I think partners might be academic or commercial
institutions. Perhaps when I come up in December
we can have a quick chat about it.

It'll take a bit of preparation, but might be
worth it. So far we seem to have people in five
countries interested (Ireland, UK, Norway, Germany
and Italy). Three is the minimum, but more is
probably better. Also if we could have partners
in ascension countries (eg. Poland, Hungary), it
would be good. I know someone in Poland I might
be able to ask.

Victor

>
> I've talked briefly to NTNU about this.
> They have their own agenda/profile for applications,
> but it seems they could also be interested.
> Last time we talked it was shortly before a deadline, and
> I figured we'd not reach that one anyway. So I forgot
> about it until now. How should we proceed ? I know very
> little about FP7 or EU funding applications. Should the
> partners be academic institutions, or commercial, or
> preferably some of each type ?
>
> Oeyvind
>
> 2007/10/22, Victor Lazzarini :
> > Also this points to something I keep saying: we need to
> > organise ourselves and look for research funding for
> > Csound development. I think we have a case for a FP7
> > bid, but we need to get several EU partners together for
> it. >
> > Victor
> >
> > At 10:13 22/10/2007, you wrote:
> > >Anthony,
> > >Just my 2c of experience on this.
> > >
> > >Yes, I think it will be useful for some to be able to
> > hire programming help, >e.g. pay you to prioritize
> > "their" task before something else that you >might find
> > more interesting. I think that you might be able to find
> >just as many customers outside of the specialist
> > communities for music >technology (e.g. here). I do
> > occationally write software for other >musicians or
> > artists, and I do some csound/python for industry type
> >clients. Obviously it is not the musicians and artists
> > that gives the >best payment, but it's often the more
> > interesting assignments. >I also think it is fair to
> > release the results as OSS. >
> > >Oeyvind
> > >
> > >2007/10/18, Anthony Kozar :
> > > > Hello all Csounders,
> > > >
> > > > This email is meant to be both an announcement and a
> > > > request/survey for comments about the viability of
> > > the new software development services that I
> > > > am offering to the open-source computer music
> > > community.  I would appreciate
> > > > your feedback.
> > > >
> > > > I have noticed in the last few years that there are
> > > > somewhat regular posts to the Csound lists where
> > > users are looking for a programmer to perform some
> > > > specific and usually brief task for them.  These
> > > > requests range from asking for a working Csound
> > > > instrument to a new Csound opcode to writing a small
> utility program for some compositional or miscellaneous
> > > computer music task.
> > > > Sometimes these requests are answered by a volunteer
> > > > and other times they are not.
> > > >
> > > > I would like to offer my Csound knowledge and my
> > > > programming skills as a resource for hire to anyone
> > > > who has a special Csound or computer-music- related
> need along these lines.  I have worked as a volunteer
> > > > developer for Csound and related software tools for
> > > > over 4.5 years now and I intend to continue doing
> > > > so.  But sometimes the immediate priorities of
> volunteer developers do not meet the immediate needs of
> > > open-source software users.  I
> > > > would like to bridge this gap by allowing
> > > > individuals to sponsor and direct my development
> priorities on projects that I am already working on.  Or
> > > > if you have a special private need for a
> > > music-related software tool that needs
> > > > updating or that does not yet exist, I am available
> > > > to update or create it for you.
> > > >
> > > > It is my intention that all of the development work
> > > that I would perform for
> > > > hire in this way will be made available to the
> > > > entire community under an appropriate open-source
> > > > license.  So, my clients would in effect be
> sponsoring the creation of new tools for themselves and
> > > their peers. >
> > > > In order to make this service accessible, I am
> > > trying to keep the rates at a
> > > > level that I hope will be extremely reasonable.  I
> > > > anticipate the average task taking 2-5 days and I am
> > > aiming to make a job of this size affordable. >
> > > > More information including examples of the type of
> > > > work that I am able to perform is available from
> > > this section of my personal web site: >
> > > > http://services.anthonykozar.net/
> > > >
> > > > Also, Sourceforge has recently opened a public beta
> > > > of a new "marketplace" for buying and selling
> > > > open-source software services.  So I may soon be
> > > listing my services on Sourceforge too. >
> > > > I gladly welcome all feedback about the viability
> > > > and usefulness of these services, their pricing, and
> > > > whether or not you would ever consider employing
> > > this type of service. >
> > > > Thank you!
> > > >
> > > > Anthony Kozar
> > > > anthonykozar AT sbcglobal DOT net
> > > > http://anthonykozar.net/
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> ----------------------------------------------------------
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> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Csound-devel mailing list
> > > > Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> > >
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
> > > >
> >
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> > >Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> >https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
> > > Victor Lazzarini
> > Music Technology Laboratory
> > Music Department
> > National University of Ireland, Maynooth
> >
> >
> >
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IMHO better documentation of what's already there would be a good start.
Well, perhaps if someone wants to go commercial they should be  
lobbying for only enough documentation to attract unwary users; they  
are thus more likely to become "customers."
Unfortunately CS is not the only mature pub. dom. dev. that suffers  
from this problem: witness festival, for example.

