Can you do a test where you keep adding oscillators until it craps out? Then 
we can see how many oscillators you can run with 32 bit, and how many with 
64 bit.

I don't think the CPU load is going to tell us that directly.

Best,
Mike


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Iain Duncan" 
To: 
Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 6:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] 64 bit load test, was CVS Reorganization Request


> Ok, at ksmp=64, sr=44100, on my AMD64 3000 running in 32 bit mode, my gig 
> ensemble stays steady at 69% cpu with 32 bit, and 82% cpu at 64bit. For me 
> that is significant, especially as, at that krate, I could not hear an 
> audible difference on my studio monitors. I will definitely stick to 32 
> bit for shows so I would ask that it not be discontinued.
>
> I am also using no FFT code in there.
>
> Can test rendering time later if you'd like, or provide more details on 
> the code.
>
> Iain
>
> Michael Gogins wrote:
>> Not at all. We are talking about 64 bit samples (double) instead of 32 
>> bit samples (float) internally, not 64 bit code for 64 bit processors. I 
>> imagine Csound would sound exactly, or almost exactly, the same on a 64 
>> bit processor as on a 32 bit processor.
>>
>> I believe the scons option is:
>>
>> useDouble=1
>>
>> In other words, in both tests, Csound should be compiled for 32 bit code. 
>> In one test useDouble=0, in the other test useDouble=1.
>>
>> Best,
>> Mike
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Iain Duncan 
>> Sent: Nov 7, 2005 4:33 PM
>> To: csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] CVS Reorganization Request
>>
>> Oops, which options do I need to change in SConstruct, just the "build 
>> for 64 bit machine"?
>>
>> Thanks
>> iain
>>
>> Michael Gogins wrote:
>>
>>>It's not a question whether it's a lot of work, or a little work. The 
>>>question is simply important, just as the question of sound quality is 
>>>important.
>>>I think tests would be very interesting. I would be particularly 
>>>interested if you had live pieces that stress Csound, and that could be 
>>>"tuned" to be more or less demanding.
>>>
>>>Best,
>>>Mike
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: Iain Duncan 
>>>Sent: Nov 7, 2005 3:37 PM
>>>To: csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>>>Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] CVS Reorganization Request
>>>
>>>If we're talking about a *lot* of extra work, I could run heavy load 
>>>tests of both if you'd like.
>>>
>>>Iain
>>>
>>>Michael Gogins wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>How much speed are you talking about here?
>>>>Have you tried using 64 bits and found it too slow? Or are you guessing?
>>>>
>>>>Best,
>>>>Mike
>>>>
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: Iain Duncan 
>>>>Sent: Nov 7, 2005 1:55 PM
>>>>To: csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>>>>Subject: Re: [Cs-dev] CVS Reorganization Request
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Well, as you know, I think having 32 bits and 64 bits is a bad idea. It 
>>>>>should just be 64 bits. So I am utterly indifferent to this question. I 
>>>>>never build or use 32 bits.
>>>>>
>>>>>It continues to escape me why everyone else doesn't do the same. If it 
>>>>>sometimes sounds better and is inarguably more precise and only runs a 
>>>>>little slower, and oh yes it's much simpler to only build for 64 bits, 
>>>>>what's the big deal? Are we musicians here or software engineering 
>>>>>speed demons?
>>>>>At the end of the day, Csound is a musical instrument and its only 
>>>>>purpose is to make music.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Ah, but some of us are live performers, and the speed *does* matter, 
>>>>very very much. I am and will be for many years yet picking which 
>>>>corners to cut in order to get close to what I want running in real 
>>>>time. So I think it is good to still be able to run 32 bits.
>>>>
>>>>Iain
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>-------------------------------------------------------
>>>>SF.Net email is sponsored by:
>>>>Tame your development challenges with Apache's Geronimo App Server. 
>>>>Download
>>>>it for free - -and be entered to win a 42" plasma tv or your very own
>>>>Sony(tm)PSP.  Click here to play: http://sourceforge.net/geronimo.php
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Csound-devel mailing list
>>>>Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>>>>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>-------------------------------------------------------
>>>>SF.Net email is sponsored by:
>>>>Tame your development challenges with Apache's Geronimo App Server. 
>>>>Download
>>>>it for free - -and be entered to win a 42" plasma tv or your very own
>>>>Sony(tm)PSP.  Click here to play: http://sourceforge.net/geronimo.php
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Csound-devel mailing list
>>>>Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>>>>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>-------------------------------------------------------
>>>SF.Net email is sponsored by:
>>>Tame your development challenges with Apache's Geronimo App Server. 
>>>Download
>>>it for free - -and be entered to win a 42" plasma tv or your very own
>>>Sony(tm)PSP.  Click here to play: http://sourceforge.net/geronimo.php
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Csound-devel mailing list
>>>Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>>>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>-------------------------------------------------------
>>>SF.Net email is sponsored by:
>>>Tame your development challenges with Apache's Geronimo App Server. 
>>>Download
>>>it for free - -and be entered to win a 42" plasma tv or your very own
>>>Sony(tm)PSP.  Click here to play: http://sourceforge.net/geronimo.php
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Csound-devel mailing list
>>>Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>>>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------
>> SF.Net email is sponsored by:
>> Tame your development challenges with Apache's Geronimo App Server. 
>> Download
>> it for free - -and be entered to win a 42" plasma tv or your very own
>> Sony(tm)PSP.  Click here to play: http://sourceforge.net/geronimo.php
>> _______________________________________________
>> Csound-devel mailing list
>> Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -------------------------------------------------------
>> SF.Net email is sponsored by:
>> Tame your development challenges with Apache's Geronimo App Server. 
>> Download
>> it for free - -and be entered to win a 42" plasma tv or your very own
>> Sony(tm)PSP.  Click here to play: http://sourceforge.net/geronimo.php
>> _______________________________________________
>> Csound-devel mailing list
>> Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
>>
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------
> SF.Net email is sponsored by:
> Tame your development challenges with Apache's Geronimo App Server. 
> Download
> it for free - -and be entered to win a 42" plasma tv or your very own
> Sony(tm)PSP.  Click here to play: http://sourceforge.net/geronimo.php
> _______________________________________________
> Csound-devel mailing list
> Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
> 




