
> problem that is reported, and almost everyone using Csound 5 the first
> time runs into this issue. So, it is more than reasonable to have an
> easily noticeable warning (without the delay it would just scroll away
> without even having a chance to see it), even if not a fatal error.

sure, I fully agree. I just asked for a command-line flag disabling all 
such warnings, nothing else. if this is too complicated to implement 
then never mind, I guess I can live without it.


regards,

Stef


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Stéphane Rollandin wrote:

> sure, I fully agree. I just asked for a command-line flag disabling all 
> such warnings, nothing else. if this is too complicated to implement 
> then never mind, I guess I can live without it.

The command line flags are parsed after loading plugins from OPCODEDIR,
but is should be possible to work around that. However, I think I will
just remove the warning message and the delay for now; anyway, these are
probably still not sufficient for new users to find out why many opcodes
are missing or why real time audio does not work.
A better solution would be to remember if OPCODEDIR/OPCODEDIR64 is not
set correctly, and if there is an error later due to not finding opcodes,
utilities, or audio/MIDI drivers, then a long message should be printed
about the environment variables.


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On Sep 16, 2005, at 4:07 PM, Istvan Varga wrote:

> then a long message should be printed
> about the environment variables.
>

Also I think that a manual entry reflecting the use of environment 
variables would be most helpful! It sure has helped for the OENTRY 
reference....




-David



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> A better solution would be to remember if OPCODEDIR/OPCODEDIR64 is not
> set correctly, and if there is an error later due to not finding opcodes,
> utilities, or audio/MIDI drivers, then a long message should be printed
> about the environment variables.

this kind of messages could also, in parallel, be written to a 
csound_warnings.log (or csound_errors.log) file, which would make it 
easier for people to retrieve the origin of the problem... well if they 
happen to notice the existence of the log file :)


Stef


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I have added the new message (not in CVS yet). It is printed only if
there is an actual error that is likely to be the result of not setting
the environment variable, and then it is printed just before the error
so it is much easier to notice.
The message is:

         ################################################################
         #               WARNING: OPCODEDIR IS NOT SET !                #
         # Csound requires this environment variable to be set to find  #
         # its plugin libraries. If it is not set, you may experience   #
         # missing opcodes, audio/MIDI drivers, or utilities.           #
         ################################################################

and

         ################################################################
         #              WARNING: OPCODEDIR64 IS NOT SET !               #
         # Csound requires this environment variable to be set to find  #
         # its plugin libraries. If it is not set, you may experience   #
         # missing opcodes, audio/MIDI drivers, or utilities.           #
         ################################################################

Steven Yi wrote:

> Since OPCODEDIR and OPCODEDIR64 being set is coming up as an issue
> over and over again, what does everyone think about displaying a
> message to the user when they run Csound and it is not set, something
> like:
> 
> ###############################################################
> # WARNING: OPCODEDIR IS NOT SET!                                      
>                                 #
> # Csound requires this environment variable to be set to find it's
> opcode libraries.#
> # If It is not set, you may experience missing opcodes and audio/midi
> drivers.       #
> ###############################################################
> 
> I would prefer something as loud as possible as the above, but a less
> bold message would be fine too.  Any objections?
> 
> steven


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David Akbari wrote:

> Off topic, but does any facility exist at present to ignore all text in 
> the  flag? like
> 
> -+ignore_csopts=
> 
> ... i think this could be a really nice debugging feature....

Now it is implemented (not in CVS yet, but will commit soon):

...
-+id_title= (max. length = 200 characters)
         Title tag in output soundfile (no spaces)
-+ignore_csopts=
         Ignore  in CSD files (default: no)
-+jack_client= (max. length = 32 characters)
         JACK client name (default: csound5)
...


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The Ignore CsOptions should prove quite useful when rendering pieces 
made with CsoundAV 0.431 or 0.432 with Csound5; as the  are 
slightly different!

Thanks, Istvan!!


-David

On Sep 17, 2005, at 11:51 AM, Istvan Varga wrote:
> Now it is implemented (not in CVS yet, but will commit soon):
>
> ...
> -+id_title= (max. length = 200 characters)
>         Title tag in output soundfile (no spaces)
> -+ignore_csopts=
>         Ignore  in CSD files (default: no)
> -+jack_client= (max. length = 32 characters)
>         JACK client name (default: csound5)



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