David

On 23/10/2007, at 8:04 AM, Oeyvind Brandtsegg wrote:

> Good.
> We should probably try to define a subject for the research,
> something that implicitly needs csound to be developed to the next
> level (parser, multiprocessor, things already thought of for csound6,
> and so on), and something that might make us interesting research
> partners for institutions outside of the purely music technologic
> areas (?)
> ... or am I being too opportunistic here ?
> Obviously, there's plenty of subjects that could be interesting *for
> us*, but maybe we could try to find ways to incorporate those subjects
> into something of wider interest.
>
> Oeyvind
>
> 2007/10/22, Victor Lazzarini :
>> I think partners might be academic or commercial
>> institutions. Perhaps when I come up in December
>> we can have a quick chat about it.
>>
>> It'll take a bit of preparation, but might be
>> worth it. So far we seem to have people in five
>> countries interested (Ireland, UK, Norway, Germany
>> and Italy). Three is the minimum, but more is
>> probably better. Also if we could have partners
>> in ascension countries (eg. Poland, Hungary), it
>> would be good. I know someone in Poland I might
>> be able to ask.
>>
>> Victor
>>
>>>
>>> I've talked briefly to NTNU about this.
>>> They have their own agenda/profile for applications,
>>> but it seems they could also be interested.
>>> Last time we talked it was shortly before a deadline, and
>>> I figured we'd not reach that one anyway. So I forgot
>>> about it until now. How should we proceed ? I know very
>>> little about FP7 or EU funding applications. Should the
>>> partners be academic institutions, or commercial, or
>>> preferably some of each type ?
>>>
>>> Oeyvind
>>>
>>> 2007/10/22, Victor Lazzarini :
>>>> Also this points to something I keep saying: we need to
>>>> organise ourselves and look for research funding for
>>>> Csound development. I think we have a case for a FP7
>>>> bid, but we need to get several EU partners together for
>>> it. >
>>>> Victor
>>>>
>>>> At 10:13 22/10/2007, you wrote:
>>>>> Anthony,
>>>>> Just my 2c of experience on this.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, I think it will be useful for some to be able to
>>>> hire programming help, >e.g. pay you to prioritize
>>>> "their" task before something else that you >might find
>>>> more interesting. I think that you might be able to find
>>>> just as many customers outside of the specialist
>>>> communities for music >technology (e.g. here). I do
>>>> occationally write software for other >musicians or
>>>> artists, and I do some csound/python for industry type
>>>> clients. Obviously it is not the musicians and artists
>>>> that gives the >best payment, but it's often the more
>>>> interesting assignments. >I also think it is fair to
>>>> release the results as OSS. >
>>>>> Oeyvind
>>>>>
>>>>> 2007/10/18, Anthony Kozar :
>>>>>> Hello all Csounders,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This email is meant to be both an announcement and a
>>>>>> request/survey for comments about the viability of
>>>>> the new software development services that I
>>>>>> am offering to the open-source computer music
>>>>> community.  I would appreciate
>>>>>> your feedback.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have noticed in the last few years that there are
>>>>>> somewhat regular posts to the Csound lists where
>>>>> users are looking for a programmer to perform some
>>>>>> specific and usually brief task for them.  These
>>>>>> requests range from asking for a working Csound
>>>>>> instrument to a new Csound opcode to writing a small
>>> utility program for some compositional or miscellaneous
>>>>> computer music task.
>>>>>> Sometimes these requests are answered by a volunteer
>>>>>> and other times they are not.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would like to offer my Csound knowledge and my
>>>>>> programming skills as a resource for hire to anyone
>>>>>> who has a special Csound or computer-music- related
>>> need along these lines.  I have worked as a volunteer
>>>>>> developer for Csound and related software tools for
>>>>>> over 4.5 years now and I intend to continue doing
>>>>>> so.  But sometimes the immediate priorities of
>>> volunteer developers do not meet the immediate needs of
>>>>> open-source software users.  I
>>>>>> would like to bridge this gap by allowing
>>>>>> individuals to sponsor and direct my development
>>> priorities on projects that I am already working on.  Or
>>>>>> if you have a special private need for a
>>>>> music-related software tool that needs
>>>>>> updating or that does not yet exist, I am available
>>>>>> to update or create it for you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is my intention that all of the development work
>>>>> that I would perform for
>>>>>> hire in this way will be made available to the
>>>>>> entire community under an appropriate open-source
>>>>>> license.  So, my clients would in effect be
>>> sponsoring the creation of new tools for themselves and
>>>>> their peers. >
>>>>>> In order to make this service accessible, I am
>>>>> trying to keep the rates at a
>>>>>> level that I hope will be extremely reasonable.  I
>>>>>> anticipate the average task taking 2-5 days and I am
>>>>> aiming to make a job of this size affordable. >
>>>>>> More information including examples of the type of
>>>>>> work that I am able to perform is available from
>>>>> this section of my personal web site: >
>>>>>> http://services.anthonykozar.net/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also, Sourceforge has recently opened a public beta
>>>>>> of a new "marketplace" for buying and selling
>>>>>> open-source software services.  So I may soon be
>>>>> listing my services on Sourceforge too. >
>>>>>> I gladly welcome all feedback about the viability
>>>>>> and usefulness of these services, their pricing, and
>>>>>> whether or not you would ever consider employing
>>>>> this type of service. >
>>>>>> Thank you!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anthony Kozar
>>>>>> anthonykozar AT sbcglobal DOT net
>>>>>> http://anthonykozar.net/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
...



