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[Csnd-dev] Ubuntu on Windows

Date2016-03-31 10:45
FromStephen Kyne
Subject[Csnd-dev] Ubuntu on Windows
Hi all,

Not sure if anyone has been following Microsoft's BUILD 2016 event that's on but there has been some big announcements. Namely that Microsoft and Canonical (Ubuntu) have been working together to bring a Linux version that works natively in Windows. Sounds strange I know!


This will allow bash to work and Windows will be able to run native Ubuntu ELF files. According to the article above, the performance is near identical to Ubuntu, there is only a thin conversion layer. I'd imagine applications that aren't using many sys calls would be 1:1 though.

So it seems like you can use apt-get to install packages such as Csound and they'll work out the box. Sounds amazing really! 

There is a developer preview out before summer and I think the official release is during the summer at some period.
With Microsoft offering free updates to Windows 10 from 7 and 8, and XP not really supported any more. I'd imagine most Windows users will be on 10 relatively soon.

Possibly a big maintenance gain for cross platform Csound? I'd imagine the Visual Studio integration will improve a lot more too. Clang is already integrated so far.

Stephen

Date2016-03-31 10:49
FromFrancois PINOT
SubjectRe: [Csnd-dev] Ubuntu on Windows
A small step for man, a giant leap for Csounders!

2016-03-31 11:45 GMT+02:00 Stephen Kyne <stevek@outlook.ie>:
Hi all,

Not sure if anyone has been following Microsoft's BUILD 2016 event that's on but there has been some big announcements. Namely that Microsoft and Canonical (Ubuntu) have been working together to bring a Linux version that works natively in Windows. Sounds strange I know!


This will allow bash to work and Windows will be able to run native Ubuntu ELF files. According to the article above, the performance is near identical to Ubuntu, there is only a thin conversion layer. I'd imagine applications that aren't using many sys calls would be 1:1 though.

So it seems like you can use apt-get to install packages such as Csound and they'll work out the box. Sounds amazing really! 

There is a developer preview out before summer and I think the official release is during the summer at some period.
With Microsoft offering free updates to Windows 10 from 7 and 8, and XP not really supported any more. I'd imagine most Windows users will be on 10 relatively soon.

Possibly a big maintenance gain for cross platform Csound? I'd imagine the Visual Studio integration will improve a lot more too. Clang is already integrated so far.

Stephen


Date2016-03-31 10:51
FromVictor Lazzarini
SubjectRe: [Csnd-dev] Ubuntu on Windows
Once I joked that the next version of Windows would have a Linux kernel. This seems to be going that way,
even if through tortuous ways. Does it mean we could just run X instead of the Windows UX (UX is probably not
quite the word for it)?
========================
Dr Victor Lazzarini
Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies and Philosophy,
Maynooth University,
Maynooth, Co Kildare, Ireland
Tel: 00 353 7086936
Fax: 00 353 1 7086952 

> On 31 Mar 2016, at 10:45, Stephen Kyne  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> Not sure if anyone has been following Microsoft's BUILD 2016 event that's on but there has been some big announcements. Namely that Microsoft and Canonical (Ubuntu) have been working together to bring a Linux version that works natively in Windows. Sounds strange I know!
> 
> http://blog.dustinkirkland.com/2016/03/ubuntu-on-windows.html?m=1
> 
> This will allow bash to work and Windows will be able to run native Ubuntu ELF files. According to the article above, the performance is near identical to Ubuntu, there is only a thin conversion layer. I'd imagine applications that aren't using many sys calls would be 1:1 though.
> 
> So it seems like you can use apt-get to install packages such as Csound and they'll work out the box. Sounds amazing really! 
> 
> There is a developer preview out before summer and I think the official release is during the summer at some period.
> With Microsoft offering free updates to Windows 10 from 7 and 8, and XP not really supported any more. I'd imagine most Windows users will be on 10 relatively soon.
> 
> Possibly a big maintenance gain for cross platform Csound? I'd imagine the Visual Studio integration will improve a lot more too. Clang is already integrated so far.
> 

Date2016-03-31 10:58
FromOeyvind Brandtsegg
SubjectRe: [Csnd-dev] Ubuntu on Windows
Am I right in suspecting that we still will need to go through windows
drivers for the audio hardware?

