I have a very limited amount of time to do this kind of thing. Please understand, and I intend no offense, I simply do not have time to please everyone. Therefore, I try to make sure that the installer contains everything most users might need, even if it contains some things that some users do not need or do not want.

My model for software installation is Python. You run the installer, and everything you need is right there including the documentation and an effective tutorial. There is only one thing the user needs to know to get started (at least, on Windows) -- 'get the installer.' I understand that the installer is large, although in truth I have seen bigger ones on SourceForge.

In my view, Csound, as a complex piece of software that is also a programming language, genuinely requires a fairly comprehensive tutorial introduction. When and if someone produces a better tutorial (i.e. one that covers ALL steps required to really get started for various purposes) I will use that one instead for the installers.

If you feel very strongly about this, please become a developer and produce a version of the installer that has the features that you believe should be in there. Then users will have a choice. If you do that, please also put up on the project page an explanation of what each version is for.

Equally, please feel free to write a better tutorial, or another tutorial covering different ground, become a Csound developer, and put it into Csound CVS. The reason my tutorial is in there is because, as a Csound developer, I reviewed the existing tutorials, found they did not offer enough information to get started with the main features of Csound 5, wrote a new one, and put it in CVS, not because I took other ones out. If there were a better tutorial in CVS, that one would go into the installers and the present one might well go into the 'attic.'

Regards,
Mike

-----Original Message-----
>From: Jonathan Murphy 
>Sent: Mar 12, 2007 8:23 AM
>To: csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
>Subject: [Cs-dev] Attn: Michael Gogins - please move tutorial
>
>Hi Mike,
>
>Others have requested this, so I know that I'm not alone in finding it
>annoying. Could you please move the tutorial? Whilst I appreciate the
>effort that went into creating it, it's no more an essential part of
>Csound than any other tutorial (none of which are in CVS), and it
>takes a long time to download.
>
>Jonathan.
>
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I can see both sides of this. Would it be difficult in CVS to have two
possible checkouts, minimal and full? I know this approach is used a lot
for other largish software.

Just a thought,
Iain


On Mon, 2007-12-03 at 10:35 -0400, Michael Gogins wrote:
> I have a very limited amount of time to do this kind of thing. Please understand, and I intend no offense, I simply do not have time to please everyone. Therefore, I try to make sure that the installer contains everything most users might need, even if it contains some things that some users do not need or do not want.
> 
> My model for software installation is Python. You run the installer, and everything you need is right there including the documentation and an effective tutorial. There is only one thing the user needs to know to get started (at least, on Windows) -- 'get the installer.' I understand that the installer is large, although in truth I have seen bigger ones on SourceForge.
> 
> In my view, Csound, as a complex piece of software that is also a programming language, genuinely requires a fairly comprehensive tutorial introduction. When and if someone produces a better tutorial (i.e. one that covers ALL steps required to really get started for various purposes) I will use that one instead for the installers.
> 
> If you feel very strongly about this, please become a developer and produce a version of the installer that has the features that you believe should be in there. Then users will have a choice. If you do that, please also put up on the project page an explanation of what each version is for.
> 
> Equally, please feel free to write a better tutorial, or another tutorial covering different ground, become a Csound developer, and put it into Csound CVS. The reason my tutorial is in there is because, as a Csound developer, I reviewed the existing tutorials, found they did not offer enough information to get started with the main features of Csound 5, wrote a new one, and put it in CVS, not because I took other ones out. If there were a better tutorial in CVS, that one would go into the installers and the present one might well go into the 'attic.'
> 
> Regards,
> Mike
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Jonathan Murphy 
> >Sent: Mar 12, 2007 8:23 AM
> >To: csound-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> >Subject: [Cs-dev] Attn: Michael Gogins - please move tutorial
> >
> >Hi Mike,
> >
> >Others have requested this, so I know that I'm not alone in finding it
> >annoying. Could you please move the tutorial? Whilst I appreciate the
> >effort that went into creating it, it's no more an essential part of
> >Csound than any other tutorial (none of which are in CVS), and it
> >takes a long time to download.
> >
> >Jonathan.
> >
> >-------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
> >Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your
> >opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys-and earn cash
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> >_______________________________________________
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> >https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/csound-devel
> 
> 
> 
> 
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