_________________________________________________
experimental polymedia:	www.avatar.com.au
Sonic Communications Research Group,
University of Canberra:	 creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/



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Further, I think it would be very worthwhile to pull things apart and  
put them back together again so that CS
a) was more generally accessible as (a dynamic) librar[y, ies] on  
multiple platforms. From the sidelines, the process of working  
towards a build seems torturous. This would involve a a clearer  
rationalisation of (python etc) extension scripting to better enable  
the integration of their developments (eg ipython) to be more  
seamlessly included.
b) More broadly, an inter-process/inter-processor communication  
framework which affords better parallel instantiation.

In summary a revision which emphasises the integration of csound in  
broader computational frameworks.

David.

On 23/10/2007, at 8:04 AM, Oeyvind Brandtsegg wrote:

> Good.
> We should probably try to define a subject for the research,
> something that implicitly needs csound to be developed to the next
> level (parser, multiprocessor, things already thought of for csound6,
> and so on), and something that might make us interesting research
> partners for institutions outside of the purely music technologic
> areas (?)
> ... or am I being too opportunistic here ?
> Obviously, there's plenty of subjects that could be interesting *for
> us*, but maybe we could try to find ways to incorporate those subjects
> into something of wider interest.
>
> Oeyvind
>
> 2007/10/22, Victor Lazzarini :
>> I think partners might be academic or commercial
>> institutions. Perhaps when I come up in December
>> we can have a quick chat about it.
>>
>> It'll take a bit of preparation, but might be
>> worth it. So far we seem to have people in five
>> countries interested (Ireland, UK, Norway, Germany
>> and Italy). Three is the minimum, but more is
>> probably better. Also if we could have partners
>> in ascension countries (eg. Poland, Hungary), it
>> would be good. I know someone in Poland I might
>> be able to ask.
>>
>> Victor
>>
>>>
>>> I've talked briefly to NTNU about this.
>>> They have their own agenda/profile for applications,
>>> but it seems they could also be interested.
>>> Last time we talked it was shortly before a deadline, and
>>> I figured we'd not reach that one anyway. So I forgot
>>> about it until now. How should we proceed ? I know very
>>> little about FP7 or EU funding applications. Should the
>>> partners be academic institutions, or commercial, or
>>> preferably some of each type ?
>>>
>>> Oeyvind
>>>
>>> 2007/10/22, Victor Lazzarini :
>>>> Also this points to something I keep saying: we need to
>>>> organise ourselves and look for research funding for
>>>> Csound development. I think we have a case for a FP7
>>>> bid, but we need to get several EU partners together for
>>> it. >
>>>> Victor
>>>>
>>>> At 10:13 22/10/2007, you wrote:
>>>>> Anthony,
>>>>> Just my 2c of experience on this.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, I think it will be useful for some to be able to
>>>> hire programming help, >e.g. pay you to prioritize
>>>> "their" task before something else that you >might find
>>>> more interesting. I think that you might be able to find
>>>> just as many customers outside of the specialist
>>>> communities for music >technology (e.g. here). I do
>>>> occationally write software for other >musicians or
>>>> artists, and I do some csound/python for industry type
>>>> clients. Obviously it is not the musicians and artists
>>>> that gives the >best payment, but it's often the more