2016-03-31 11:51 GMT+02:00 Victor Lazzarini :
> Once I joked that the next version of Windows would have a Linux kernel. This seems to be going that way,
> even if through tortuous ways. Does it mean we could just run X instead of the Windows UX (UX is probably not
> quite the word for it)?
> ========================
> Dr Victor Lazzarini
> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies and Philosophy,
> Maynooth University,
> Maynooth, Co Kildare, Ireland
> Tel: 00 353 7086936
> Fax: 00 353 1 7086952
>
>> On 31 Mar 2016, at 10:45, Stephen Kyne  wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Not sure if anyone has been following Microsoft's BUILD 2016 event that's on but there has been some big announcements. Namely that Microsoft and Canonical (Ubuntu) have been working together to bring a Linux version that works natively in Windows. Sounds strange I know!
>>
>> http://blog.dustinkirkland.com/2016/03/ubuntu-on-windows.html?m=1
>>
>> This will allow bash to work and Windows will be able to run native Ubuntu ELF files. According to the article above, the performance is near identical to Ubuntu, there is only a thin conversion layer. I'd imagine applications that aren't using many sys calls would be 1:1 though.
>>
>> So it seems like you can use apt-get to install packages such as Csound and they'll work out the box. Sounds amazing really!
>>
>> There is a developer preview out before summer and I think the official release is during the summer at some period.
>> With Microsoft offering free updates to Windows 10 from 7 and 8, and XP not really supported any more. I'd imagine most Windows users will be on 10 relatively soon.
>>
>> Possibly a big maintenance gain for cross platform Csound? I'd imagine the Visual Studio integration will improve a lot more too. Clang is already integrated so far.
>>
>> Stephen



-- 

Oeyvind Brandtsegg
Professor of Music Technology
NTNU
7491 Trondheim
Norway
Cell: +47 92 203 205

http://www.partikkelaudio.com/
http://soundcloud.com/brandtsegg
http://flyndresang.no/

Date2016-03-31 11:04
FromStephen Kyne
SubjectRe: [Csnd-dev] Ubuntu on Windows
It's not really clear whether that's supported yet. I'd imagine not though. They probably want the look and feel to remain as much like Windows as possible.
There are still a lot of questions with regards how this all works. I'd say there will be some caveats.

> Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2016 10:51:41 +0100
> From: Victor.Lazzarini@NUIM.IE
> Subject: Re: [Csnd-dev] Ubuntu on Windows
> To: CSOUND-DEV@LISTSERV.HEANET.IE
>
> Once I joked that the next version of Windows would have a Linux kernel. This seems to be going that way,
> even if through tortuous ways. Does it mean we could just run X instead of the Windows UX (UX is probably not
> quite the word for it)?
> ========================
> Dr Victor Lazzarini
> Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies and Philosophy,
> Maynooth University,
> Maynooth, Co Kildare, Ireland
> Tel: 00 353 7086936
> Fax: 00 353 1 7086952
>
> > On 31 Mar 2016, at 10:45, Stephen Kyne <stevek@OUTLOOK.IE> wrote:
> >
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Not sure if anyone has been following Microsoft's BUILD 2016 event that's on but there has been some big announcements. Namely that Microsoft and Canonical (Ubuntu) have been working together to bring a Linux version that works natively in Windows. Sounds strange I know!
> >
> > http://blog.dustinkirkland.com/2016/03/ubuntu-on-windows.html?m=1
> >
> > This will allow bash to work and Windows will be able to run native Ubuntu ELF files. According to the article above, the performance is near identical to Ubuntu, there is only a thin conversion layer. I'd imagine applications that aren't using many sys calls would be 1:1 though.
> >
> > So it seems like you can use apt-get to install packages such as Csound and they'll work out the box. Sounds amazing really!
> >
> > There is a developer preview out before summer and I think the official release is during the summer at some period.
> > With Microsoft offering free updates to Windows 10 from 7 and 8, and XP not really supported any more. I'd imagine most Windows users will be on 10 relatively soon.
> >
> > Possibly a big maintenance gain for cross platform Csound? I'd imagine the Visual Studio integration will improve a lot more too. Clang is already integrated so far.
> >
> > Stephen

Date2016-03-31 11:36
FromStephen Kyne
SubjectRe: [Csnd-dev] Ubuntu on Windows
Right, all the drivers are still Windows based.

> Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2016 11:58:48 +0200
> From: oyvind.brandtsegg@NTNU.NO
> Subject: Re: [Csnd-dev] Ubuntu on Windows
> To: CSOUND-DEV@LISTSERV.HEANET.IE
>
> Am I right in suspecting that we still will need to go through windows
> drivers for the audio hardware?
>
> 2016-03-31 11:51 GMT+02:00 Victor Lazzarini <Victor.Lazzarini@nuim.ie>:
> > Once I joked that the next version of Windows would have a Linux kernel. This seems to be going that way,
> > even if through tortuous ways. Does it mean we could just run X instead of the Windows UX (UX is probably not
> > quite the word for it)?
> > ========================
> > Dr Victor Lazzarini
> > Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies and Philosophy,
> > Maynooth University,
> > Maynooth, Co Kildare, Ireland
> > Tel: 00 353 7086936
> > Fax: 00 353 1 7086952
> >
> >> On 31 Mar 2016, at 10:45, Stephen Kyne <stevek@OUTLOOK.IE> wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi all,
> >>
> >> Not sure if anyone has been following Microsoft's BUILD 2016 event that's on but there has been some big announcements. Namely that Microsoft and Canonical (Ubuntu) have been working together to bring a Linux version that works natively in Windows. Sounds strange I know!
> >>
> >> http://blog.dustinkirkland.com/2016/03/ubuntu-on-windows.html?m=1
> >>
> >> This will allow bash to work and Windows will be able to run native Ubuntu ELF files. According to the article above, the performance is near identical to Ubuntu, there is only a thin conversion layer. I'd imagine applications that aren't using many sys calls would be 1:1 though.
> >>
> >> So it seems like you can use apt-get to install packages such as Csound and they'll work out the box. Sounds amazing really!
> >>
> >> There is a developer preview out before summer and I think the official release is during the summer at some period.
> >> With Microsoft offering free updates to Windows 10 from 7 and 8, and XP not really supported any more. I'd imagine most Windows users will be on 10 relatively soon.
> >>
> >> Possibly a big maintenance gain for cross platform Csound? I'd imagine the Visual Studio integration will improve a lot more too. Clang is already integrated so far.
> >>
> >> Stephen
>
>
>
> --
>
> Oeyvind Brandtsegg
> Professor of Music Technology
> NTNU
> 7491 Trondheim
> Norway
> Cell: +47 92 203 205
>
> http://www.partikkelaudio.com/
> http://soundcloud.com/brandtsegg
> http://flyndresang.no/
> http://soundcloud.com/t-emp

Date2016-03-31 13:34
FromFelipe Sateler
SubjectRe: [Csnd-dev] Ubuntu on Windows
This is more akin to WINE than to a VM. That is, you can run apps (although I don't think you can graphical apps ATM), but it doesn't replace the underlying system. So the new subsystem translates linux syscalls into windows syscalls. A csound running in this mode would likely think it is talking to an alsa device (but not sure if that is really supported now), even if the real driver is a windows one.

On 31 March 2016 at 07:36, Stephen Kyne <stevek@outlook.ie> wrote:
Right, all the drivers are still Windows based.

> Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2016 11:58:48 +0200
> From: oyvind.brandtsegg@NTNU.NO
> Subject: Re: [Csnd-dev] Ubuntu on Windows
> To: CSOUND-DEV@LISTSERV.HEANET.IE
>
> Am I right in suspecting that we still will need to go through windows
> drivers for the audio hardware?
>
> 2016-03-31 11:51 GMT+02:00 Victor Lazzarini <Victor.Lazzarini@nuim.ie>:
> > Once I joked that the next version of Windows would have a Linux kernel. This seems to be going that way,
> > even if through tortuous ways. Does it mean we could just run X instead of the Windows UX (UX is probably not
> > quite the word for it)?
> > ========================
> > Dr Victor Lazzarini
> > Dean of Arts, Celtic Studies and Philosophy,
> > Maynooth University,
> > Maynooth, Co Kildare, Ireland
> > Tel: 00 353 7086936
> > Fax: 00 353 1 7086952
> >
> >> On 31 Mar 2016, at 10:45, Stephen Kyne <stevek@OUTLOOK.IE> wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi all,
> >>
> >> Not sure if anyone has been following Microsoft's BUILD 2016 event that's on but there has been some big announcements. Namely that Microsoft and Canonical (Ubuntu) have been working together to bring a Linux version that works natively in Windows. Sounds strange I know!
> >>
> >> http://blog.dustinkirkland.com/2016/03/ubuntu-on-windows.html?m=1
> >>
> >> This will allow bash to work and Windows will be able to run native Ubuntu ELF files. According to the article above, the performance is near identical to Ubuntu, there is only a thin conversion layer. I'd imagine applications that aren't using many sys calls would be 1:1 though.
> >>
> >> So it seems like you can use apt-get to install packages such as Csound and they'll work out the box. Sounds amazing really!
> >>
> >> There is a developer preview out before summer and I think the official release is during the summer at some period.
> >> With Microsoft offering free updates to Windows 10 from 7 and 8, and XP not really supported any more. I'd imagine most Windows users will be on 10 relatively soon.
> >>
> >> Possibly a big maintenance gain for cross platform Csound? I'd imagine the Visual Studio integration will improve a lot more too. Clang is already integrated so far.
> >>
> >> Stephen
>
>
>
> --
>
> Oeyvind Brandtsegg
> Professor of Music Technology
> NTNU
> 7491 Trondheim
> Norway
> Cell: +47 92 203 205
>
> http://www.partikkelaudio.com/
> http://soundcloud.com/brandtsegg
> http://flyndresang.no/
> http://soundcloud.com/t-emp



--

Saludos,
Felipe Sateler