-------------------------------------------------------
SF.Net email is sponsored by:
Tame your development challenges with Apache's Geronimo App Server. Download
it for free - -and be entered to win a 42" plasma tv or your very own
Sony(tm)PSP.  Click here to play: http://sourceforge.net/geronimo.php
_______________________________________________
Csound-devel mailing list
Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net

> Can you do a test where you keep adding oscillators until it craps out? 
> Then we can see how many oscillators you can run with 32 bit, and how 
> many with 64 bit.

With my existing code I can make it crap out by just lowering ksmps, is 
that useful? I can check what ksmp level I can achieve with each. I 
could certainly concoct a many osc test, but not as easy to do as just 
altering my existing rig, which is probably a better real world test as 
the cpu use is being chewed up by:

- reverbs
- delays
- vco2 oscillators
- lfos
- filters
- lots of table reads and writes

Iain


-------------------------------------------------------
SF.Net email is sponsored by:
Tame your development challenges with Apache's Geronimo App Server. Download
it for free - -and be entered to win a 42" plasma tv or your very own
Sony(tm)PSP.  Click here to play: http://sourceforge.net/geronimo.php
_______________________________________________
Csound-devel mailing list
Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net

Michael Gogins wrote:

> Can you do a test where you keep adding oscillators until it craps out? 
> Then we can see how many oscillators you can run with 32 bit, and how 
> many with 64 bit.

Probably about the same, as stacking simple oscillators does not
require high memory bandwidth, especially if all the oscillators
read the same table that fits into cache memory. Of course, running
1000 sine wave oscillators does not necessarily represent real
usage very well anyway.


-------------------------------------------------------
SF.Net email is sponsored by:
Tame your development challenges with Apache's Geronimo App Server. Download
it for free - -and be entered to win a 42" plasma tv or your very own
Sony(tm)PSP.  Click here to play: http://sourceforge.net/geronimo.php
_______________________________________________
Csound-devel mailing list
Csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net