>>>> interesting assignments. >I also think it is fair to
>>>> release the results as OSS. >
>>>>> Oeyvind
>>>>>
>>>>> 2007/10/18, Anthony Kozar :
>>>>>> Hello all Csounders,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This email is meant to be both an announcement and a
>>>>>> request/survey for comments about the viability of
>>>>> the new software development services that I
>>>>>> am offering to the open-source computer music
>>>>> community.  I would appreciate
>>>>>> your feedback.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have noticed in the last few years that there are
>>>>>> somewhat regular posts to the Csound lists where
>>>>> users are looking for a programmer to perform some
>>>>>> specific and usually brief task for them.  These
>>>>>> requests range from asking for a working Csound
>>>>>> instrument to a new Csound opcode to writing a small
>>> utility program for some compositional or miscellaneous
>>>>> computer music task.
>>>>>> Sometimes these requests are answered by a volunteer
>>>>>> and other times they are not.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would like to offer my Csound knowledge and my
>>>>>> programming skills as a resource for hire to anyone
>>>>>> who has a special Csound or computer-music- related
>>> need along these lines.  I have worked as a volunteer
>>>>>> developer for Csound and related software tools for
>>>>>> over 4.5 years now and I intend to continue doing
>>>>>> so.  But sometimes the immediate priorities of
>>> volunteer developers do not meet the immediate needs of
>>>>> open-source software users.  I
>>>>>> would like to bridge this gap by allowing
>>>>>> individuals to sponsor and direct my development
>>> priorities on projects that I am already working on.  Or
>>>>>> if you have a special private need for a
>>>>> music-related software tool that needs
>>>>>> updating or that does not yet exist, I am available
>>>>>> to update or create it for you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is my intention that all of the development work
>>>>> that I would perform for
>>>>>> hire in this way will be made available to the
>>>>>> entire community under an appropriate open-source
>>>>>> license.  So, my clients would in effect be
>>> sponsoring the creation of new tools for themselves and
>>>>> their peers. >
>>>>>> In order to make this service accessible, I am
>>>>> trying to keep the rates at a
>>>>>> level that I hope will be extremely reasonable.  I
>>>>>> anticipate the average task taking 2-5 days and I am
>>>>> aiming to make a job of this size affordable. >
>>>>>> More information including examples of the type of
>>>>>> work that I am able to perform is available from
>>>>> this section of my personal web site: >
>>>>>> http://services.anthonykozar.net/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also, Sourceforge has recently opened a public beta
>>>>>> of a new "marketplace" for buying and selling
>>>>>> open-source software services.  So I may soon be
>>>>> listing my services on Sourceforge too. >
>>>>>> I gladly welcome all feedback about the viability
>>>>>> and usefulness of these services, their pricing, and
>>>>>> whether or not you would ever consider employing
>>>>> this type of service. >
>>>>>> Thank you!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anthony Kozar
>>>>>> anthonykozar AT sbcglobal DOT net
>>>>>> http://anthonykozar.net/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
...
_________________________________________________
experimental polymedia:	www.avatar.com.au
Sonic Communications Research Group,
University of Canberra:	 creative.canberra.edu.au/scrg/



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